Can you include possible future civil suits

[jktrading]

I'm asking because I sell on Amazon and had this really mean spirited person buy something from me. He emailed me that Amazon got the wrong address and to send it to a different one. I tried calling him, and boy, me and him did not get along.

Anyway, he wound up hanging up on me when I was trying to tell him that Amazon gave me one address and that is all I can ship to. His initial email to me was that I "screwed up" by sending to a wrong address. It wasn't wrong to me because that's the one I got from Amazon.

I requested an intercept from UPS to send it back to me because he said it was wrong and I couldn't send to another address, or risk Amazon giving me a hard time.

He checked the tracking info and emailed me that if I requested it sent back to me, that he was going to sue me for breach of contract, and damages because his business is relying on the merchandise, and his time. Me and him are so different personality wise, I couldn't believe someone can be like him.

I will of course refund him, when I get the item back as UPS does not assure it will be successfully intercepted.

Sorry for the long story, I suppose I am venting.

Can I include a private person that MAY sue me in my chap 7? He seemed to be a smart person, not like an idiot, and he might just want to prove a point because he seems like that type of person.

However, he is in Tennessee and Virginia (says he has 2 homes) and I am in California. I wouldn't think he would sue me for a $250 item that I will be refunding in full when I get it back, but nowadays after I heard of the 1 million dollar law suit to a cleaner company for losing a pair of pants, you never know.

If I can include a possible future civil suit in my Chap 7, I am sure he would get my info that he may not have through Amazon. At present, he has my name, and phone number, so he will know what state I am in. I am not listed in the book.

This sucks, I wonder if he will sue me because he's an ass, just like he sounded on the phone. I told him life happens, and he didn't like that. I said take a deep breath, and he didn't like that either. I was friendly but probably dismissive because, what's the big deal? A $250 electronics item.

[JRScott]

Yes you can list him as a possible debtor even though you dispute it and he'd receive a notice like everyone else.

[Flamingo]

How can you include an amount for a "possible" suit for an event that has not yet even occurred? All you can do at this time is mention your fear to your attorney in the event something should occur. You will just have to do the refund as promised and see what goes from there and what occurred here is just a normal business shipping event. You are just upset because you probably just came across the King of the Type A Personalities/Perfectionists. Yes, they are out there and sometimes in grand form. Also, if a suit does arise, you could add Amazon as a third party since they provided the shipping address to you; you would have to check your agreement to sell with Amazon to see how/if they protect themselves from that.

[jktrading]

How can you include an amount for a "possible" suit for an event that has not yet even occurred? All you can do at this time is mention your fear to your attorney in the event something should occur. You will just have to do the refund as promised and see what goes from there and what occurred here is just a normal business shipping event. You are just upset because you probably just came across the King of the Type A Personalities/Perfectionists. Yes, they are out there and sometimes in grand form. Also, if a suit does arise, you could add Amazon as a third party since they provided the shipping address to you; you would have to check your agreement to sell with Amazon to see how/if they protect themselves from that.

After thinking about this overnight, I've decided to ignore him. I put in the request to get the item back, and if I do, I will refund every cent. UPS says it's not guaranteed that they will be able to return to me, so it could go through.

Amazon has the most uptight individuals. I also sell on ebay for over 7 years, and have never had the issues that I've had with a few at Amazon in the past year.

I'll ask my attorney about it when I go in to sign. I'm not sure if it would be best to add the jerk to my chap 7 list or not. I don't see the point in further contact with him, and deactivated that email account, so he can get the bouncer-rooney.

If I have to go to court over a $250 item from a guy in Tennessee, and California for me, I would hope I could just explain my side to the Judge, and get a dismissal. From what I understand, he would have to come here to my state. Oh well, life happens.

[soleprop]

you wouldn't be including a possible suit, you'd be including this person as a debtor on one of your schedules and marking the amount considered owed 'disputed.' he wouldn't be able to file a suit in the future because the perceived debt was discharged in your bk.

anyway good luck with whatever you choose ;)

[jktrading]

you wouldn't be including a possible suit, you'd be including this person as a debtor on one of your schedules and marking the amount considered owed 'disputed.' he wouldn't be able to file a suit in the future because the perceived debt was discharged in your bk.

anyway good luck with whatever you choose ;)

That sounds good. Yes, I would do that. Thanks for the info.

[AngelinaCatHub]

Hate to say it JK, but there are many AH’s out there. This could not go to Court other than small claims. I doubt that the jerk will go to that trouble. Make sure you give him his money back with a green card (certified) and forget it. It is not worth thinking about. He is playing mind games. ‘Hub

[jktrading]

Hate to say it JK, but there are many AH’s out there. This could not go to Court other than small claims. I doubt that the jerk will go to that trouble. Make sure you give him his money back with a green card (certified) and forget it. It is not worth thinking about. He is playing mind games. ‘Hub

Hey cat, my thoughts exactly. He would have to come here to California from Tennessee. Here's my last email from him just for fun:

"In checking the continuing progress of the package at UPS TRACKING I see that YOU have asked for the package to be returned to you. If that is accurate you can count on my filing a civil lawsuit against you. You might want to contact me IMMEDIATELY if you have delayed my shipment in any way. I ordered an item and you are the vendor who ACCEPTED the order and placed a payment charge against my credit card. That payment charge has been posted to my credit card account. That means I placed an order, you accepted it and I paid you for it...THAT IS A LEGAL CONTRACT. If you have recalled my package and delayed the progress of the shipment you WILL BE SUED for breach of contract AND the damages will include the cost of the player and the cost of the lost time involved in my company's project which depends on a WORKING..."

The only reason this bothers me a little is that, "any one can sue any one for any thing." I remember hearing about a judge suing a dry cleaners for 54 million over losing his pants.

Thanks for the advice and support. When I do the refund, it's electronic and goes back to his payment method. I would of course, make a copy that completed refund.

Hey, my 100th post...cool.

[liz417]

Hey cat, my thoughts exactly. He would have to come here to California from Tennessee. Here's my last email from him just for fun:

"In checking the continuing progress of the package at UPS TRACKING I see that YOU have asked for the package to be returned to you. If that is accurate you can count on my filing a civil lawsuit against you. You might want to contact me IMMEDIATELY if you have delayed my shipment in any way. I ordered an item and you are the vendor who ACCEPTED the order and placed a payment charge against my credit card. That payment charge has been posted to my credit card account. That means I placed an order, you accepted it and I paid you for it...THAT IS A LEGAL CONTRACT. If you have recalled my package and delayed the progress of the shipment you WILL BE SUED for breach of contract AND the damages will include the cost of the player and the cost of the lost time involved in my company's project which depends on a WORKING..."

The only reason this bothers me a little is that, "any one can sue any one for any thing." I remember hearing about a judge suing a dry cleaners for 54 million over losing his pants.

Thanks for the advice and support. When I do the refund, it's electronic and goes back to his payment method. I would of course, make a copy that completed refund.

Hey, my 100th post...cool.

Gee, he sounds like a nut.....sorry.

[AngelinaCatHub]

JK,. That AH has a screw loose. If his whole business relied on some kind of recorder or whatever you sold him, he should have gone to a vendor for new. He is blowing smoke and is irrational. Did you sell it on eBay? If you are electronically refunding him, I would still send him a paper receipt green carded. As you say, the “crime” was committed in your state and county so he would have to file there I am sure. Life is too short to sweat the small stuff. ‘Hub

[jktrading]

Hub, I sold it on Amazon. Yes I basically told him the same thing about life as you, and to take a deep breath with a smile in my voice. I thought I was being supportive to him, but he certainly didn't take it that way. In retrospect, I shouldn't have called him. He was too serious of an individual, and I should have known that by his first email.

Check out the first email he sent me that got all this started:

"Just reviewed the tracking number you sent for my recently ordered...

You shipped it to the wrong address. I just looked at the ORIGINAL ORDER as placed through ... and it clearly shows the shipping address as MY TENNESSEE HOME....NOT MY ... VA HOME!!!!

You need to contact UPS IMMEDIATELY and reroute this package to the CORRECT ADDRESS. It MUST still arrive on its original arrival date of ... and if you CALL UPS IMMEDIATELY and reroute the package before it gets beyond its next location you should be able to keep its delivery date for ...

IF UPS cannot change the address and STILL DELIVER ON ... then you need to change the delivery address to my SISTERS ADDRESS which is: ...... I will be leaving my Tennessee home on the morning of ... and will not be back for a month so the package MUST ARRIVE AT THE ADDRESS I ORIGINALLY SPECIFIED BY .... The original shipping address, that you screwed up by shipping to ... VA was: ...
SEND ME AN EMAIL OR CALL ME AT ... TO LET ME KNOW WHAT IS BEING DONE TO CORRECT THIS PROBLEM. Thanks"

Atleast he said "Thanks" at the bottom, eh? Upon checking, I sent it to the only addy that was associated with the order.

[AngelinaCatHub]

This person in truly a jerk. It would be my guess as he has done this before. Google the word Sociopath, you will see this man. It isn’t the item he purchased, it is the entertainment factor your reaction to him has been.

You certainly were not liable for referring UPS to several other places. If you do give him money back the more I think of it, you should deduct the actual shipping costs as it seems it is his fault. By all means print a hard copy of his email and any other communications. Get the email properties. Do you know how to do that. Right click on his email and go to properties then to details it will be a text document, and print it.

Again, I would not worry as this man is a sicko. ‘Hub

[cool33097]

Soory you are going thru this. I would not worry. I deal with people like this all the time and if you notice, he is demanding and very repetitive. How long ago was the charge to his cc done? He sounds desperate like a stolen cc. He could also call his cc and dispute. Why isn't he doing that?
Didi you try to google him?
Keep us posted.

[jktrading]

Soory you are going thru this. I would not worry. I deal with people like this all the time and if you notice, he is demanding and very repetitive. How long ago was the charge to his cc done? He sounds desperate like a stolen cc. He could also call his cc and dispute. Why isn't he doing that?
Didi you try to google him?
Keep us posted.

He ordered it on Oct 29, and I shipped it on the 31st. I called him with the phone number he emailed me with, and he has my full name and phone number as well. He doesn't have my address, but with my full name and phone number now-a-days, I'm sure he could get it even though I am non published.

After the email fiasco yesterday, my last response was that I am waiting to see if UPS returns it to me before I refund him. I deactivated my email address he has, so if he sends me more "I am going to get you" emails, they'll go bouncee, bouncee right back to him.

The package is in Tennessee right now, with a notation "return to shipper" in the system. UPS said there's no guarantee I'll get it back, so I'm not refunding yet.

Amazon has their own system for disputing, and I don't believe enough time has passed for him to complain to Amazon. As soon as I get it back, I'll refund. He could very well dispute through his CC company at any time, I'm sure.

I didn't get anything with Google on him. People search had his name and the same address that I have it in Tennessee, with 5 or more other addresses on file in that region of the US. It also has his age at 58.

There could be a fraud aspect, as he is very demanding about the time. He used "standard" shipping which I believe Amazon says can take up to 3 weeks to arrive, and my shipping service had it coming to him in 1 week. Yet, again, he is very set on getting this on or before Nov 6, and he will "be gone for a month" after that date. That did make me wonder actually.

[jktrading]

Soory you are going thru this. I would not worry. I deal with people like this all the time and if you notice, he is demanding and very repetitive. How long ago was the charge to his cc done? He sounds desperate like a stolen cc. He could also call his cc and dispute. Why isn't he doing that?
Didi you try to google him?
Keep us posted.

Hey cool, you know what?, I think you may be right about something fishy going on. Duh, why didn't I see it all earlier? After drafting an email to Amazon explaining what was happening, it really sounded fraudulent as I was typing. Here's what I wrote Amazon in the final draft:

"Please describe the issue:

Hello Amazon, I suspect the following buyer with order number (xxxx) to be attempting fraud.

I have received an email from the buyer, attempting to get me to ship to a different address, which is; Ms. xxxxx

He further attempted in the email to convince me that I had shipped to an incorrect address, and to ship to his correct address, and that Amazon made a mistake.

The buyer made numerous rude demands in that I needed to call UPS immediately and re-route his package so there was no delay in the delivery date. He said that if he didn't get it by November 6, that on November 7 he would be going to his other home for a month and wouldn't be able to retrieve it. He said I needed to do this right away before UPS wouldn't be able to do it in time.

When I called the buyer at the phone number he provided (xxx-xxx-xxxx), and I didn't do what he wanted about re-routing the shipment, he got angry. He kept saying that he thought I should know Amazon made a mistake. He hung up on me after I said I couldn't re-route the package, and tried to explain that I would take care of him.

I called Amazon myself and confirmed that the shipping info was correct, and explained how angry the buyer was, and how he said he spoke to Amazon himself for an hour on the phone. The Amazon representative could not confirm this.

While I was on the phone with the buyer, he said that Amazon and himself got UPS to re-route the package to his correct address. When checking with UPS, no such action had happened.

Thinking this was a fraud attempt, I instructed UPS to return the package to me. UPS could not guarantee that I would get it back, but would try.

Shorty after I did that, the buyer emailed me that he was watching the tracking, and what I was attempting to do was a breach of contract, and that he was going to sue me in civil court if I didn't fix this right away. I emailed him that I could not send to a different address, and I did not want the package delivered incorrectly, which is why I asked UPS to return it to me.

My phone number is xxx-xxx-xxxx if you have any questions. I am not contacting the buyer directly anymore, and advised him to go through Amazon. The UPS tracking number of the package is: 1Zxxxxxxx

When or if I get the package returned to me, I intend to fully refund the buyer. UPS said there was no guarantee they could intercept it, so I am waiting to see what happens.

I am not sure what will happen if the package is delivered. This is my side of why I am attempting to retrieve my package and cancel this possible fraudulent activity before he gets my merchandise.

Again, please contact me by phone if you have any questions.

Thanks,
xxx
xxx xxx xxxx"

When I typed it all out as it happened in my first draft, I had an epiphany, and did that Homer Simpson thing, "Doh!"

Oh well, I don't know, but here I am. Who knows, Thanks to all.