Divorce Advice Needed: Need help regarding "ownership" of an item pre-divorce

[Dirk Squarejaw]

Problem #1I guess the question there is that even though he brought pretty much everything they own into the marriage, could the judge split their belongings? BTW, this is in Indiana.

Problem #2: This is what's currently eating away at him

[Flamingo]

First of all from what you are describing, has anyone ever suggested your sister-in-law shows symptoms of possibly being bi-polar? Could be a big part of all the problems you are describing. Secondly, as to the property obtained during the marriage, depending on state laws, it might be worthwhile for your brother to have a consultation with a divorce attorney so there are no guessing games as to how he should handle his possibly future ex-wife and property distribution/settlement.

[Dirk Squarejaw]

First of all from what you are describing, has anyone ever suggested your sister-in-law shows symptoms of possibly being bi-polar? Could be a big part of all the problems you are describing. Secondly, as to the property obtained during the marriage, depending on state laws, it might be worthwhile for your brother to have a consultation with a divorce attorney so there are no guessing games as to how he should handle his possibly future ex-wife and property distribution/settlement.

Yes, she was diagnosed as bi-polar a couple years ago. However, due to her upbringing (and I will try to stay off my soapbox to not offend anyone), she refuses to continue medical treatment for more than about 3 days and would rather fight it off by eating wild roots or a bucket of dried prunes. Her father eats garlic by the clove and flushes himself out with carrot enemas to fight off his lung cancer. I kid you not.

I think the positive thing for him is that the only "property" obtained during marriage are the two motorcycles which are both in his name as far as titles, financing, etc. and a handful of wedding gifts.

The bigger stuff like his bedroom suit and appliances are all things that were left to him by my grandmother whose death predated their marriage or hand-me-downs from my parents. His car has been paid off since before their marriage. I think my parents are going to help him out with a lawyer so that is probably a good thing since this isn't going to be an easy one for him like mine was.

[DisneyGirl]

Getting answers from the lawyer is the way to go on this. But I don't believe Indiana is a community property state and if I'm correct about that, he'll have that on his side.

I wish him luck and that it goes smoothly for him.

[gymbo]

hi

I know this is a serious topic but this..
"... flushes himself out with carrot enemas to fight off his lung cancer..."
totally cracked me up.

So funny.
Good luck with your brother

[FreshLikeADaisy]

Gymbo, me too. Seems like the cure would be worse than the disease, carrots and whatnot, but what do I know?

Dirk, you've probably read enough of my posts to know I walk on the right side of the law, but I have to tell you that honestly, I would indeed "repo" the bike and keep it in a storage unit (preferably rented by a relative) until everything is said and done. There really is no lesser action that will guarantee it stays in good shape in the meantime, while they fight it out in the divorce. He bought the bike and it is titled in his name; it shouldn't be a problem getting a set of replacement keys from the dealer. He may have to show the title or registration and some ID, but it's not a big deal.

There's a secondary gain to your brother "repo"-ing the bike as well: lack of transportation tends to effectively hamper any bad behavior that requires getting a ride somewhere to do it. Not that she can't or won't enlist others to assist her, but that takes a little more work on her part and tends to slow things down.

That, and he *really* needs to start recording his interactions with her. I have known people with bipolar disease, BPD and the like who entered into divorces that literally never ended: it just goes on and on and on because the conflict fuels their disease, and their disease fuels the conflict. That she would lie about it being a gift, and fully believe even as she lies that "truth and justice will prevail!" to give her what she wants, is actually just a foretaste of what she can probably crank out. People like this honestly believe that anything and everything they do is justified by the injustice done to them, whatever that happens to be at that particular minute. It changes regularly.

He would be unwise to report it stolen; as soon as the cops heard that she is his wife, they are not going to appreciate it. But your brother could just as easily produce title to a local repo man, and for a fee have the repo man go get the bike. It also should not be that hard to figure out where she keeps the bike after work if she lives in an urban area; if she ever goes out for a drink later in the evening it'll be sitting right outside the watering hole and not require a repo man at all. Just keep in mind that if/when he gets the bike back, he really really really needs to keep it in a storage unit and NOT at a private home, because that will be the first place she comes and you don't want to rub it in her nose: that will just crank up the drama for no good reason and make that home her target for bad behavior. Store it and keep it stored until all is said and done. He could even sell it if he felt so inclined.

Hope this helps!!! I wish him the best of luck... he's gonna need it.

[Dirk Squarejaw]

Thanks, FreshLikeADaisy. I will definitely pass on the info about keeping documention/recordings of what goes on. Even her brother (who fell far from the tree) is backing my brother. He called my brother up the other day and told him that he's on his side and that his sister has been a compulsive liar since she was knee-high.

[justplaintired]

I am not positive of this dirk but when I was divorced it was a 10 yr period before anything became "community" property, in other words, if that bike is titled to your brother and they have only been married 13 months, your brother has every right legally to repo the bike I am in central Indiana too.

And if I was him, I'd get it back asap and hide it somewhere save. Somewhere she can't find it so she can't damage it somehow. It seems like in her state of mind, that would be my concern. So sneak over after she has rode it to work, call the police, take the title and get the bike back. Matter of fact, call the police tell them the story and see if they won't help get it back, sometimes I know they won't get involved without a court order. So unless this women has proof he "gifted" it to her, which I doubt she does, she is SOL. Can you kick start the bike or is it new? If you can't just change the ignition and get a new key, but keep that bike hid until she calms down or moves on down the road.

[Dirk Squarejaw]

I am not positive of this dirk but when I was divorced it was a 10 yr period before anything became "community" property, in other words, if that bike is titled to your brother and they have only been married 13 months, your brother has every right legally to repo the bike I am in central Indiana too.

And if I was him, I'd get it back asap and hide it somewhere save. Somewhere she can't find it so she can't damage it somehow. It seems like in her state of mind, that would be my concern. So sneak over after she has rode it to work, call the police, take the title and get the bike back. Matter of fact, call the police tell them the story and see if they won't help get it back, sometimes I know they won't get involved without a court order. So unless this women has proof he "gifted" it to her, which I doubt she does, she is SOL. Can you kick start the bike or is it new? If you can't just change the ignition and get a new key, but keep that bike hid until she calms down or moves on down the road.

He has a couple options open for storage. My parents have a self-storage unit, but it may end up being filled up with his furniture. Otherwise, he has a couple friends with garages that are very trust-worthy and could store it until further notice. BTW, its a 2008 model, no kickstart but changing the the ignition switch should be a cinch.

[justplaintired]

He has a couple options open for storage. My parents have a self-storage unit, but it may end up being filled up with his furniture. Otherwise, he has a couple friends with garages that are very trust-worthy and could store it until further notice. BTW, its a 2008 model, no kickstart but changing the the ignition switch should be a cinch.

Sounds like you have the problem almost solved. Get the bike back, she doesn't sound like she stable enough right now to be riding anyway. I think if he's filing on the contents of the storage unit, it would be wiser to store it at a friends house, just make sure everyone keeps quiet on where it's at. I would not tell to many people. My ex had a crazy girlfriend when we were divorcing and I know how nuts things get when someone has "mental issues".( I am not saying that people who have mental issues are bad, it's just personally I think if your having to deal with someone like that, it's best to always watch your back) Always be a step ahead of her, she is liable to be "extra nuts" when he takes that bike back!

Good luck and let us know how this goes, I am anxious to hear!

[Dirk Squarejaw]

New Question: What would be the safest way for him, his credit, etc. to let her have it in the divorce.

I know, big change but I can see his reasoning. He is now thinking about letting her have it in the divorce, but making sure that his lawyer includes some sort of clause stating that she has xx days to refinance or pay it off in full. I know if she doesn't pay in a case like that, contempt charges can be filed, but what happens to the bike? Does she retain it even though shes not following through or would it go back to my brother?

This is a new option he is thinking about because she has already dropped the bike once or twice and although it has suffered very minor cosmetic damage on top of the bike already being upside down. Its an idea, but I think it would only end badly knowing that she has a habit of walking away from things and not paying for them (mostly apt. leases when she'd drop out of school and she feels that contracts don't apply to her).

[justplaintired]

Is your brother filing BK? If not then, I would still get that bike back and let her get the financing and then she takes the bike. If not in my experience in my divorce, an order for my ex to pay the bills and make sure things were taken out of my name was pretty much useless. He dumped them on me anyway. I was the one getting those dreaded collection calls, not him, they claimed they couldn't find him?! even after I gave them his address and phone number?! He never did take those bills out of my name and after 9 long years he finally got them paid, with my help!

So your brother could easily end up hounded over this bike for years to come. Is his soon to be ex capable of getting a loan in her name? Does she have the credit to do it? Will anyone loan her the amount needed to get your brother out of this loan? He really needs to get this taken care of quickly, before she ruins his credit or worse ruins this bike. Either way, it's him it will hurt financial, not her.

Frankly I still think repoing the bike until she has financing is his best bet. If it's a Harley I am sure he has financed quite a bit and it would be a shame for him to end up filing BK down the road over something like this, if he isn't already filing. Harley's unfortunately right now don't have as much value as they did, even this economy is hurting them. Such a shame!