Question Advice/Opinions (long sorry)

[701mike]

I have been reading through the thread sand am a little overwhelmed by all the info. Let me give my situation.

In 2008 I bought a new car. A couple months later my mother announced she was retiring at 73. I talked to my boss about a work at home job and he was certain they could find one for me. The plan was for me to move back across country to help my mom get settled then move back home in a year. Around the time to move my boss told me he could not get me a WAH job and I would either have to give notice or stay. It put me in a position I had no choice but to give notice, my mother had already paid out the move costs. I had no 401k but I had a cash balance retirement I could get by on until I found work.

Right after we moved the local plant went through it's biggest lay offs ever, so no jobs. I was able to pick up side jobs and the money from the pension was holding up. 6 months later my mom was diagnosed with Alzheimer's . It was a pretty rapid progression and within another 3 months I was taking care of her full time. I was still making the $500 + car payments and my CC bills.

Towards the middle of 2009 I found a county program that pays and trains you to take care of elderly family at home. It wasn't much but it just covered my car payment. I still got behind at the end of 2009 but was able to catch up quickly. The cash from the pension had run out as well.

Now in 2011 the program through the state has decided I do not count as a resident in the home and I will only be receiving about $150 a month to take care of my mom. With her fixed income I simply cannot make the payments any more I won't risk her safety to pay for the car, even though we do need it. Wells Fargo will not renegotiate or refinance, at one point they went so far as to tell me I shouldn't have bought a car I can't afford.

So what are the best options in everyone's opinions?

I have no assets, I own no real property. Would it be best to try to go for a bankruptcy or voluntary repo on the car and tough out the consequences. I really don't want to do either but I don't have any other options


Thanks for putting up with the novel.

[discombob1]

I am sorry to hear about your situation. You are not alone, but that doesn't make it any easier.

If I read it right, your only income is $150 a month, and the car is your only asset. If so, you are collection proof. My question is do you need the car, or does your mom have one that you can drive for daily errands, doctor's appointments, etc? Another question is do you have the necessary power of attorney over your mother's affairs? You should consult an attorney about the consequences of this.

Overall, if you don't have a job and health insurance, I would say consult a few BK attornies to be certain, but give back the car and ride it out. You don't want to declare now only to have more debt pile up. If and when you get a job, deal with it then. I would also suggest you consult an elder law attorney to ensure your mother's interests are well protected

Good luck!

[discouraged]

I don't understand why the state said what they did. Did you go through the program and become certified to help your mom? Is there anything you can do to convince them you need to take care of her? Or, can she get medical help for a nurse so you can work?

I do feel for you. It is hard when a parent needs help. I do hope you have stopped paying the cc's. There is nothing they can do to you at this point.

[keepmine]

This going to sound cold and I apologize in advance.
You've done all you can for your mother. Put her in a nursing home and you start rebuilding your life. You can't exist on $150/month and no health insurance.
Bk will rid you of old debts but, post bk you still have to support yourself.

[701mike]

I am sorry to hear about your situation. You are not alone, but that doesn't make it any easier.

If I read it right, your only income is $150 a month, and the car is your only asset. If so, you are collection proof. My question is do you need the car, or does your mom have one that you can drive for daily errands, doctor's appointments, etc? Another question is do you have the necessary power of attorney over your mother's affairs? You should consult an attorney about the consequences of this.

Overall, if you don't have a job and health insurance, I would say consult a few BK attornies to be certain, but give back the car and ride it out. You don't want to declare now only to have more debt pile up. If and when you get a job, deal with it then. I would also suggest you consult an elder law attorney to ensure your mother's interests are well protected

Good luck!

That is kind of what I was thinking too. I hate to do it that way. But what about if they get a judgment? I do have POA and Med DPOA so she is covered in that regard. We do not have another car but I could pick up a reliable car reasonably cheap before I stopped paying on the newer car.

I don't understand why the state said what they did. Did you go through the program and become certified to help your mom? Is there anything you can do to convince them you need to take care of her? Or, can she get medical help for a nurse so you can work?

I do feel for you. It is hard when a parent needs help. I do hope you have stopped paying the cc's. There is nothing they can do to you at this point.

Neither do I. Basically they go off income and members of the household. For some reason I have become a non member of the household so the amount they allow has dropped to the minimum. They allow many units per day billed and then income decides what percent of the units are paid.

This going to sound cold and I apologize in advance.
You've done all you can for your mother. Put her in a nursing home and you start rebuilding your life. You can't exist on $150/month and no health insurance.
Bk will rid you of old debts but, post bk you still have to support yourself.

If this were a situation of losing a house or something like that I would agree. With her retirement we could get by just fine, without the car payment. I was able to make the payment on the car with what I was paid for in home care. I should have mentioned this is a small town, She owns the house outright, although I am going to transfer it into another family members name to protect it should the need to go into a home arise.

[discouraged]

Be careful about putting the house in somone else's name. There is a time frame (I can't remember what it is though) but may be 7 years, not sure, but they will declare it fraud if the house is put in someone's name and then the state is asked to pay for nursing home care.

I know there was a big to-do about that some years ago but just can't quite remember what the time frame was. The family member did have to give back the house and it was sold to pay for the nursimg home costs.

[discombob1]

Discouraged is absolutely correct. Speak to an elder care attorney first. Each state has different look back periods for Medicaid and they do not play around. Medicare does not pay for long term care, only rehabilitation and there is a limit on that.

[701mike]

Be careful about putting the house in somone else's name. There is a time frame (I can't remember what it is though) but may be 7 years, not sure, but they will declare it fraud if the house is put in someone's name and then the state is asked to pay for nursing home care.

I know there was a big to-do about that some years ago but just can't quite remember what the time frame was. The family member did have to give back the house and it was sold to pay for the nursimg home costs.

But isn't that Medicaid? I was reading the Medicare information and it said they can't assess the home. She doesn't qualify for medicaid. And in the instance of the nursing home here we would probably sell the house to move her back closer to other family. I was told by an attorney that I should look a land trust for the house.

[discombob1]

Yes, that is Medicaid. Medicare won't attach the house but they do NOT cover long term care. Nursing home care can cost upwards of 10K a month which you will pay out of pocket if she doesn't qualify for Medicaid. That is 120K a year easily.

Medicare will pay for nursing home rehabilitation care up to 100 days per calendar year after a qualifying 3 day hospital stay. However, Medicare only pays the full amount of the first 20 days and 80% of days 21-100. This is assuming she still meets the medical requirements for active rehab. Most people do not understand that Medicare does not pay for long term nursing home care until it is too late. It is not unheard of for people to have to spend down hundreds of thousands of dollars on nursing home care, then have to turn around and apply for Medicaid to continue that care. I am not saying this to depress you, I am urging you to become educated and prepared. Most state look back periods are 3-5 years but vary widely. Consult an elder law attorney in the state you expect your mother to require long term care.

ETA: most local senior centers or Councils on Aging will have this information for you. Call and ask to speak to someone there.