I'm the creditor....

[Tree88]

I get judgment in court against the guy's corporation but not him personally. Couldn't pierce the corp veil. His Corporation never paid me. So I sent him (he's registered agent) notice to respond to come to court with list of items to determine his corporations assets. Then I get his personal Chapter 7 filing indicating presumtion of abuse does not arise.

1. So I guess we know where the money is. He has it. Not his corporation the reason he's filed personally. He could care less about his company... the money is gone.

My question is: since he filed personal BK, does that have anything to do with me not being able to persue going after his corporation to a final resolution in District Court? I want him to come to court with his corp bank records and if he doesn't show up I'll get rule to show cause. I need this info for BK I think.

I believe this person took nearly 1 million from his firm, didn't pay creditors, stopped working for 6 months so he could show no income knowing he'd be filing BK. What is my recourse. Can I object to discharge. Can he be forced to bring in his bank statments showing where the money went? Does his lawyer have an obligation to query his client, see his books, to know exactly the guy is telling the truth.

Also, I got notice a bank had blanket lien on his money... how can I find out about that. Could he be in cahoots with the lawyers and bankers... ... to hide the money..... how do you get to the evidence that shows abuse, fraud etc.


I suspect fraud and diversion of funds.. to avoid paying creditors..

What is my recourse in getting my money from this crook!


Thanks

[JRScott]

Do you know the nature of the business? I mean how it was incorporated, if its an S-corp the personal bankruptcy probably liquidates it.

LaJazz is in a long process with someone that has been hiding assets he might have some suggestions hopefully he sees this

[HHM]

With no judgment against him, you are probably SOL.

1. You can still hold an owner liable for business debts as a trustee in assets of the business.

2. You will probably need to file an Adversarial proceeding in BK court to dispute the discharge of debt.

3. His personal BK does NOT stop you from pursuing the company. But as you pointed out, the company probably has nothing.

[Tree88]

Do you know the nature of the business? I mean how it was incorporated, if its an S-corp the personal bankruptcy probably liquidates it.

LaJazz is in a long process with someone that has been hiding assets he might have some suggestions hopefully he sees this

It's an LLC. Lost pierce veil case but could refile against individual... until I got his chapter 7 notice.
This guy was ripping people off via corp 10 years ago.. found out via google search. This is my first dealing with a person who filed bk... looks like this is just another way to not pay bills. This guy is still living in a $700K house, at today's values.

[Tree88]

With no judgment against him, you are probably SOL.

1. You can still hold an owner liable for business debts as a trustee in assets of the business.

2. You will probably need to file an Adversarial proceeding in BK court to dispute the discharge of debt.

3. His personal BK does NOT stop you from pursuing the company. But as you pointed out, the company probably has nothing.

How do I become a trustee? It appears his bk lawyer has his buddies as trustee. How convenient. And perhaps his lawyer arrainged the blanket lien for him to protect the cash he took.

Also, the reason I'm continuing going after his firm is that he must, via court order bring in the bank statments. Perhaps if he does show, I'll learn where the money has gone and if he paid it too himself.... I could use that info in bk court? If he doesn't show then he'll be arrested. He probably thinks he need not answer to the judgement against his firm.

What is odd is, I got chapter 7 filing and supposedly I"m listed as creditor, but it's not him that owes me the money, it's his firm. Why didn't he place his firm in chapter 7.... OH... I got it... he took all the money from the firm so now he's seeking protection....

[AngelinaCat]

Then you will need to see what you can do to file an Adversarial Proceeding against him, and you will need to have every scrap of information on him to produce in court.

It would help if you had an open case against him, but if you lost the 'pierce the veil' attempt, you probably are in trouble. I am no lawyer, but I have seen and been through enough *s*t***t with an AP, that my next suggestion is: If you are wealthy enough and you are p.o.d enough, go hire a GOOD BK attorney and go from there.

I really do sympathize. 'Hub and I have an Enemy that through 8 years of cyberstalking crap, has brought us down to BK, and even after a successful discharge, we can't pay our bills. Said enemy has cost us our jobs and our retirement trying to fight him. I could say more, but I think I have said all I better at this point.

Good luck in your Quest.

[eddiep]

I dont know if this will give you any comfort but the process of filing for bk is in part to protect creditors like yourself. The trustee will be looking closely at his income and expenses to see if he is hiding assets from you. It seems from reading here that self employeed filers are under closer scrutiny by the trustee becasue of issues like this. If you are listed as a creditor you can request to see all documents filed in this case. There was a member who had a question about this tonight posted by Teachermomma. You can find it under new posts. Just be careful as a creditor you don't want to be in voilation of the stay by trying to collect while he is being protected by the court.

[whipster1]

You need an attorney, and if you are a corporation you MUST have an attorney to represent you in BK court. Check with some of the larger banks in your area to see who they use as local counsel.

[HHM]

By holding him liabile as a trustee in assets, I mean this...

A business owner has certain duties when a company is dissolved or otherwise stops working. If the owner dissipated assets of the business, the owner can be held liable for the debts. The business owner is the trustee in assets of the business. This isn't necessarily piercing the corporate veil, but it is away to at least get at the value of any assets the owner took out of the business as it was going insolvent.

[Tree88]

By holding him liabile as a trustee in assets, I mean this...

A business owner has certain duties when a company is dissolved or otherwise stops working. If the owner dissipated assets of the business, the owner can be held liable for the debts. The business owners is the trustee in assets of the business. This isn't necessarily piercing the corporate veil, but it is away to at least get at the value of any assets the owner took out of the business as it was going insolvent.

He was CFO of the firm for 1 year assessed the business opportunity for himself, bought the firm from the owner of nearly 20 years, on terms, claimed he was having finanical problems, got the former owner/ now creditor to mortgage his house, pay him some money to keep the firm afloat.. and walked away from the firm not paying bills... HA HA.. and then sold the accounts of the firm to another competitor... like he wasn't up to something. He's no dummy. Meanwhile all the former accounts are now with the competing firm paying their bills like he was paid and ran with the money.

He has a lawyer that I've spoke to, and I told him to tell his client to pay...

This guy has money as I know no one defaulted in paying him for service as he collected 1 million upfront before doing work for the summer. He just left the firm and hired a lawyer. They've been lying in wait to file BK. Lawyers are in on this as they get a cut from the money he's hiding or they are helping him to hide. Afterall their on one team and creditors are on their own team.

Believe me, I'm going to continue persuing his corporation as I got a judgment there, and will use info collected there to file the Complaint Objecting to Discharge of the Debtor for his personal BK. I suspect he paid himself, or a firm he has in interest in a huge paycheck $800,000 and then was out of work for 6 months to meet presumption of abuse test.... that he's not working and is making no money... well DOH... he got the $800K 6 months ago.... still living in his $700K house with no problem. Tell me about how broke the guy is...NOT.

And lawyers get commissions based upon who files objections in BK that they must defend.. what the heck is that about?

[JRScott]

You could contact his bk Trustee and ask about the million dollars missing from the company. Sometimes they need a nudge, and friends or not with the lawyer of the perp the Trustee has to follow the law.

You could also contact the UST for the case.

You will need some proof though of course.