What is this Trustee doing? This is FRUSTRATING!

[rimi2001]

Yes, I am back again, thinking all of our troubles would be over, well, NOT.

Just to give you an idea of the last year:

1. Filed For Chap 7 - pro se (very bad idea, learned our lesson the hard way)

2. Trustee wants ALL MONEY from bank account- husbands paycheck to pay mortgage, living expense money that was given to us by our insurance company due to the hurricane katrina, refund money for 2005 and settlement money from a law suit which was due to us.

3. We realized we really screwed up by filing this BK7. Our BK7 went from a no asset case to an asset case and this Trustee knows we are totally uninformed and is wanting everything.

4. Trustee send letter to us to comply with what she wanted and if we did not, the case would be dismissed. We thought , well, pay her over 10K or pay our creditors 10K and not have a bankruptcy over our head for 7-10 years. We chose trying to get it dismissed by not complying with what she wanted. We figured we would get our settlement money and use that toward paying a creditor when they started wanting their money- it is not much at all under 4k after attorney fees.

5. Trustee still did not dismiss, waited 6 months and then sent us another letter to comply with what she wants. Then another letter was sent by the Judge for an ORDER OF TURNOVER. 1 week later- another letter with the same order of turnover letter attatched from Judge and a letter of NOTICE OF HEARING stating the Trustee is seeking councel to employ an attorney as a Special Counsel for the estate, and the authority to pay this lawyer over 4k for his services and expenses- this guy is from our class action settlement court from another State- he is the class action settlement bankruptcy lawyer that works for the them.

** Would like to add, we never once were told that we had to pay this settlement lawyer any money, nor do we see it in any paper work that we signed months ago. The lawyers knew we filed BK7 because you have to tell them upfront. Never once heard from this guy in this entire year of having filed the bk7. I actually called him to ask what would happen to the settlement and he said nothing, it will go to the Trustee or we will send it to you and you have to turn it over. Well I made the mistake of telling this guy that I was trying to get it dismissed.

COULD THIS LAWYER AND THE TRUSTEE BE IN THIS TOGETHER? If they know we are not going to comply, she knows that is what money we were seeking to be handed back over. This BK7 just was a total error on our part and we were just so lost. Countless hours went into this and it ended up being not in our best interest. The Trustee knows that, I know they do. Could she be pissed that we are trying to back out and she will not make any $$ from this? HOW DOES THIS WORK. Will we get a bill from her too? How do we handle this BK laweyer for the settlement? How can he take 4K from a settlement of 4K - the other lawyers could not take any more than 40% from our actual settlement.

I KNOW THIS IS ALOT, BUT PLEASE HELP US UNDERSTAND or if you have any suggestion.

Thanks, rimi

[HHM]

The plain and "harsh" truth is, that you screwed up, and screwed up big time.

To try to salvage the situation, why don't you get a bankruptcy lawyer to represent you, you are obviously in over your head.

When a case is dismissed for non-compliance...they mean stuff like not filing the right paperwork etc, not turning over documents. When it comes to not turning over ASSETS, that is a different ball game. Non compliance by not turning over assets will likely lead to a "denial of discharge". An Judgment denying discharge means you can NEVER discharge the debts that were included in the bankruptcy. Dismissal is different, an order dismissing the case simply closes the states and you are back to square one (and will have to wait at least 6 months before refiling BK).

In addition, now you have a court order demanding turn-over...if you do not comply, you will be (are) in contempt of court. Since they have the Court Order, I imagine the next step will be a writ of garnishment, and they will simply raid all your bank accounts.

What ever you do, do not let this thing go to denial of discharge.

You need to get a lawyer and you need to get a lawyer ASAP.

[rimi2001]

Ok, but the original letter the trustee sent was if you do not comply your case will be dismissed and creditors will have the right to come back after what is owed. So how is this fair to come back and do all what you are saying? There is no way a lawyer will take this now. We tried calling them before and basically, wanted a full BK fee and we have no time now. She wants this 8 days prior to the court date Dec 19th. Not giving us any time to do anything.

rimi

[rimi2001]

Is there a way we can talk to the judge and let them know we really messed up and we did not know what we were doing by filing pro se?

[HHM]

Is there a way we can talk to the judge and let them know we really messed up and we did not know what we were doing by filing pro se?

Yes, file a Motion to Dismiss your case (but you have to have legal grounds to dismiss your case, saying Opps, we made a mistake, probably won't cut it, especially since it looks like your an Asset Chapter 7). Again, you need to get a lawyer at this point

[FoolAndHisMoney]

Is there a way we can talk to the judge and let them know we really messed up and we did not know what we were doing by filing pro se?

I doubt the judge will allow this just because you messed up. Sorry about your troubles, but HHM is correct.

[9877donna]

Isn't there a form you can fill out requesting a 'dismissal' of your case?I thought there was.... Call the Bankruptcy Court Clerk and ask about the form to get your case 'dismissed'.
Maybe it's too late at this point in time but it wouldn't hurt to try.
Good Luck to you.
Donna

[rimi2001]

Thanks for your replies. We thought there was a form also, I agree, I think we are too late.

[CindyLou]

i would file the motion to dismiss anyway!!! Can't hurt!

[rimi2001]

Am writing a somewhat "moral issue" letter and a sort of pleading. And will ask for a dismissal also. WE NEED PRAYERS AT THIS POINT! Please pray for us.

[SinkingFast]

I don't mean to sound rude or anything like that, but,............

This is the Court you are talking to. While anyone reading your letter may sympathize with your plight, the Law is the Law. A moral pleading is just a waste of the time taken to formulate the arguement and the ink and paper to write the letter.

Ignorance of the Law is not a defense. You need to argue a Code.

While not totally applicable to your particular situation, you'd need to find something like this:

In bankruptcy a trustee has the authority to recover "preferential" payments made by an insolvent debtor within 90 days before the filing on debts owed to creditors. The Bankruptcy Code also provides several defenses to preference actions, including what is known as the "ordinary course of business defense." Under pre-BAPCPA law, this defense, codified in 11 U.S.C. 547(c)(2), required a creditor to demonstrate that the payment was:

(1) in payment of a debt incurred by the debtor in the "ordinary
course of business" or financial affairs of the debtor and creditor;
(2) made in the "ordinary course of business" or financial
affairs of the debtor and creditor;
and
(3) made "according to ordinary business terms."

http://bapcpa.blogspot.com/

As has been suggested before, you'd be best off to retain an attny at this point. Maybe an attny could argue a point of Code for you to get your original filing Dismissed without Prejudice. That would allow you to refile in 6 months.

[9877donna]

Am writing a somewhat "moral issue" letter and a sort of pleading. And will ask for a dismissal also. WE NEED PRAYERS AT THIS POINT! Please pray for us.

I honestly don't think writing a letter is going to help you at all.You need to call the Clerk of Court and ask how to go about getting your BK dismissed.
It certainly can't hurt to call and see if the clerk can help you.I know the Clerk at my BK Court was very helpful to me.
Donna

[rimi2001]

Actually the clerk of court was helpful I thought also. She was friendly and by law they cannot give advice. But she gave some scenerios (sp?) on what to expect.

Basically what the original letter from the Trustee stated was if you do not comply, your case will be dismissed and the creditors can come foward again. This was the worst thing that could possible happen is what the clerk of court stated and so, that is just what we did, did not comply. Now it has taken a different route it seems.

Does anyone know, if you have filed a BK7 and the filer is to get a settlement from a class action suit, is the BK lawyer for the class action suit entitled to payment? There is absolutely no paper work stating this at all. The only thing that was ever said was that the settlement goes straight to the Trustee. The other laweyers took out their 40% and left a remainder and the BK lawyer wants the rest + some more. What is his % of the settlement suppose to be, what are his fees? expenses? We have nothing showing any of this. Only from the original lawyers.

[rimi2001]

I should add, if the BK lawyer from the settlement law suit gets the remainder of what we were suppose to collect from the settlement, what is the Trustee trying to collect???? There would be nothing left. This seems very fishy to me. Is the trustee getting a kickback from the lawyer or is this how it normally works?

[Spartan]

May be it is just me. I am totally confused after reading through the posts.

I think the best bet is to get a lawyer ASAP. It looks like you are struggling in quick sand, with the sand already over your head. Yike! Sorry to be blunt. I would have gotten a lawyer as soon as I got the turn over order from the judge. It is going to cost you now. But you really have no choice. I doubt you can sort this out on your own. Trying to figure out what the trustee may or may not be colluding with who, will do absolutely nothing to help your case.