Got a bill from attorney after confirmation

[bksmith12345]

We received a bill from our attorney for about $1200. We filed on 12/31/08 and were confirmed on 05/07/09.

The bill is for phone calls, emails, faxes etc. that took place after the filing. The letter says he is asking the for the payment to be paid through the plan.

How is this possible if we are all ready confirmed at $320 for 60 months?

He has been paid in full for the BK.

Is this common? Any thought?

Thanks.

[justbroke]

This would add about $20/month to your Plan. While I haven't specifically seen a bill post confirmation, this seems odd. How much did you pay him up front, and how much was already in the Plan?

You may have gone to a "bare bones" attorney who charges little up front, but then bills the rest in the Plan. What does your retainer say about this?

[bksmith12345]

We paid him $1800 upfront and $1700 in the plan. He is now paid in full. My wife looked at the retainer and it says he can bill us. I should have looked closer at it.

Is this going to po the trustee? Will the trustee now start looking at our case again?

We just want to fly under the radar. Is this going to cause problems?

Thanks.

[justbroke]

We paid him $1800 upfront and $1700 in the plan. He is now paid in full. My wife looked at the retainer and it says he can bill us. I should have looked closer at it.

Okay.

Is this going to po the trustee? Will the trustee now start looking at our case again?

No, the Trustee understands these things. The Trustee can't look at your case because you have "post-petition" charges.

We just want to fly under the radar. Is this going to cause problems?

No problems at all. Now your lawyer really needs to file a Fee Application with the Court, as all lawyer fees must be approved. However, this wouldn't cause any problems for you, only for your lawyer if they don't follow the rules.

So that means you will have paid $3,500 plus an additional $1,200 for your case. Did you have a lot of creditors? Were there various Motions, from creditors, filed that your lawyer needed to answer? I'm wondering how he earned this money, in addition to that already in Plan. You may want to ask for an accounting.

[bksmith12345]

No problems at all. Now your lawyer really needs to file a Fee Application with the Court, as all lawyer fees must be approved. However, this wouldn't cause any problems for you, only for your lawyer if they don't follow the rules.

So that means you will have paid $3,500 plus an additional $1,200 for your case. Did you have a lot of creditors? Were there various Motions, from creditors, filed that your lawyer needed to answer? I'm wondering how he earned this money, in addition to that already in Plan. You may want to ask for an accounting.


We had about 25 or so creditors. There was only one motion from the mortgage company about the lien strip. Confirmation hearing was rescheduled.

He sent us the breakdown of charges. He charged for emails, phone conversations and even travelling expense to the final confirmation hearing.

Is this common? How can our plan change if all ready confirmed?

[justbroke]

He sent us the breakdown of charges. He charged for emails, phone conversations and even travelling expense to the final confirmation hearing.

Is this common? How can our plan change if all ready confirmed?

Well, the lien strip is probably extra, but charging for the confirmation hearing, sounds excessive... unless your confirmation was continued multiple times due to the lien strip.

Of course, this should have been spelled out in your fee agreement. That is, that he would attend the 341 meeting and one confirmation hearing and that anything else is billable. Having 25 creditors may be 5 more than average, so that may have cost a little more.

[bksmith12345]

No just continued the one time.

I will read the retainer agreement tonight. We were shocked when we got the bill and the letter to the court.

I wish he would have made it more clear.

I just hope this dosn't open up a can of worms.

[falken]

Here is how it worked with my plan:

I paid $1000+filing fee up front. My schedules called for another $1500 to be paid in the plan plus $200/hr TBD after confirmation.

The extra charges the attorney submitted were just paid for from the plan, my payments did not increase because of it (just less went to unsecured). If that is what happened to you, its nothing to worry about!

[bksmith12345]

I think you might be right.

[justbroke]

The Fee Application will determine where it comes from. The Fee Application may be a justification for the "included in Plan" money already.

The only problem I see, is if you're in a 0% plan. In the other poster's case, they had disposable monthly income going to the unsecured creditors. In their case, the plan payment does not change... only the money is shifted around. If you're in a 0% plan, you have no money to shift around.

[bksmith12345]

We are at $320 for 60 months. Which is a total of $19200. With all our arrears, attorney fee and trustee fee it totals to about $15000.

So, I guess he is looking to get a piece of what is left over to the unsecureds.

[woeisme]

Wow, this is shocking. In my district the trustee has a cap of how much $ he'll allow the attorney to include in the plan (I think it's $3000). My attorney charged $3000, but I had to pay $575 up front, so only $2425 was in the plan, I guess in case things got complicated and she needed to add more fees into the plan for unusual charges, but she didn't. How many e-mails did he have to do for $1200!!! Glad you have room in your plan so you don't pay extra for this!

[bksmith12345]

I have to review the bill again when I get home.

He charged us for emails, phone calls and even travelling expenses. The emails and phone calls where 90% done by the paralegal.

He has been superb so far. That is why this really caught us off gaurd.

The crazy part is now I don't want to even email or call there so I don't get charged more. Well, not charged because it will be in the plan.

We just don't want the trustee to get angry with us.

[optimistic1]

You didnt do anything wrong, the trustee probably has hundreds if not thousands of pending cases.