go on a trip already paid for? HELP

[liz417]

If you can't afford to pay cash from here on out, then you CAN NOT afford this trip. NO MORE CREDIT. It is what got you here in the first place. Time to rest the plastic for a few years. plus if you charge over 600 and then pay it off, the trustee can get that money back from the creditor as preferential. PAY CASH or stay home! those are your choices

Straight to the point...well said gramma!

[t160out]

I haven't filed yet. I just found out that we were in such bad shape (my fault for not doing my part). trying to get an appt with a lawyer now, but with the holiday next week I doubt it highly that I'll be able to get a legal answer.

I know that we will have to file ch13, but I really don't want to disappoint my son as we've been planning this for a while, but if I go you cant do anything without using a credit card. I think I can keep it low and make some payments that it may not get scrutinized.

the cruise was paid on another card back in aug/sept. What I'm trying to figure out is, is it really going to matter? the cruise was paid for and there's nothing I can do about that now, so if the contest, that would be what they point to as abusive.

i'm trying to hold it all together but I just cant seem to. I personally don't want to go due to guilt but I'm trying to hold my family together the best I can. I feel like if I can get to file that I did the numbers and I'm going to be in the 60-70% payback range, how much worse can it get for another $1200?

[rrockinggramma]

well to me the issue is fraud. So, DO NOT see a lawyer until you get back from the trip. As to disappointing children, you will end up doing that anyway so make it clear from the get go that this is a frugal trip. Take as much cash (traveler's checks) as you can and leave the plastic in your pocket as much as possible. And it is possible to go WITHOUT a credit card. Even car rental is possible with cash you just have to research the companies. I found one that required NO deposit and allowed to pay in cash (AVIS) here in my own state.

Bankruptcy is a change in lifestyle. And a lifestyle change will effect the entire family no matter how you try for it not too. Take it from someone who has been through it, telling the kids off the bat that things are bad and going to get worse and setting limits is a lot easier from the get go.

This will be a family committment (to a chapter 13) and all must be vested in it to make it work. And trying not to let the kids "suffer" because of your guilt only kicks the reality can down the road. Believe me, look long and hard at this and then set a budget for this trip and stick to it.

You haven't filed and haven't seen an attorney so no creditor can say that you "planned" in advance to go on a lavish vacation with no intent of paying, but it could be raised. If you have stress already in your life, why add more to it with adversarial proceedings?

Be honest with yourself and your family. Your life is about to change. Start practicing it on this trip.

[hopeforus]

Will you have enough cash with not paying your credit cards? You don't have to wait till you file to stop paying them. Stop ASAP. Of course it won't make much difference prob since the trip is so soon.

[AngelinaCat]

t160ou, I still think you need to go on the cruise--the money is spent anyway, so if you go, or if you don't--its the same issue--what did you do with the money? From what I have learned, once you booked a cruise, that money on your card is GONE--period!! Unless some of the other posters actually know more than I do, and can help you recover it.

When I fell and broke myself up, I most certainly DID NOT want to go on the cruise. I tried every way I could think of to get my daughters and sons-in-law a refund for 'Hub and I.'s passage.

I could not. And I did not want the folks to 'eat' our tickets. It was 'Hub that got me to go afer several loud arguments.

You can manage your payments onboard if you are very careful.

[PoorGrammyinBK7]

For heaven's sake TAKE the CRUISE!

When will you ever get to do it again? And you have already paid for it, so might as well.

Just either take plenty of CASH with you (if you have it), or be VERY CONSERVATIVE with spending while on the cruise (ie: just the basics and necessities). Well be conservative even if you have cash. On most cruises you have already pre-paid for the food, so unless you are gambling, drinking a lot of extra drinks or buying souvenirs, you can get by with spending very little.

Wish I could take a cruise!

[t160out]

Well thats basically where I stand:

Plane tix paid for back in feb/mar08

Cruise paid off in sept (before I found out how bad of shape we were in)


Looking at incidentals on the cruise if I go. Going to do mostly cash, but i know there will be something that ends up on credit.

Basically I'm resigned to the fact that I'm screwed no matter what I do.

[rrockinggramma]

just wait a little longer to file and pay only minimum amount on cards after the trip. GL

[AngelinaCat]

Go on the cruise and have fun--THAT'S AN ORDER!

[t160out]

Rockin and Angel, Thanks for all the feedback.

I spoke to my new lawyer, and he said to go. Technically when I booked it (almost a year ago) i wasn't planning on filing and therefore there shouldnt be any presumption of fraud.

He did say use as much cash as possible and once we're done with it then no more CC. So looks like I'm going, but we just canceled all but one activity (pirate thing with my son) and plan to sit poolside, sip 'water-ita's' and relax. Sort of the calm before the storm. I'll update with how things go. This is an amazing site that offers a lot of support, thanks!

[woeisme]

Well thats basically where I stand:


Looking at incidentals on the cruise if I go. Going to do mostly cash, but i know there will be something that ends up on credit.

Why do you think you MUST use a credit card? If the cruise requires you to have one on file, go with a pre-paid card or a debit card. I've been in my CH 13 for 15 months now. Do lots of things I used to think I HAD to have a credit card for. Guess what, you don't need to spend with credit, you choose to spend on credit. If you really plan to file BK in Jan, choose to not spend on credit! I think this is a great test for the potential you have to succeed at your BK, if you can make it on this trip without credit, you can do anything! Prove you are more powerful and resourceful than the credit card companies want you to believe!

[MajorMike]

I agree with WOEISME.

[njguy1972]

T160Out

I am in a similar situation as you. I booked with a friend in September. I may even be on the same cruise as you.

What I did is this:
-deposit and airfare booked in early September when things were looking ok in the financial markets.
-In Oct Amex took away all my available credit (doing this to a lot of customers) and Bank of America raised my interest fro 11% to 26%.
-As this was happening the cruise balance hit my card.
-I accessed my situation and realized I could not wait until the end of the year when I get a potential bonus from work and a tax refund. I was looking at bankruptcy.
- I also realized I could not make minimum payments to the cards.
-It was within 30 days of the cruise and too late to cancel for any refund, so I asked the travel agent to remove the charge from my credit card ($600) and move it to my debit card (which was done). A family member gave me some cash to help my bank account for the trip.
-I am going with a buddy who is putting his credit card down for the room and I will repay him in cash. We were lucky where the travel agent got us a $200 credit for fuel surcharges that were reversed recently. The credit should cover most of our drinks. My excursions were booked in September.
-I have been talking to lawyers and 1 told me I was smart to do what I did. Although the worst that would happen is that the card can object and make you pay the cruise back.


Bottom Line: Enjoy the trip and try not to take excursions that cost money. If there is an unlimited soda card from the cruise line, buy that and try to avoid alcohol.

As for me:
-Stopped using cards on Oct 30.
-Missed 1st credit card payments ever in November.
-Will probably file in mid to late January (since I may get a bonus on Feb 1. If no bonus I will wait until Feb to file).

[mmenz22779]

t160 i am in kinda the same boat,

I paid for airline tickets 7 months ago for a vacation. I have paid on that card for that 7 months and have not used it sense (ran out of credit). If I cancel the airline it will cost me more money. We are still going to go on the trip and use cash only as i have 7 months of payment history on the card.

Worst case is the object and i have to pay (SOME OF IT BACK). Most likely if they object then they will "settle it with you" so you wind up paying back much less. (kinda like on sale). You may be able to include that in your BK as well.

In a nut shell as everyone else said if you go use cash only. If you have to use the card on the trip you better wait for anouther 4 months minimum and make payments on it but you are then playing with fire.

[t160out]

Ok, I went on the trip and paid cash for everything. I felt extremely guilty, but I think it gave us time to work some things out for the better emotionally. I think I added 10 lbs (which is good because I think I've lost ~30 in the last couple months from the stress).

thanks to everyone for the help and advice. I hope it doesn't come back to bite me, but at this point I think it was worth it.

I hope I make it through this..