AT the beginning of our chapter 13

[Sobrokenow]

We are filing chapter 1 3in texas, eastern distrct to be exact. After 8000 bucks of medical bills last year topped with another 10 grand in rental house repairs and maintenance we hit the tipping point....on top of staggering credit card debt we incurred when we were both laid off for almost 2 years back in 2008-2009 when we should have let the GA house go and filed chapter 7 but instead in our naivete "tried to do the right thing" when we landed jobs in Texas by keeping the house and renting it out (dumb dumb dumb dumb)> Anyways. 95,000 in consumer debt, plus 20 grand federal student loans and a house we cannot break even on in GA that needs some pretty big ticket items in the next few years (the house is 17 years old, think roof, 2 new Air conditioners and a new furnace since we replaced one last year).

Ive seen two lawyers. One actually was recommended by someone who used him for a chap 13. Although he is arrogant and full of himself we felt he was FAR BETTER than the first one we saw. Bur darn, these guys are not consumer friendly. Trying to get a straight answer from him is like pulling teeth.

I am working on filling out our monthly expenses. I am trying to be realistic. I have a Freshman daughter (and completely depressed about looming college for her) and a 6th grade boy. There is no place on this form to account for things like school supplies and school activities. I don't plan on being extravagant but lets be real, just today I received a letter from two teachers regarding two separate field trips costing 30 bucks each. And the school supplies seem to increase every single year they get older. And then gifts. I noticed some folks in other discussions adding small gift line item..I suppose I can put these on the blank lines labeled other. Again I don't want or need to be extravagant...but I do need to be realistic. Oh...and summer day camp for my 11 year old....my daughter babysits in the summer and I just don't feel right leaving him alone in the summer all day...I suppose that would/could be counted as day care expenses? I have nightmares of a budget with no more than 300 dollars left over every month to account for these things. And he certainly did not give me the warm fuzzys about transportation expenses. he alluded to the fact we could not take more than the alotted IRS amounts for operating expenses. I use a tank and a half a week that's 240 bucks at todays prices, insurance is 90 bucks a month. Tollway is 40 bucks a month and then there is the regular maintenance like oil changes and tires and registration and inspections. HOw does all that fit in 277 dollars a month for operating expenses? My husbands car has 169000 miles on it...that's even higher maintenance costs.

[switch625]

As for educational expenses (school supplies and activities), you can deduct up to $156.25 per child per month on Line 29 of Form 22-C/B 122C-2 which you use to calculate disposable income. My attorney had me take the whole amount even though I did not have $156.25 in expenses at the time of filing and i had no issues with the Trustee on that amount. Check with your attorney on how your Trustee and BK Court will treat that expense. You also enter "childcare and children’s education costs" on Line 8 of Schedule J/Form B 106J (Expenses).

Also be sure to use the latest BK forms, which were updated in December 2015. You can get them a the link below.

Claim what you think you need to claim as an expense. Let the Trustee tell you he/she has an issue with it and be sure you and your attorney have good justification for it. Chances are you will have to amend your plan to get your confirmation anyway. Don't underestimate any expense because you will have to live with your Ch 13 plan for the next 3 to 5 years (unless you need to modify it post-confirmation).

[jmac]

Trust me get someone that will be pushing the limits of everything or you will be on here 1 year from now saying you can't make it, If possible by a car the 300-440 payment you will be be paying for it will go to trustee anyways if not, so at least you have something reliable for next 5 year with no breakdowns. Gas can go anywhere from 2 bucks to 5 bucks over 5 years plan for that, utilities another thing that can change quite a bit. May even want to go to court house and watch a day worth of filings, you will see what lawyers kickass and which could care less and have no idea about your situation, this is you chance to make things as easy as possible for yourself over the next 5 years. You have your lawyer put out as much as possible and let the trustee decide if it may be too much, IRS amounts are a guide line every case in unique in itself and the reason you pay for a lawyer to argue this points for you and not just show up for a paycheck and sell you out.

[dmc-2008]

Hi there! You are getting great advice! Just as long as you can show cancelled checks or reciepts for recurring expenses they are valid! Good luck! I like the idea Jmac gave to see lawyers

[LadyInTheRed]

Keep in mind that when your lawyer is telling you that you can't use more than the allotted expenses, he is talking about the means test. For schedule J and calculating your plan payment, you should be able to use your actual necessary expenses. Be ready to document them. Make sure you give your lawyer a list of all expenses, whether they fit a category on a form or not. When you are given a petition to sign, make sure you go through it carefully and understand how your plan payment was calculated. If you don't think an expenses I high enough and you can document the expense, insist your attorney increase the expense to what you can document. If your attorney won't do that, find another attorney.

Don't expect to have gifts as a line item. As already said, there is an allowance for educational expenses. But, it is possible that money for some of the optional activities will have to come from other parts of your budget or, in your daughter's case, that baby sitting money. Or, your kids may have to choose which activities are most important and sit out others. They are old enough to understand the situation if you explain it to them. This is a great opportunity to teach them about money and budgeting, a lesson many never get until they have to learn the hard way.

[Sobrokenow]

Thanks guys!.

Yes, LADY..she already uses her babysitting money for much of her expenses like school clothes etc, homecoming/prom dresses, football tickets etc. She is aiming for a car and 1st year insurance money right now. Luckily, we have taught our kids the dangers of credit etc and they want nothing to do with it. My son mows lawns and last year made 6 grand, bought his own computer, put the rest in a 529 account his grandmother opened for him.

I trust this lawyer even though he is arrogant and full of himself, my friend who used him spoke highly of him and spoke how he made the plan work for them. She said the hardest adjustment was learning to live without credit and she actually found after the first 6-9 months she felt she had way more cushion in her budget and was able to do more.

We have already bought one car to replace the car with 250,000 miles on it. The car my husband drives was bought used 2.5 years ago and still has a payment on it (its small but its a payment non the less) . He drives across the street to work 2 miles round trip so we are not too worried about that car or keeping it going for 5 years. But there is always that possibility of a big ticket item. He is handy too and can do a lot. But we did have to replace the computer in December for the tune of 3 grand, that is something he cannot do.

Thanks for all the advice.

[dmc-2008]

H there! You are lucky in that if he loses his car he can walk or bike to work, if he is physically able! That's great. Why do you need to spend 3k on a pc? That must be one heck of a box! I never ever never spend more than 350 tops, and that is high end for me! ;-)

[Sobrokenow]

dmc-2008 that was the computer in the car., (also called brain box by some) It was $3000 to replace. Could not get registration because could not pass inspection because engine light was on. My hubby replaced everything related to the code it was spitting out and the darn light would not go off. It turned out the computer was bad. No. we would not spend that much on a PC.

[dmc-2008]

Oh that makes sense! Crap!!!

I hope your expenses are lining up for a doable payment!