A Question for Des...

[AngelinaCat]

We have a person that we are trying to help get on his feet. He was born in Arizona, and does not have a copy of his birth certificate. He is presently living in Florida with his GF of 18 years. He needs to get a Florida ID or Driver's license, and cannot without his birth certificate. Arizona will not issue a birth certificate w/o a photo ID. Florida will not issue a photo ID w/o the birth certificate. Although he had lived in Rhode Island a number of years before moving to Florida, he seems to have nothing from that state.

GF has been trying to get the birth certificate, but has been unable to do so and has been given the run-around. I do not know if they have Power of Attorneys for each other or not. The father is non-cooperative and his mother is dead. He owns nothing in this state in his name, nor are any bills in his name.

At least this is what we were told.

Anyway, is it true that Arizona requires a photo ID to get a birth certificate? And if it is, what can this guy to about it?

Thanks!

[KAM465]

AngelinaCat,

Looks like they should be able to submit an application by mail by submitting a Notorized Application verifying signature. See Link Below

http://www.azdhs.gov/vital-records/b...cate/apply.htm

[KAM465]

Can also try through the third party below.

https://www.vitalchek.com/

[AngelinaCat]

AngelinaCat,

Looks like they should be able to submit an application by mail by submitting a Notorized Application verifying signature. See Link Below

http://www.azdhs.gov/vital-records/b...cate/apply.htm

Thanks. But the problem is that the application wants a copy of his government-issued photo ID. He can't get that w/o the birth certificate. Therefore he has this circular problem.

[despritfreya]

Cat,

I don't have an answer for you but a web search shows that 1) if you do not have a photo id, a relative with an id can request a copy or 2) you have to show up in person. Apparently the problem your friend is facing is not unusual.

I wonder. . . if your friend has a SS #, does the Federal Government have a photo id program of some sort? Maybe even getting a passport?????? The link below talks about secondary types of id that one can use to obtain a passport. . .

http://travel.state.gov/passport/get/secondary_evidence/secondary_evidence_4314.html

Once your friend has the passport, getting the birth certificate should be a snap.

Des

[TBA]

Florida got rediculous with obtaining id.

What about a notarized sworn statement attesting to identity? we use them for some of our stuff with work - and they require two witnesses who know the person - or he can sign one himself? if that on the list of acceptable IDs?

What about college or student id? Does he have one of those with his pic on it to use to get a fl id? I did this years ago, but i know they have really cracked down.

What about just an ID card and not a dl? i think the restrictions are less for the ID card and then you use the id card to get the dl. i have heard of that method as well.

GL guys!!!

[AngelinaCatHub]

May I add to Mrs. info: This person was also adopted in AR. His Father is non-cooperative in aiding him. He is 48 and not a real swift head. In FL now, all renewed DL's no matter how long you have driven, requires a birth certificate, SS, bill in your name. Has to do with so called "Home Security". After this is done, they put a little yellow star on your DL. You also cannot get a passport without a birth certificate.

Homeland Security and yellow stars kind of bring on thoughts of Germany in the 20's, 30's but I'll not talk politics on this thread. It just strikes me hard that our Country is becoming so restrictive. 'Hub

[goon]

You can fill out the form here, have his signature notarized, and mail it in. Wont be fast but he should get it. For the notary they will likely want a couple witnesses that know him or something as he doesn't have ID. This is a valid way of requesting the birth certificate via mail. If you call they may tell you that a photo ID is required. This is because if you apply for one in person a photo ID is required, but applying via mail here are the requirements.

http://www.azdhs.gov/vital-records/b...cate/apply.htm

"A copy of your valid government-issued picture identification which bears your signature or have your signature notarized."

Also make sure you send a proper form of payment ( Cashiers check, money order, or cc... but NOT personal check or cash)

[LadyInTheRed]

I agree with goon that the way to do this is to have the application for birth certificate notarized and mail it to Arizona.

I looked into Florida law about what kind of identification a notary is allowed to accept. If this person knows somebody that is a notary, the notary can notarize the form based on personal knowledge of his identity. If he doesn't know a notary, but knows somebody who does know a notary, the notary can establish his identity by having the person who knows both the notary and the signor swear to his idenity. If he doesn't know somebody who knows a notary, he should go to a notary with two witnesses who know him, have ID and are willing to swear to his identity and to the fact that he cannot obtain ID (AC and ACHub?). I recommend letting the notary know ahead of time that identity will be established by the testimony of credible witnesses. The notary may have to review the procedures if they haven't had to notarize a document this way before.

This is a summary of the Florida Statute that can be read at: http://www.leg.state.fl.us/statutes/...0117/0117.html Look for section 117.05(5).

[despritfreya]

You can fill out the form here, have his signature notarized, and mail it in (with). . . "A copy of your valid government-issued picture identification which bears your signature or have your signature notarized."

In here lies the problem. This person apparently does not have any "valid goverment issued picture ID" so mailing in a request will not work.

Edit. . . correction. Looks like Goon is right and I read it wrong. It's either a picture ID or a notarized signature - sounds good to me so, while I will leave the below comment, looks like Cat's friend is good to go.

Cat,

I am not sure you need a birth certificate to obtain a passport. The link I listed above leads me to believe that if you have someone who can attest to who you are AND have as much secondary info (see list) as possbile, you can get a passport. I could be absolutely wrong on this. Further, it does not appear that the person who vouches for you has to be related to you. It's worth a shot as if successful, your friend will now have a picture ID. Have your friend at least call wherever passports are issued locally.

Des.

[goon]

yep, OR is the magic word there.... (there is even a way to fill out the form as a family member getting the certificate for genealogical purposes.)

Make sure the form is mailed to the correct location, you didn't say how old he is, but if he has had a GF for 18 years I am going to assume he was born before 1990 so in his case it needs to be mailed to the state and not the county. Also to reiterate as stated above make sure it is a proper type of payment. The form can be confusing in that some of the counties accept personal checks, but the state does not. They are not always good at telling you why they rejected your request if they reject it, so it is best to get everything right the first time. Been there done that ......I got a bit of the run around getting a birth certificate for one of my children....



As for the passport, I can tell you from experience that it is "possible" to get a passport without a birth certificate (or at least it was possible prior to 9/11), it is just much more of a pain, and not every passport agent will deal with it. When I was 18 I had to go to Ireland for work, my company only gave me 2 weeks notice on the trip (actually had just hired me, I hadn't even started yet and they told me I would be going to Ireland for a week in 2 weeks), my mother couldn't find my birth certificate anywhere, so I had to get my passport in less than 2 weeks ( which is enough of a pain) without the birth certificate. That being said I did have my drivers license and my SS card among other things which helped... but I believe it is possible without photo id as well, as mentioned by Des.

If you were to go the passport route, try to find out which passport agent within a reasonable distance handles the most passports. My problem with the first one I went to is it was something they only did infrequently and they didn't know all the rules (actually the first person I spoke to didn't realize that they were actually a passport agent, she had to go ask someone else). They told me to talk to the people at a different location as they serviced far more passport applications.

(just as an fyi, only down side is from what I had read if you get a passport using alternate means it does get flagged somehow and you might get a little more scrutiny in customs, obviously doesn't matter in his case as he is just looking for photo id, but thought i would mention)


Still think notarized Birth Certificate application by mail is your best bet