Education in the USA

[DYLAN150]

I have a friend who's son is in High School. High school here is 4 years. But it could easily be cut to 3 years if they cut out some of the B.S. Like teachers days off, spring breaks, late starts, two weeks off at Christmas and so on and so fourth. Use the fourth year as a skill learner year or start college early. Same with College, 4 years could be cut to 3, cut out misc. B.S. classes.

Ok, teachers pay. Just about everyone agree's, teachers pay is to low. But let me give you some facts, then you decide. Average teachers pay, in WA state: $54,000 per year. Oregon: 48,000 per year. Calif: 61,000 per year. You must also consider that teachers get all the holidays off, spring breaks, Christmas break and what about summers?

[IamOld]

dylan, teachers spend around 6 hours a day on STAGE every day - as I was told once - teachers have no "off" days - the show must go on! Most teachers have 25-30 students - multiply that by about five classes. So...a teacher may "work" in school for about 6.5 hours, but then comes at least 3 hours a day (not necessarily every day, but around 15 hours/week) in grading, lesson prep, meetings, parent "stuff" etc.

SO - let's put those salaries then in perspective. $61K in CA is a LOW wage job if you live in SF, LA, SD, etc, which is where MOST people in CA reside.

So...yes, teachers get the breaks teh kids get BUT - most misc days off are "teacher workdays" when teachers go in and...work! Usually on paperwork "cr*p" and more grading and more lesson planning.

So when you are literally on your feet hours and hours most days, trying to energize your students, I think the about 2 months you get off, is the least you can do. Frankly, otherwise, you'll burn out. It's not possible to be "on" 100% of the time w/out a break. If the teacher is "off" the kids will be "off."

Now, could we teach more/better? Possibly - the problem is that in many areas the problems of society come into the schools, and the shcools have to deal with it, because society refuses to deal with it - poor kids, abused kids, etc etc etc etc etc.

Re 4 years of college - there are relatively fewer and fewer folks who finish in 4 years, as they ahve to work. Also, there are "kids" who do finish in three, because they want to and can take extra classes in the summer.

Those "extra" required classes are there so that schools turn out human beings, fully rounded (hopefullY) human beings, not just robots.

Deep breath...sorry...I feel VERY strongly about this :-)

[keepsmiling]

DS had a sophomore English teacher who went to bed at by 8 pm. She got up at 4 to grade papers.
Just sayin.

AND a friend who just retired taught art in an inner city school. It was 5 years of complete hell ending in utter and complete burnout- and that's "just" art.

[sunshinepa]

Good teachers spend more time that what's listed here. One of my best friends daughters teaches a high level of chemistry. She repeatedly buys dry ice and other supplies to do experiments with her students. She does not get reimbursed. Her day starts a 6 and usually ends at 5. Her salary here in PA has just now gone up to 48,000.00 a year. My sister - in - law also teaches the lower grades. She often spends her own money for supplies.

I do not think I would want that job for anything. Kids don't listen, there is NO discipline either from home or in the schools, so when those kids act up, it's on the teacher. No way would I want the stress!

[Pandora]

doing away with teacher work days, spring break, christmas, etc is the worst possible thing that the public school system can do. Just this year our school district changed from 2 weeks off at Christmas to now 1 week, with no reason to the change. They also took away 4 teacher workdays yet in all of this, the kids arent getting out any earlier, nor starting any later. Not only are teachers overworked, but the KIDS are overworked - so to change the schedule like they have is unthinkable. We will now be the 3rd district in our state to only get 1 week off as all others get 2 weeks - and we (parents) are not happy about it.

If your friends' son wants to graduate early, nearly every HS out there offers a program to do so. Then of course there is the option of attending summer school to graduate early as well. Only issue with either program is that the HS grad. degree will not be issued until the end of school along with every other graduating classmates.

So - there are always options...

[GoingDown]

One of my relatives is a local high school teacher, and he has no problem with the pay and benefits, and of course, he loves all the time off from work. His only gripe is the very small percentage of unruly kids who spoil it for all the well behaving kids, and then how the administrators step in and try to shelter the unruly kids from any consequences from their errant behavior, mainly because the parents call the school and complain, and the adminstrators tend to take the side of the parents over the teacher almost every time.

If there was one change I could make to our public schools it would be this... have administrators rotate into full time teaching positions every few years, so they can see things from a teacher's perspective. And don't give them all honors' or advanced placement kids. Give them regular kids to teach, so they get to see what it is really like to deal with the very few but loud complaints from impossible parents.

[IamOld]

I think that's a GREAT point to rotate into teaching! Where I live - and I think this is true pretty much everywhere though - you can't be a principal or asst principal without having been a teacher.

One of my relatives is a local high school teacher, and he has no problem with the pay and benefits, and of course, he loves all the time off from work. His only gripe is the very small percentage of unruly kids who spoil it for all the well behaving kids, and then how the administrators step in and try to shelter the unruly kids from any consequences from their errant behavior, mainly because the parents call the school and complain, and the adminstrators tend to take the side of the parents over the teacher almost every time.

If there was one change I could make to our public schools it would be this... have administrators rotate into full time teaching positions every few years, so they can see things from a teacher's perspective. And don't give them all honors' or advanced placement kids. Give them regular kids to teach, so they get to see what it is really like to deal with the very few but loud complaints from impossible parents.

[msm859]

One could argue that in many ways teachers have one of the most important jobs in this country. They are not overpaid by any stretch of the imagination. What other job requires a college degree plus post graduate work and pays so little?

[IamOld]

They do indeed!

But then we undervalue our kids, anything "humanistic" and caring.

One could argue that in many ways teachers have one of the most important jobs in this country. They are not overpaid by any stretch of the imagination. What other job requires a college degree plus post graduate work and pays so little?

[Exployer1234]

I have just a semester left before I finish my BS in Secondary Education. I have been in the school systems and it is not a job for the weary. Teachers will go crazy if they do not have those days off, plus it really is not time off. You have to work, even on your time off. Normal work week for a teacher is 60-70 hours a week. Also teachers must teach towards the standardized test. If their students do not do well on this test , well let's just say they can lose their job; unless they are tenure. Starting out in TN teachers make around 34K. That really is not a lot of money for what they have to go through to be certified. I just took a 170 dollar test that I have to retake, because I missed the passing score by 1 point. That is only one test I have to take. I have 4 more after this to complete my certification. This is out-of-pocket expenses. By the time I am done with the certification test I will spend around 600-800 dollars. Now if I do not continue on with my Master's program I will have to continue taking these test every 3 years. Also the teacher in-service days are for training that teachers have to complete every year. Some states require 15 hours and some states require 30 hours per year. So it may look like teachers have it easy, but in reality most teachers don't make it through their first five years of teaching.