I'm sad (what to do??)

[HeatherB]

Well, the last few weeks my dog had been sick. He was vomiting yellow bile (?) and acted like he didn't feel well. Then I noticed that he wasn't eating anymore. This concerned me and I thought about taking him to the vet but didn't have the money. Well, we decided to switch his food and he was eating again (for 2 days). Then he stopped eating again. He was sleeping all the time, too. Well, after much debate, we asked my dad if we could borrow money to take him to the vet. My dad agreed. So, we drive to the vet and muzzle my dog (he HATES vet visits). The vet came in and checked his teeth, felt his stomach, etc, etc and said that there really was no sign of illness other than the symptoms we described. He said he would have to do blood work to look further for answers and it would run about $60 for the bloodwork. We said fine and the vet went to take our Snoopy in the back (had to have a few techs to hold him down still). After a few brief seconds the vet walks back in and shows us a large lump in front of my dogs front shoulder. He stated it was a enlarged lymph node. Then the vet had this sad/serious look on his face and said that it is usually a sign of something very serious. He said it would cost $80 to draw fluid to find out exactly what it was but that it was a 75% chance that it was lymphoma or another cancer. Then he said that all the symptoms were the ones we described. We opted not to do any tests. Snoopy is a minpin and the lump was about the size of a golfball. Also, a few other lymph nodes were swollen, too. We asked if it would be painful and he said that snoopy would just stop eating and his blood sugar would drop down until he finally just fell asleep. He said to expect Snoopy to be less energetic, possibly a change in temperment. Then he said we could try to treat it, but the cost would be around $3000 to $4000 and would possibly prolong his life by six months - without certainty of quality of life.

So, every other day is a stuggle on what to do. Quality of life - what is the definition? Is it... life without pain and suffereing, or is it a "normal" life? I've been tempted to have him put to sleep. Then the next day he will act fine and I'll decide not to. It's a teeter-totter.

My DH's mom suggested that we take him out and give him a wonderful day... a good day when Snoopy seems well and shower him with love and attention, then take him in to be put to sleep. This sounded good except for the fact that in order to take him to the vet, we have to muzzle him (which seems to terrify him). I'm not sure which would be more cruel to him. As I said, he'll go a few days without eating and with little water, seeming tired and out of energy, then for a few days he's almost like normal.... begging at the table and barking at the birds.

I checked around on the internet and the life expectancy without chemo treatment for a dog is 4-8 weeks. I fear that I have less time (with taking so long to get him diagnosed).

So, today I am sad. Grab your furbabies and hug them for me.

[chpxiii]

Heather, I'm so sorry this is happening to your Snoopy and your family. I am about to tear up. I have two kitties myself that I love dearly.

If your puppy has cancer, I agree that showering him with love and affection is the best you can do right now. My boyfriend had two cats who lives with his parents. (They've been there 10 years.) One of them was diagnosed with a tumor in his abdomen area beginning of December. They loved on that cat and my boyfriend would go and visit regularly. They've recently taken Sydney to cross "the rainbow bridge." (Oh man, I want to cry thinking of you and your doggie, Heather.) :-(

I know that it is stressful for Snoopy to be taken to the vet. Another possibility: does your vet do home visits? I've known someone who has had to have their dog put to sleep and the vet made a home visit. The dog was home with loved ones and there wasn't any stress of the trip to the vet. It may cost more than a trip, but the cost may be worth having Snoopy at peace before hand.

My hugs to you, Heather. I know how painful this is.

[One Half Full]

You are assuming the worst. The percentage of 100% correct diagnosis among Doctors (or Vets) is generally pretty low without any actual "facts," as he would get from a test. Even among people doctors, unless it is obvious (a broken leg is pretty obvious) you should always get tests and a second opinion. Doctors are not infallible. They make their opinions on what they are told in a lot of cases, and so they depend a lot on things the dog can't tell them. It is only fair to actually get a sample drawn and some tests done.


The 80 dollars to have the tumor checked it just 20 more than the 60 dollars you were originally going to spend. I think you should get the blood test done at least. It could be a fatty tumor or something. Dogs often get those too. I just saw a dog with about 5 golf-ball sized tumors on his body-- all were benign fatty tumors. Unfortunately, cancer is common in dogs. Lymph enlargement due to infection is even more common. But basically you need to get the test done before deciding to put your dog to sleep.

Swollen Lymph nodes near the neck can cause loss of appetite and Not be cancer. Throwing up yellow "foam" with bile means a dog has no food in the stomach. Here is an explanation of a type of lymph infection causing loss of appetite from another site:

The term 'lymphadenopathy' refers to enlarged lymph nodes. Lymph nodes can be enlarged for many reasons including infections and cancers. 'Lymphadenitis' is the term used to describe lymph nodes which are enlarged due to infection or inflammation. Lymphadenitis is a non-cancerous condition. When an infection occurs, often the lymph nodes in the area adjacent to the infection become enlarged and inflamed. For instance, if a dog has a sore throat from an infection with Streptococcus bacteria, then commonly the lymph node closest to the infection will be enlarged, i.e., the submandibular lymph nodes (lymph nodes near the neck) and/or tonsils.

What are the symptoms?

With lymphadenitis, enlargement of one or more lymph nodes is the most common sign. Usually, with an infection, an elevated temperature is also present. Other signs depend on the area involved. For instance, a dog with a sore throat may also cough, drool, swallow repeatedly, and be reluctant to eat. Some of these signs could be caused by the enlarged lymph nodes interfering with swallowing. If an infection occurs in a rear foot, the lymph nodes further up the leg would be enlarged. Limping may occur not only because the foot is sore, but also because the nodes may be painful and muscle movement increases the discomfort.

What are the risks?

Lymphadenitis is usually not serious; assuming the infection is diagnosed and curable. In most cases, once the infection is cleared, the enlarged lymph nodes will return to normal size.

and the "cure?" simple antibiotics.

This is really something you should look at with a cold eye, without emotion. I actually do not think the Vet should have said what he said. The vet should have said (we won't know until we get the test results). To tell a person it is cancer, seems to immediately cause many to freak out as a first response. The fact is, you need to take the dog in, get the blood drawn, get the tests, and then deal with whether you need to decide to put it down or not.

[PaKettle]

Tough decision. I feel for you.

If you determine that your dog is definitely going to die from cancer, then I'd just treat him as good as possible until he starts to suffer, and then I'd try to get a vet (if your vet does not do this, maybe you can find one who does) come to your place to put him to sleep.

It is of course hard to put a loved pet to sleep, but I believe this is better than having him suffer. And paying several thousand dollars just to give him 6 months of possibly painful life makes no sense.

I had a friend die recently and was comforted by the thought that "no one gets out alive". It's just a matter of time for every living thing. And that most people who have technically died and come back report it as being a nice experience. And it depends on your beliefs of course, but most of us either believe in a Heaven or a rebirth, so either way, it really isn't so bad and certainly better than suffering.

[chpxiii]

The 80 dollars to have the tumor checked it just 20 more than the 60 dollars you were originally going to spend. I think you should get the blood test done at least.

[deletia]

This is really something you should look at with a cold eye, without emotion. I actually do not think the Vet should have said what he said. The vet should have said (we won't know until we get the test results). To tell a person it is cancer, seems to immediately cause many to freak out as a first response. The fact is, you need to take the dog in, get the blood drawn, get the tests, and then deal with whether you need to decide to put it down or not.

One Half Full has very practical advice. And she's right, the doctor shouldn't have called it until tests were done.

[HeatherB]

Thanks everyone. I'm actually starting to think he doctor may be wrong. I have thought about just trying antibiotics to see if that works. It just seems strange that he will have a few good days. I thought he would just get worse and worse and eventually die. It seems he has bad days and then great days (today I listened to him bark for 5 minutes straight while he ran back and forth to the different windows chasing a dog. Also he's been scratching at the door to potty, eating, and goes up and down stairs again!) So, the rollercoaster of emotions is big one as right now I am hopeful.

[my4devils]

No real advice- just wanted to offer some ((hugs)). We lost our border collie mix over the summer when he broke his leg. He died on the way to the vets office. We adopted him 4 years ago form the Humane Society and figured he was about 9 years old or so. We miss him everyday. I hope your fur baby gets better soon!

[chpxiii]

Heather, animals are funny creatures. Sometimes they don't realize they're hurt or even in pain, they can be so in the moment. If they're doing fine that moment, then they're running around chasing squirrels. But when they're in severe pain is when their symptoms and pain become noticeable to us.

My cat had to have knee surgery last summer. He was on a form of morphine for the pain. However, when he had just had his shot, he wanted to be up and running around as if nothing happened. Of course, I didn't let him. He was crated for 7 weeks. (Seven! A CAT in a crate! For SEVEN WEEKS!) Anyway...

Even my boyfriend's cat who had an abdominal tumour would have his good days and his bad days. On the good days my boyfriend's mother would be so hopeful.

You're right, it is an emotional rollercoaster. Get your Snoopy checked. I realize that $80 is a lot of money, but that can help with the emotional rollercoaster. Seriously. It does help to know test results.

{{{HUGS}}}

[erinb1975]

Do you think the symptoms might be a separate issue from the nodule? I only say this because I have 2 minpins as well, and this summer our female started vomiting bile, not eating, running a fever. She would do this for a few days at a time, and then act fine. We took her to a new vet (our old one constantly insisted on a 500.00 work up everytime we were there), this one being an "old country vet" . After listening to us regarding her symptoms, he diagnosed her with pancreatitis, which is very common in terrier type dogs, who are fed diets higher in fat.

We had been giving our dogs table food from time to time, and it seems that the symptoms did correlate with those times. We had to swtich both dogs to Prescription Diet I/D, not cheap at 60.00 for a 40lb bag, but it does the trick. Very few episodes now, usually when she gets into something in the yard.

Not sure if it is the same as what your dog is suffering from, but I thought it was worth a mention.

[FLBK7]

Do you think the symptoms might be a separate issue from the nodule? I only say this because I have 2 minpins as well, and this summer our female started vomiting bile, not eating, running a fever. She would do this for a few days at a time, and then act fine. We took her to a new vet (our old one constantly insisted on a 500.00 work up everytime we were there), this one being an "old country vet" . After listening to us regarding her symptoms, he diagnosed her with pancreatitis, which is very common in terrier type dogs, who are fed diets higher in fat.

We had been giving our dogs table food from time to time, and it seems that the symptoms did correlate with those times. We had to swtich both dogs to Prescription Diet I/D, not cheap at 60.00 for a 40lb bag, but it does the trick. Very few episodes now, usually when she gets into something in the yard.

Not sure if it is the same as what your dog is suffering from, but I thought it was worth a mention.

This was really interesting. It seems to reinforce what today's vets generally say about our pets' diets: Do NOT give table scraps or "people treats", ever.

But then again, I always had dogs and cats as pets when I was a child, and their diet consisted solely of table scraps. Whatever was left over from dinner, the pets got. And they lived healthy to a ripe old age with no problems. I was just discussing this with my sister recently, as a matter of fact.

I don't know if, like with humans, "progress" is causing more illnesses in animals. In my field, I see more and more cases of MS in young women, autism in children, and kidney failure unrelated to diabetes or obesity. It's disconcerting to say the least.

[FLBK7]

Thanks everyone. I'm actually starting to think he doctor may be wrong. I have thought about just trying antibiotics to see if that works. It just seems strange that he will have a few good days. I thought he would just get worse and worse and eventually die. It seems he has bad days and then great days (today I listened to him bark for 5 minutes straight while he ran back and forth to the different windows chasing a dog. Also he's been scratching at the door to potty, eating, and goes up and down stairs again!) So, the rollercoaster of emotions is big one as right now I am hopeful.

I'm a worrier by nature so when I read your original post I didn't want to say anything for fear of upsetting you even more. I'm glad I didn't post, although I should have sent you a {{{{{{{{HUG}}}}}}}}}}. Check out erinb1975's post below!

Let us know what happens. Scratch Snoopy behind the ears for me.

[stopthebleeding]

If you haven't filed yet put all the fees on a credit card i would what are they going to say you are trying to save your animal. But do what is best for your animal if he is suffering i believe you will do what needs to be done . I would put him down maybe . But without being in your shoes I can not say. Sorry that your baby is sick.

[dp1969]

Well, the last few weeks my dog had been sick. He was vomiting yellow bile (?) and acted like he didn't
So, every other day is a stuggle on what to do. Quality of life - what is the definition? Is it... life without pain and suffereing, or is it a "normal" life? I've been tempted to have him put to sleep. Then the next day he will act fine and I'll decide not to. It's a teeter-totter.
So, today I am sad. Grab your furbabies and hug them for me.

Heather,

I've gone through the lymphoma cancer with a dog and it's not a pretty sight.

First, I must ask that you consider getting the test-despite what most think, it can be painful to them.

Our dog was very lively and then one day he was just listless and wouldn't eat. Then came the vomiting of bile and diarrhea. I noticed that his neck was swollen, has lumps under his arm pits and in other places. We took him to the vet and the tests came back positive for canine lymphoma. We were given our scenarios and decided to go through the chemo. It was costly but we wanted to give it the "college" try. He was a very strong dog (pit bull) and the treatments knock him on his rear. The treatments were about 3 weeks and after all the vomiting, diarrhea and listlessness-the swelling subsided and he went back to his same "old" self. It was a thrilling time as we were not ready to let him go but then again, we felt a little selfish about feeling that way. The vet gave us 6-8 months and then the symptoms could return. 6 months to the day, they came back-with a vengeance. He was sicker than before. The vet said we could try another round of treatment but it wouldn't be as effective. We absolutely adored our dog so we started it again. This time, it didn't take so well. My breaking point was when I went out and he was trying to have a bowel movement but the lymph nodes in his rear were so swollen he couldn't push anything out. I called my husband, told him what we needed to do (he couldn't bear to sit in on the euthanasia) so I went with my sister. Our "pup" actually sighed (almost a relief sigh) went he finally left us on the exam table.
I went home to my husband (visibly shaken up) and all he could say was. "did we wait too long and was he in pain?". I thought about it and cried. It was a selfish decision on our parts and should have just decided (after the blood test) to put him, humanly, down.

I hope Snoopy doesn't have this but if so, double think the decision of the chemo. I wouldn't do it again. I'll pray for you and Snoopy.

Good Luck,
DP

[CindyLou]

If it comes down to it there are veterinarian that will come into your home put your animal to sleep....at least here in my area there are. This may be the way for your to go.

Good luck and I wil pray for your sweet Snoopy.

[danaf]

Having just gone through a scare with my yorkie - I'd say have the vet draw the fluid from the node and test it to be sure of what he has.

If my dog had cancer, I would let her live as long as possible until I started seeing a real daily struggle - and then I would put her down. I would not put her through chemo with no real chance of survival & plus - honestly - I just could not afford it. That is just me. But what I would do is change her diet - to Royal Canine, something of more quality and less fillers to try to help out while she's alive. (and in fact, that is what I am doing with my Yorkie). It's pricey but it is a choice.

I am truly sorry you are going through this and totally understand the emotions. We dearly love our pet companions for the unconditional love they give to us, sometimes and often more than people.