Posts to avoid bankruptcy?

[Avoid Bankruptc]

Are people encouraged to see forum 'Lifestyle Adjustments to prevent future BK' before filing bankruptcy? I see that the forum is in the 'after discharge' section but I think that it should be in the 'considering bankruptcy' section because it is to late to change spending/work habits after bankruptcy.

How can we encourage people to take steps NOW to avoid bankruptcy? I believe that 99% of bankruptcies could be avoided and would save lots of heartache and lawyers fees.

Thanks. Vote Libertarian.

[HenriettaHen]

"99% of bankruptcies could be avoided and would save lots of heartache and lawyers fees."

Yeah, and don't forget the innocent victims. heh heh God bless America!

hiya, Wade!

[Avoid Bankruptc]

Innocent victims.

What do you mean by innocent victims?

[BKTango]

While it's a great idea, I don't understand why it's needed in a "considering bankruptcy" category to advoid bankruptcy.

Most people here are already too far gone to try to advoid it, this is our last step, the final countdown to start all over. It is called the "bankruptcy forum" for a reason. It's about bankruptcy.

[whatamess]

First of all

Yes, many could have been avoided. However, what about illness with no insurance? Car accident injuries? Children born with severe problems? In case you dont know INSURANCE doesnt always pay, if your lucky enough to have it.
With your vote libertarian thing you threw out,
We are not all bleeding hearts here. mayabe some are and thats fine for them, but I am anti HMO, anti big gov, somewhere between libertarian and conservative. However, life can not be scripted and doo doo happens.
Unless you born rich, or are one of the lucky few that went to Harvard fully paid w/o loans from uncle sam, you have debt. Houses, health, children, they are all debt. Cars are debt too. They break. So is your gut. Got to feed it right? So in a sense we are all debt.
YES, I do feel we should be more focused on avoiding BR, but by the time we come here its way to late for most. It should start at a young age by example from parents. Most parents never teach kids about money. Kids think it grows on trees. Bank mommy & daddy.
WAM

[CPO]

Are people encouraged to see forum 'Lifestyle Adjustments to prevent future BK' before filing bankruptcy? I see that the forum is in the 'after discharge' section but I think that it should be in the 'considering bankruptcy' section because it is to late to change spending/work habits after bankruptcy.

How can we encourage people to take steps NOW to avoid bankruptcy? I believe that 99% of bankruptcies could be avoided and would save lots of heartache and lawyers fees.

Thanks. Vote Libertarian.

Why is it "to late" to change spending/work habits after bankruptcy?

Why is it that you assume that spending habits/work habits have anything to do with BK?

People are encouraged to study this entire forum and learn ALL of their options.

Please explain how 99% of all bankruptcy's could be avoided? I suspect your sense of reality is skewed. Perhaps a minor study of the applicable reasons for BK in the first place is in order.

A good read of the Congressional testimony offered to our Representatives before application of the "new law" will educate you on the reasons most individuals file for BK. "Financial catastrophy" is a very common phrase in this legislation, not "spending/work habits."

Legislation was enacted to prevent abuse of the system. A slight reduction in BK's was reported initially (thought to allow for a working knowledge of law and time for local procedures to be modified) yet the number of BK's has remained relatively stable in the last decade or so.

Is it possible that your mindset is of the banker/big business owner?

...corporations that use bankruptcy law as merely another tool to mold and trim excess expenses and render debt uncollectable to guarantee profit?

?

CPO

[CurtInKS]

...because it is to late to change spending/work habits after bankruptcy.

Really? Do you honestly believe that?

How can we encourage people to take steps NOW to avoid bankruptcy? I believe that 99% of bankruptcies could be avoided and would save lots of heartache and lawyers fees.

Nonsense. You need to check your numbers. I get a funny feeling you bow at the altar of Dave Ramsey.

a

[DeadManCrawling]

In general agreement with all the other posts. I see the original author's point, but by the time people arrive here, it is often too late to make significant changes.

Now, had you encountered me at my home, say, three years ago, we might have had something to talk about.

How can I "change my spending habits" in this scenario:

I make 10k per month, so that's decent income.

My hard expenses (mortgage, insurance, frugal groceries, and so forth) add up to 9.8k per month.

I already work 70 hours a week, and suffer from back problems that will require surgery.

With 85k in credit card debt and perhaps another 30k in medical debt, on that income, exactly WHICH spending habit should I change. The interest rates are all at 33% now, so easy math to do. Figure another 4k or so per month on just the interest, 5k with penalties.

If you can show me a place in my figures where I can scrape another 5k outta thin air every month, and show me how to do it each month over the 17 years it takes to pay this back, you are not just good, you are freaking HOUDINI.

You will say, sell the house, eat less, blah blah blah. Try to sell a house in Florida right now. Not easy. The absorption rate in the real estate market here now exceeds 500 days.

And we don't have any other "luxury" expenses, none at all.

Perhaps the idea of avoiding this would have worked-5 years ago. By the time we arrived on this site, it was simply too late.

Your advice is well-intentioned, I am sure, but would be more helpful to a site geared toward "financial planning" in general, rather than bankruptcy.

We will be selling the house, I am sure, but that would do little to help us right now, facing the mound of debt we have. And our spending habits have changed, quite a bit.

You ARE correct, though about one thing. If we could avoid it, there sure would be some savings in heartache and lawyer fees. I sure wish that was the case for us.

I have yet to meet anyone who has ENJOYED the process of bk, at least among filers. It truly is a last resort, for normal people. We are, in general, folks who made some bad moves financially, got conned by business partners, made bad business decisions, or suffered from factors beyond our control, like a medical disaster or changing business climate. I wish it was as easy as simply saying "I don't wanna file bk." If I could wave that magic wand and make it all better I would.

I have been in denial long enough, and now is actually the time I am waking up.

best wishes,

-dmc

[DeadManCrawling]

And for the moderators, as long as this person doesn't flame, I ENJOY a good debate or discussion.

Please keep the string alive, as long as he/she doesn't become abusive. At least, I would like that.

[SinkingFast]

The OP of this thread has been banned.

This person is a repeat spammer, creating mulitple User ID's to wreak havoc on the people who come here for support and information.

Hopefully this person will read this comment,...............

If you (Common Man, Common Man7, and now Avoid Bankruptc) repeat in registering a new ID, your ISP will be contacted. Internet abuse is a crime.

[DeadManCrawling]

Ah, that's too bad. Well, I figured as much, but hoped for a decent debate of the matter, without all that other foolishness.

[JRScott]

I agree with the others, by the time I got to this place it was to late....no way to save myself from bankruptcy.

However as part of a bankruptcy you are required now to take a financial management course, which indeed brings up some of the same points that Dave Ramsey does.

I'll be honest if I'd heard of and read his books 7 or 8 years ago I probably could have avoided my situation. However my situation by the time I'd even heard of him, which was well after I found this site, was to the point that no amount of snowball or other situation would prevent a bankruptcy. If I'd read them 3 or 4 years ago I might could have pulled myself out of the situation, but for the last 2 years its really be so far gone that it wouldn't be possible.

Just some info on me. I live in a very economically depressed area, I make just barely over a third of my state's median income. Having had 2 back injuries in the past that prevent heavy physical labor and even really limits moderate physical labor I have little opportunity to improve my earnings, nor can I physically work two jobs as I did some in my younger days due to the limits. I've relatively known that I should have filed for bankruptcy since 2005, but I didn't want to, I tried but just kept getting myself in deeper. I've actually not used any credit cards in the last 2 years, just use my debit card. It was really just to late.

[Beach Bum]

Well, the only bad decisions we made was to buy a $550K condo in Orange County, CA in 2005 at the top of a market using a Neg Am Loan. As well as using CC's to make home improvements and pay the bills was a mistake too.

We should of just kept saving that 10% down payment we used instead of loosing it to the housing crash's depreciation.

Guess we should of educated ourselves a little more in real estate.

[lrprn]

Are people encouraged to see forum 'Lifestyle Adjustments to prevent future BK' before filing bankruptcy?

Let's think about what you just said....since we're a bankruptcy board. 99.9% of people don't come here until they are in way, WAY too deep to avoid filing - something you would realize if you would stop rejoining this forum under new names and actually read the posts here for a month.

It always looks easy from the outside when all you are interested in is pigeon-holing all of us into your neat, narrow scheme of life. Just ain't that easy in the real world, AB (and all your other identities here that have already been banned). Glad to see that SF has banned you yet again.

Now here's some advice for YOU. When are you going to invest that all-knowing attitude of yours into something that might actually do some good? Go donate your time to a homeless shelter or a soup kitchen. Volunteer to help people down on their luck with their taxes or clean up their homes and yards. THAT is helpful. Offering anonymous advice to people who already are quite aware of their mistakes and intend to correct them or know that they did nothing personally to cause their financial misfortunes (catatrophic illness, divorce, job loss, etc) is arrogant and condescending to the extreme. Think long and hard about the deficiencies in your own character that lead you to do this - it's a sad waste of human energy better channeled to somewhere far more productive than shooting captive fish in a barrel here to get your jollies, troll.

[violetcat65]

I agree 100%, some people need to GET A LIFE and stop acting like their stuff don't smell. We are all human and make mistakes and bad decisions so there is no one out there who can point a finger and say otherwise.