Political Discussion

[PoorGrammyinBK7]

Guess no one has an answer...

[JRScott]

Great picture.

I also have a question, regarding the recent "stimulus bill":

When you or I are up to our eyeballs in debt (as most of us on this board are or have been) - has anyone - ANYONE - ever advised us to go out and SPEND, SPEND, SPEND to get ourselves out of it?

I'm just sayin'....

No actually that's the wrong thing to do, any personal economist will tell you that. All of the major folks that talk about the economy tell you to stop spending beyond your means.

Sadly the government hasn't learned the lesson, and sad for all of us is that by the time they do it'll be to late.

[6ftladycop]

Regardless what the stimulus package does or does not do, nobody will be able to help get themselves out of debt except the person who got in it. We as american people are always looking for someone to do what we should have been doing ourselves. Even in the Bush administration, I can honestly say that he never helped me do a dog gone thing....and popular or not, I.m not looking for the new president or his administration to do anything for me either. Most of what any of them are interested in doing is supplying money to these companies so that they can either keep the people already working for them or hire them back. And in case of homes, either provide a way for homeowners to borrow money again and get credit to prevent from losing homes in foreclosure or something similar to that. To be honest, as americans if you look at it, we still have to pay back anything we get anyway...nothing is free and we would still have to work at improving our spending.

[BankruptPinoy]

Using America to destroy America by David Icke

Hello all ...

I met a lady in the United States last week who told me the story of what happened to her in 1970. It is a sobering confirmation of the long-term planning behind the conspiracy to enslave the population of this planet.

She lived in Florida at the time and she was a customer of the Bank of America which suddenly insisted that she put her thumbprint on every cheque. She was furious and protested loudly at what she saw as an infringement of her liberties.

The manager of her Bank of America branch invited her to meet him to discuss her complaints and, since then, what he told her that day has unfolded with the years, just as he said it would.

The manager said that she should not think that putting her thumbprint on a cheque was such a big deal given what was planned to be introduced gradually over the decades to follow. He said it was planned that there would be a massive expansion in the use of credit cards and eventually these would be replaced by electronic tags under the skin. He also said that surveillance cameras were going to be installed in the streets and across the road system and the time would come when technology would track everyone wherever they went.

So, he said, it really wasn't worth complaining about a thumbprint when all that was coming anyway.



Everything the bank manager told the lady in 1970 has happened or is happening. How did he know? He must have been connected to the secret society network at a high enough level to be privy to such information - or had friends that were.

It was also in 1970 that Zbigniew Brzezinski, the mentor of Barack Obama, published these words in his book, Between Two Ages: America's Role in the Technetronic Era:

'The technetronic era involves the gradual appearance of a more controlled society. Such a society would be dominated by an elite, unrestrained by traditional values. Soon it will be possible to assert almost continuous surveillance over every citizen and maintain up-to-date complete files containing even the most personal information about the citizen. These files will be subject to instantaneous retrieval by the authorities.'

In other words the march, now a sprint, towards the totalitarian society is not being made up as its advocates go along. It has all been planned in meticulous detail for at least decades and, I would say, far longer.

So those who think that President Obama has come along as an independent voice to bring about 'change' for the benefit of the people might consider taking another look at him and his agenda before they are scammed even further. The idea that this 'genuine' guy has beaten the system to become president is utterly ludicrous. He is a carefully prepared place-man installed to serve his masters.

I am hearing even some of those who supported Obama and bought the lie now questioning his judgement in the people 'he' has appointed to his administration. It reads like a membership list of insider groupings like the Council on Foreign Relations, Trilateral Commission and the Bilderberg Group.

But 'Obama's' appointments are not bad judgement at all if you know what he, and more importantly those who own him, are seeking to achieve. I have been in America since just before Obama's inauguration and I have watched events unfold in the way you watch a movie for the second time. In other words, you know what's coming.

A television show cut together Obama's inauguration speech with that of George Bush and showed them to be almost identical in theme; and the same is true of what Mr. Change has done in word and deed since he took office. It is vital to read the small print with Obama and not just listen to his vacuous on-the-autocue generalisations and sound-bites.

This week Obama has employed the same Problem-Reaction-Solution techniques used by Bush to force through the spending of staggering amounts of borrowed money that will, as planned, destroy the American economy and therefore American society as we know it.

Last September George Bush addressed the nation to sell a plan to transfer almost a trillion dollars from the American people, or through loans that will have to be met by the American people, to the banking system that had engineered the financial crisis. The technique he used? Of course - fear:

'The government's top economic experts warn that, without immediate action by Congress, America could slip into a financial panic and a distressing scenario would unfold.

More banks could fail, including some in your community. The stock market would drop even more, which would reduce the value of your retirement account. The value of your home could plummet. Foreclosures would rise dramatically.

And if you own a business or a farm, you would find it harder and more expensive to get credit. More businesses would close their doors, and millions of Americans could lose their jobs.'

This week, Obama went on television with a news conference and public meetings to sell what amounts to spending, when all is added together, up to three trillion dollars in borrowed money. This would be handed to the banking system and spent on projects to 'stimulate the economy'. The technique he used? Of course - fear:

'Economists from across the spectrum have warned that if we don't act immediately, millions more jobs will be lost, and national unemployment rates will approach double digits. More people will lose their homes and their health care. And our nation will sink into a crisis that, at some point, we may be unable to reverse.'

Those words of Bush and Obama could have been written by the same people and were in terms of the ultimate source.

What we are looking at here is a presidential version of Problem-Reaction-Solution with Bush brought in to front-up the creation of massive economic problems and overseas wars and then, with the people in fear and under stress, the golden boy Obama has been installed to offer the 'solutions'.

As with the Bush bank 'bail-out' and Orwellian 'Patriot' Act, Obama has sought to force through his multi-trillion dollar suicide note with as little debate and oversight as possible by stressing the urgent need to implement his plans immediately.

The Bush regime threatened politicians who questioned his bail out bill with martial law on American streets if they didn't play ball. This week, Obama went directly to the people to put pressure on the doubters on Capitol Hill to bend to his will. As USA Today put it:

'Under fire in Washington, he scheduled campaign-style town-hall meetings to make the case for his huge economic stimulus bill to folks in Elkhart, Ind., and Fort Myers, Fla. He dismissed the Republican opposition as the business-as-usual crowd. He relied on his rhetorical skills and popularity.'

That's Obama's key role for the cabal - to exploit his massively-hyped popularity to get enough of the people behind him to turn Congress and the Senate into vehicles for his will. If you are not with him, you must be against America.

The man is the most blatant of frauds and it was stomach-turning to see him this week patronising and kissing a black lady with serious financial troubles while a white woman nearby, her face filled with religious awe, mouthed the words 'I love you Barack'. Pass the sickbag.

What we are seeing here, under the guise of 'saving' America, is the calculated destruction of America. The insane amounts of borrowed money in the 'Obama' plan and that of his Treasury Secretary, the Zionist Tim Geithner (Bilderberg Group, Trilateral Commission, Council on Foreign Relations), will not work for one simple reason: It is not meant to work.

And when it doesn't - as the Bush bail-out didn't - then what? The armoury would be empty, just as it is planned to be.

I have been saying for years now that America is being used to destroy America. It has been used to instigate and fight Illuminati wars of conquest while being systematically undermined militarily and financially. The reason is simple: there is no place for a superpower in the New World Order of centralised global control.

This is the graphic I have been using for nearly 15 years to explain the political and military structure of the planned Orwellian global state:


So much of what is happening today can be understood from this structure alone. The Illuminati are working towards a world government dictatorship that would control every country. That can't happen while there are still superpowers with the military and financial might to resist the will of the world government.

The aim is to destroy all superpowers through financial collapse and war and so force them to become mere fiefdoms of the global tyranny. That's why we are seeing the United States of America systematically dismantled through war and financial catastrophe.

The same theme is also related to the second tier of that edifice of centralised power - the superstates that are planned to be the regional control-structure for the world government. These include a European Union-style American Union for the whole of the Americas.

The first stage of this was the creation of the free trade zone called NAFTA, the North American Free Trade Agreement between the United States, Canada and Mexico. Next is planned to be a North American Union with a single currency to replace the US and Canadian dollars and the Mexican peso and the end of border controls.

You will see Obama pushing for this as a way out of the financial mess that his controllers have created and, once again, this could only be forced through if there are enormous problems that the people are manipulated to believe can only be solved by handing American sovereignty to a North American superstate.

Under the world government you can see a world central bank and this is another crucial reason for the current global financial collapse. We are already seeing the establishment of a world central bank being proposed to solve the crisis and 'stop this happening again'.

I have described in my books over the years the boom and bust techniques of the Illuminati which throw the fishing line out to catch the people and then reel them in. It goes like this:

1) You keep interest rates down and have the banking system make vast numbers of loans, even to the point where almost anyone can get credit. This has the effect of putting enormous amounts of money into circulation.

As this money is spent it creates an economic boom as buying and thus production increases. Public and business confidence leads to a massive increase in debt as people borrow more to buy homes, cars, and so on, and businesses borrow more to increase capacity and production to meet demand.

Once you have reached the point of optimum debt you simply crash the system. You do this by taking money out of circulation through banks no longer lending what passes for money on anything like the scale they did before.

This is the same old, same old, technique that has been used to create the present financial problems now in search of solutions. Almost anyone could get credit at one stage in this 'cycle' and the ability to meet the payments were hardly a consideration (hence the 'sub-prime' mortgage debacle). This has been followed by a 'credit crunch' - taking money out of circulation.

Businesses are folding and millions losing their livelihood because there is not enough money in circulation any longer to buy what they were producing. And when you control the banks you control how much money is in circulation - you control the entire game.

But this is not your usual run-of-the-mill financial crisis to trawl the assets of the people for the Illuminati families that own the banks and financial houses. This is the 'Big One' they have been working towards that will create such a global financial crash that the masses will support the entire restructuring of the system to impose centralised global control of all finance.

The collapse in the value of currencies also opens the way for new and fewer currencies that are designed to lead to a single world currency that would be purely electronic. Through this, a global computer would decide who could access 'money' and who could not. We are well on the way to that as cash goes out of circulation all the time in the face of competition from plastic cards and eventually the microchip.



This is why the fantastic spending plans of the Obama government and others around the world, like the United Kingdom, will not work because they are not meant to work. But what they will do is drown those countries in a tidal wave of debt that they will not be able to pay and thus they will be at the mercy of their creditors.

China virtually owns the United States because of the money borrowed from the Chinese dictatorship and where are at least most of these Obama trillions going to come from? China.

What happens to America and its people when they can no longer meet the debt repayments and China wants either its money or physical assets to the same value? It is worth noting that Obama's mentor and controller, the Trilateral Commission co-founder, Zbigniew Brzezinski, wants a war involving the United States, China and Russia, among others.

One other aspect of the plan is to encourage the population, through agent provocateurs and front organisations, to riot in the streets over the economic depression and so justify the introduction of martial law, the military used in domestic law enforcement, and the opening of prison (concentration) camps to deal with the dissidents and rioters. We are already seeing such riots in countries like France.

The prison camps are in place in the United States under the control of the Federal Emergency Management Agency, or FEMA. I have been exposing this Illuminati front since the mid-1990s and it is no coincidence whatsoever that still new laws are now passing through Capitol Hill to give FEMA the right to use these camps for people under the guise of responding to terrorist attacks or natural disasters.

Put 'FEMA camps' into a search engine to find out more about these installations and click here ( http://www.govtrack.us/congress/bill...?bill=h111-645 ) for more on H. R. 645, the current bill 'To direct the Secretary of Homeland Security to establish national emergency centers on military installations'.

We have to be street-wise and realise that rioting will not only be ineffective, it offers the authorities the excuse they need to introduce a fully-fledged Police State. It is not rioting that we need, it is the people ceasing to co-operate with the system that seeks to enslave them.

Communities across America, and the wider world, need to start now to create their own means of economic exchange as the money-system is coldly collapsed. We need to realise that the solutions proposed by Obama and others will not work because they are not meant to work and instead of sitting around in the mode of 'hope' or wait-and-see we need to get organised - and fast.

Check out how the Local Exchange and Trading System (LETS) works to overcome the limitations of barter when the money system has collapsed - click here ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Local_E...rading_Systems ). People need to get together now and come up with their own ideas to keep economic activity and essential production going in the face of what is to come.

I have said many times since the banking crisis came to the surface last year that the present economic situation can be likened to those controlled demolitions that you see (like the Twin Towers). You see the charges go off and then there is a strange split second when nothing seems to happen before the building collapses in seconds.

We are in that 'split second' now in terms of the global economy. The charges have gone off and we can see that we have a problem, but the building has not yet begun to fall on anything like the scale that is planned.

We need to start thinking about and organising community alternatives to the money system because these crazies have no intention of 'solving' the present crisis until they have pummelled humanity into the centralised money-system that I have warned about for so long.

The longer we wait and 'hope' the harder it will be and that's another of Obama's major contributions to his masters' agenda - to use 'hope' as a way of buying time, (buying non-action by the people) until it's too late.

We must not allow him to do it.

[FLBK7]

Using America to destroy America by David Icke

Hello all ...

I met a lady in the United States last week who told me the story of what happened to her in 1970. It is a sobering confirmation of the long-term planning behind the conspiracy to enslave the population of this planet.

She lived in Florida at the time and she was a customer of the Bank of America which suddenly insisted that she put her thumbprint on every cheque. She was furious and protested loudly at what she saw as an infringement of her liberties.

The manager of her Bank of America branch invited her to meet him to discuss her complaints and, since then, what he told her that day has unfolded with the years, just as he said it would.

Once again Icke writes without checking facts. It almost seems like he makes it all up as he goes along. Bank of America did not exist in 1970, and much less in Florida.

The Bank of America organization that exists today is the successor to North Carolina National Bank (marketed as "NCNB"). In 1998, NationsBank acquired BankAmerica and adopted the name of the acquired bank, renaming the corporation "Bank of America", and retaining Charlotte, North Carolina as its headquarters.

[Bandit]

What we are looking at here is a presidential version of Problem-Reaction-Solution with Bush brought in to front-up the creation of massive economic problems and overseas wars and then, with the people in fear and under stress, the golden boy Obama has been installed to offer the 'solutions'.

As with the Bush bank 'bail-out' and Orwellian 'Patriot' Act, Obama has sought to force through his multi-trillion dollar suicide note with as little debate and oversight as possible by stressing the urgent need to implement his plans immediately.

obamawonder is a big fat loser...he sure did fool the fools for votes & plans much like bushboy did! lie after lie and dumb ass plans that an eight year old could explain clearly how they will never work...even a child could pick up on his lies.

A screwed up facist, in debt out of work country is what you get, when you have a bunch of idiots who keep voting for & believing in the same two party system every election. A system of freaks, out for themselves ONLY who only create more problems for the same people who elect them into congress & the white house!

[HRx]

obamawonder is a big fat loser...he sure did fool the fools for votes & plans much like bushboy did! lie after lie and dumb ass plans that an eight year old could explain clearly how they will never work...even a child could pick up on his lies.

A screwed up facist, in debt out of work country is what you get, when you have a bunch of idiots who keep voting for & believing in the same two party system every election. A system of freaks, out for themselves ONLY who only create more problems for the same people who elect them into congress & the white house!

lol

[FLBK7]

obamawonder is a big fat loser...he sure did fool the fools for votes & plans much like bushboy did! lie after lie and dumb ass plans that an eight year old could explain clearly how they will never work...even a child could pick up on his lies.

A screwed up facist, in debt out of work country is what you get, when you have a bunch of idiots who keep voting for & believing in the same two party system every election. A system of freaks, out for themselves ONLY who only create more problems for the same people who elect them into congress & the white house!

Welcome back, Bandit. I've missed you!

Now tell us how you REALLY feel........................

[HRx]

The country was in a massive world of mess before Obama took over...and it's going to take several years to iron out just a handful of the major issues. So far Obama definitely seems to have American's best interest in mind...despite differences in opinion in his methods of getting the country squared away. More importantly, it isn't like any of the independent candidates would be doing better than Obama either. lol

[JRScott]

I don't see Obama doing what needs to be done.

His proposed budget for 2010 is 33% higher than the 2009 budget which is 8% higher than the 2008 budget when the rate of inflation was only 4%.

He failed to stand up to Congress and Veto a pork laden bill which had he vetoed it the government agencies would still have been funded but only a the previous years budget.

He has nominated more tax dodgers to his cabinet than any president in history.

In essence he's proving what I said all along, he's a politician and nothing more.

I believe Barr or Baldwin would have vetoed the stimulus bill (which isn't helping and won't for 3-4 years in most cases) and the budget bill. McKinney and Moore probably would have signed both as Obama has. You can't lump all the third party candidates into just one lump, as they were from vastly differing political beliefs.

Obama is on route to spend money even faster than George W. Bush did. If he continues to spend money as he has these first 50 some days then most likely by the time he leaves office the United States credit rating will be lowered which will cause hyperinflation in our nation as the dollar suffers deflation abroad. With politicians I don't go on what they promise I go on what they do.

I do agree the problem has been mounting for years, but it wasn't just the Bush Years. In the last 50 years our budget has only had positive numbers 4 times, once under Nixon and three times under Clinton. We have yet to pay off the debts from WWII which ended over 60 years ago. We have massive unfunded liabilities in medicare, medicaid and social security that is a greater economic problem than the current crisis.

At the present rate he's spending money Obama could well exceed the six fold increase of the national debt that was seen in the 1940s.

[nathan786]

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[newbeginning]

phew, what a mess, huh?

contrary to many, this mess we're in has been in the making for decades! big government, little government, the argument is silly... neither party has ever believed in "smaller" government. they just go about spending our money in different, self-serving ways.

my concerns:

1. too many goods, companies owned by COMMUNIST China. Ironic huh? we're being propped-up (financially) by the Chinese and in return, we're getting lot's of cheap and suspicious products laden with who knows what chemicals, etc.

2. the American corporate world has been slowly, but surely formulating plans to increase profits at the expense of the American people for decades. corporations have only convenient loyalty to the USA.

3. we've lived under the strange and poisoned idea that CAPITALISM is great! Unfortunately, capitalism w/o sound checks and balances against unbridled greed is doomed to fail and is failing. too bad ALL of our politicians come from a socio-economic stratus that is determined to maintain as much of the status-quo as possible to continue a system that vastly rewards the already haves...

4. we've had record, obscene deficits for decades... hmmmm.....neither party was serious about correcting it in the past....hmmmm.....now some are complaining that it's going to be the "end of the world" with the projected deficit....hmmmm....sounds familiar

5. balanced budget amendment.....what a joke! comparing states (who get billions from the federal government to help ease their budget issues) with the federal government is ludicrous

6. we've been living off the backs of low-wage 2nd and 3rd world countries to our detriment. while we have been working towards expanding and raising our standard AND COST of living, jobs leave our country to be given to those who are eager to do the same work for far less.... we only have ourselves to blame for this....

7. isn't anyone dismayed by the fact that the people who carry-out these deceptive, confusing, absurd banking, financing practices are likely the neighbor next door? what about the masses of people who are not executives? were or are they ALL so dumb that they couldn't see this happening? or all so satisfied that they were getting a paycheck, so didn't bother question?????

eesh. this whole thing ticks me off. the "do-absolutely-nothing Republicans-but-criticize-and-hope-Obama-fails-at-the-expense-of-the-welfare-of-this-country" are worthless! the "who-knows-what-Democrats" are a joke!

I better stop....

[thefiredevil]

hahaha I love the Obama poster in the previous post.... just hoping that all the changes he promised will soon be realized

[Bandit]

The country was in a massive world of mess before Obama took over...and it's going to take several years to iron out just a handful of the major issues. So far Obama definitely seems to have American's best interest in mind...despite differences in opinion in his methods of getting the country squared away. More importantly, it isn't like any of the independent candidates would be doing better than Obama either. lol

More importantly, obamy does not give two cents about your best interest no more than bushy did.

You can't say that about the independents until after they have been given a chance and a fair chance -BUT! we can say without a doubt what the two party system is all about and it is that system that got us into these messes decade after decade to begin with through brainwashing and fear, not the independents.

phew, what a mess, huh?

contrary to many, this mess we're in has been in the making for decades! big government, little government, the argument is silly... neither party has ever believed in "smaller" government. they just go about spending our money in different, self-serving ways.

Exactly. Everyone in the two party only system needs to be fired and then shot.

[Bandit]

Welcome back, Bandit. I've missed you!

Now tell us how you REALLY feel........................

I got real fed up with the politics, gross personal insults & false accusations on this forum and lost interest. It took me a year to see through some of the fakey crap in some of the leadership. It aint all that it is cracked up to be. and I got tired of reading spamola in every thread... and... that is how I really feel and that is what happens when the same idea/persons rule a place for too long.

Though there are a handful of people I like to say hello to from time to time and one in particular who changed my life for the better. Thanks for the kind greeting and the same to you, FLBK7.