Leadership Missing, incompetence at hand

[albacore44]

Sudan, etc does not buy US products - .

True, I'll give you that.I have been to Sudan, so I know. But Ethiopia their neighbor does. In fact I just got back from there. They are still 3rd world. Think 1040's Mexico. But they are developing rapidly, and are anxious to become the dominant economy in that region of africa. They will. We are, and we will do business with them. Same with Nigeria. The world is flat folks, it's a whole new ball game. and if we dont learn to play, we will be left behind

[IamOld]

I'm sorry but the Germans, the French, the Japanese, are NOT playing by the financial suicide rules, and they're doing far far...better...

True, I'll give you that.I have been to Sudan, so I know. But Ethiopia their neighbor does. In fact I just got back from there. They are still 3rd world. Think 1040's Mexico. But they are developing rapidly, and are anxious to become the dominant economy in that region of africa. They will. We are, and we will do business with them. Same with Nigeria. The world is flat folks, it's a whole new ball game. and if we dont learn to play, we will be left behind

[albacore44]

I'm sorry but the Germans, the French, the Japanese, are NOT playing by the financial suicide rules, and they're doing far far...better...

So I assume you mean they dont buy from us do to protectionism ?? Not true. California has the finest Citris (oranges) in the world. The Japanese consumer is very picky. They demand the best. so our growers export the whole crop to Japan where they get top dollar. That crap you buy in you local market comes from Brazil or Mexico. Same for commercial aircraft one of our largest exports. Japan is a big importer of aircraft, one of our best exports. There is a couple of examples for you. There are many more

[jacko]

Much better. They still have a middle class. The middle class over there don't eat their own like they do here. Unions and sensible regulation has made them what they are. We are not a forward looking nation. My Yankee folks live in SW Virginia. What a backwards region it is. What will they do when gas hits $6.

I'm sorry but the Germans, the French, the Japanese, are NOT playing by the financial suicide rules, and they're doing far far...better...

[IamOld]

Excellent point!! Really - the thing is there are products that one nation can produce that another one cannot-oranges from CA are one of these things - those are logical to import/export. Also on the East Coast we tend to get oranges from FL...when possible...

So I assume you mean they dont buy from us do to protectionism ?? Not true. California has the finest Citris (oranges) in the world. The Japanese consumer is very picky. They demand the best. so our growers export the whole crop to Japan where they get top dollar. That crap you buy in you local market comes from Brazil or Mexico. Same for commercial aircraft one of our largest exports. Japan is a big importer of aircraft, one of our best exports. There is a couple of examples for you. There are many more

[AngelinaCatHub]

It's only (our) money

Just ONE of the reasons we are still in the mess we are in and are going to stay in longer. Get wise Dems and Reps, vote for our Country next time, not for your Party. 'Hub

[banca rotta]

While remembering the tragedy of what happened ten years ago today and those we lost I also feel that 9/11/01 played a huge role in the horrible shape of the economy today.

At that time we were going through a difficult recession from the dot bomb bust and just after 9/11 Greenspan's reaction was to cut interest rates to record lows which created the worlds biggest real estate asset bubble which we are still feeling the effects of it's "big bang".

I always wondered if 9/11 never happened would we be in this shape. Keep in mind we not only blew up this big bubble, but we blew the federal budget to oblivion fighting two wars with two tax cuts and now the first of 78 million baby boomers are collecting benefits.

Just makes me wonder of Bin Laden lost the battle, but won the war. After all his main objective was to put America in the shape it's currently in between a faltering Economy, the groping at the Airports and our fallen heroes.

[feelingnutsy]

I often feel like the terrorists achieved their objectives---in the ways that you've named---banca rotta.

[msm859]

I often feel like the terrorists achieved their objectives---in the ways that you've named---banca rotta.

I agree. There objective was to cause us financial ruin and take away our freedoms. We have handed them victory on a silver platter. $2 trillion spent on wars, Patriot Act, Homeland Security, torturing people, molestation at airports etc. Our freedoms have decreased and our standard of living for most Americans have gone down. We need to get out of the 20th century mentality -- they are NOT after our land -- they are after our freedom. If we want to win the war on terror, become energy independent and get out of the Middle East. Repeal the Patriot Act -- something they say they need to protect us from terrorists and then use to take down a New York governor for prostitution. America is losing the war.

[AngelinaCatHub]

While remembering the tragedy of what happened ten years ago today and those we lost I also feel that 9/11/01 played a huge role in the horrible shape of the economy today.

At that time we were going through a difficult recession from the dot bomb bust and just after 9/11 Greenspan's reaction was to cut interest rates to record lows which created the worlds biggest real estate asset bubble which we are still feeling the effects of it's "big bang".

I always wondered if 9/11 never happened would we be in this shape. Keep in mind we not only blew up this big bubble, but we blew the federal budget to oblivion fighting two wars with two tax cuts and now the first of 78 million baby boomers are collecting benefits.

Just makes me wonder of Bin Laden lost the battle, but won the war. After all his main objective was to put America in the shape it's currently in between a faltering Economy, the groping at the Airports and our fallen heroes.

I agree.

I often feel like the terrorists achieved their objectives---in the ways that you've named---banca rotta.

I agree.

I agree. There objective was to cause us financial ruin and take away our freedoms. We have handed them victory on a silver platter. $2 trillion spent on wars, Patriot Act, Homeland Security, torturing people, molestation at airports etc. Our freedoms have decreased and our standard of living for most Americans have gone down. We need to get out of the 20th century mentality -- they are NOT after our land -- they are after our freedom. If we want to win the war on terror, become energy independent and get out of the Middle East. Repeal the Patriot Act -- something they say they need to protect us from terrorists and then use to take down a New York governor for prostitution. America is losing the war.

I REALLY agree.

The USA has been the Savior as well as Police Department of all the World. It is time to pull it all in. The reason we are/have become the major target of Islamic cracked pots across two oceans, is that we once represented freedom and success. As noted above, our freedoms are going away, our success certainly is, and the Muslim's just love our current president.

If they can show the World that they can control us with terror, other countries will fall without a fight. Basically, a war of terror is not so much to kill people (although it helps) but to terrorize many. It does not take a New York style catastrophe. IF they could build one small nuke, blow it up in some waste land with the announcement that on x day a nuke is going up in the desert, then it does, that would cause terrorism that would stop almost all traffic of every kind. It would be the coupe de grace of their efforts. 'Hub

[JackBondLove]

"1. Cut taxes for the job makers (what Obama refers to as THE RICH.)" Is this guy insane? They already basically have the lowest tax rate since WWII. If you believe this I have a chocolate cake diet that allows you to eat all you want and still lose weight. Supply side economics does NOT work. We had the perfect A/B test. Tax rates under Clinton and those under Bush. Corporations are sitting on record profits - they don't need a tax cut (although reducing the rate to @28% and closing loopholes would be appropriate). The "job creators" are the middle class. They are the ones that buy the goods and services that support our economy - the rich do not. There is a systemic problem with the concentration of wealth in so few. America prospered so much after WWII because of the growing strength and education of the middle class. That has all been in decline for the last several decades. You want to fix the current problem be a realist. Terminate ALL of the Bush tax cuts now! Declare war on energy dependence and create American manufacturing jobs to be a leader in green jobs. End all of the wars now!. Amend the bankruptcy laws to allow people to include their first mortgage so that it can be crammed down to FMV. Perhaps that would get banks to be serious about loan modifications. Declare any compensation package over $1 million to not be a reasonable business expense and thus taxable to a corporation. Require any compensation package that exceeds 100x the average salary for that company to be taxed at higher progressive rates and require approval of the stock holders. Greed has taken over this country. And they are going to kill the real goose that laid the golden egg -- the middle class.

So are you a Leninist or a Maoist? I consider myself to be more of a Trostkyist,

[shark66]

So are you a Leninist or a Maoist? I consider myself to be more of a Trostkyist,

It doesn't sound to me like msm859 would fit in any of these groups.

I have yet to find any mention of firing squads and mass executions, and I read his/hers posts with utmost care, although we often disagree.

Without firing squads, mass graves and torture chambers, there is no Maoism, Leninism - let alone Trotskyism - which, thank God, never reached its full deadly potential...

What I'm seeing in msm859's post sounds more like middle-of-the-road Labour party independents before Lady Thatcher showed up as an enemy...

My $0.02 only...

Good luck to us all.

[jjim120]

"This economy will not have a real turn around until the foreclosures stop and we make fundamental changes that stops the unbridled greed that is decimating the middle class."

Indeed! For a good example of this greed, there is news in the St. Louis Biz Journal that details the actions and crookedness of the banking and real estate industry in that city. It seems that one of the "golden boys" of banking in that city had amassed a fortune in real property through multiple corporations set up with his friends and colleagues to purchase foreclosed properties for nearly nothing. It appears that the schemes involved borrowing money from his banking buddies at other banks to purchase the foreclosed properties in at least 20 different corporate names. Additionally, the process of moving from from bank to bank in high positions may have set up the knowledge of just which properties could be made vulnerable to foreclosure, including when a developer-partner had health or personal problems that would make him amenable to fraudulent practice. The properties range from big developments like one that Bank of America loaned $10.2 million on, to residential developments with both houses and raw land financed through loans at multiple other banks. The schemes appear to be unraveling as the various banks are suing for money owed on personal guarantees.

Federal regulators played into their hands in 2007-2008 by being sent out to get the banks that were in trouble out of real estate and construction loans without evaluation and due process. The funding of the bank losses through TARP money and US Treasury-manipulated bank sales - such as the sale of NCC to PNC - further served to cover up the corruption.

There are hundreds of innocent victims of these schemes, as foreclosed developers, contractors, subcontractors, suppliers, manufacturers and homeowners have been stripped of their assets in the process of making the foreclosures "legal" to prevent lawsuits from ever getting to court. The fallout and resultant damages range from extreme poverty to suicides.

Was it preventable? Yes, one simple change in the banking contracts - to require that banks be required to prove cause in a court of law before foreclosure - would have stopped it all. Instead, the courts have thrown out all defenses in favor of two words, "at will," in 22 volume commercial lending contracts, with the Federal Appeals Court in Chicago upholding the District Court's ruling.

[msm859]

It doesn't sound to me like msm859 would fit in any of these groups.

I have yet to find any mention of firing squads and mass executions, and I read his/hers posts with utmost care, although we often disagree.

Without firing squads, mass graves and torture chambers, there is no Maoism, Leninism - let alone Trotskyism - which, thank God, never reached its full deadly potential...

What I'm seeing in msm859's post sounds more like middle-of-the-road Labour party independents before Lady Thatcher showed up as an enemy...

My $0.02 only...

Good luck to us all.

Your correct Shark66, I wouldn't put myself in any of those groups. Capitalism can be good -- unbridled Capitalism is bad. I try to look at things from a macro view. This country has some serious systemic problems that most people are not smart enough to see. The concentration of wealth in so few is bad for society. WalMart is bad for society -- they pay over 90% of their employees below poverty income, make huge profits - 15 billion after taxes last year - which gets send to a handful of people in Arkansas. All the while suppressing wages for everyone who is trying to compete with them. I don't object to someone working hard and getting ahead -- even far ahead. However, there has to be limits. There needs to be some seriously progressive tax reform i.e. an even higher marginal rate at incomes over $1 million, 10 million etc. including capital gains. Likewise, on estate tax there should be a generous exemption say 5-10 million but then progress serious after that starting at 50% on 100 million going up to 90% on a billion. Instead all we hear is the Republican talking points that we need to lower taxes on the "job creators" and cut out the EPA etc. and sadly they are able to convince a number of people of the wisdom of such moves. And, unfortunately there are too many from both parties that are bought and paid for. So to your line "good luck to us all" I would add what we need is a miracle.

[IamOld]

Exactly Shark and MSM - fundamentalism of any kind is...bad. However, social democracy -- or the social market - or capitalism with a human face - dare I say is far preferable to this disaster we have today.