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    FICO reveals 'damage points'

    Sunday, November 29, 2009

    Disclosed for the 1st time, 'damage points' taken off for late payments

    Borrowers already knew that late payments hurt their credit scores, but for the first time, they now know the extent of that damage.

    Did you max out your credit card? Expect a credit score drop of 10 to 45 points. Declare bankruptcy? Your score will plummet by up to 240 points, and your odds of getting credit will nosedive with it.

    The "damage points" data, unveiled recently by FICO, are part of the most revealing glimpse into the firm's once-secret -- and still mysterious -- credit scoring model. The new information discloses how many points borrowers' scores will drop when they make the most-common mistakes.

    'Help People Understand' Scores

    "I hope this information will help people to better understand FICO scores and the value for them of avoiding credit missteps. It illustrates key points such as the higher your score, the farther it can fall if you stumble," says FICO spokesman Craig Watts. "Getting and maintaining a good score isn't complicated. We all just need to pay our bills on time, keep credit card balances low and take on new debt sparingly. "


    The greater transparency about FICO scores is important because American consumers' ability to get credit rises and falls with the number. FICO, the company that pioneered credit scoring, assigns consumers a three-digit number from 300 to 850, depending on how well they handle credit. Other companies also offer scores, but FICO's version is the most widely used by lenders in determining whether a consumer can borrow, and at what rate.

    FICO's credit score has been around for decades, but only within the past decade have consumers gradually gained access to theirs. Though the raw numbers can be purchased, how they're figured remains a FICO secret, as closely guarded as the formula for Coca-Cola. Until Thursday, FICO revealed only broad categories of factors influencing the score, but not the number of points at stake for consumers who fail to pay as agreed. The "damage points" information, revealed in a report by personal finance writer Liz Pulliam Weston, will be made available through its myFICO.com Web site starting this weekend.

    FICO's information shows that bankruptcy does the most serious damage to a credit score (up to 240 points), followed by foreclosure (up to 160 points) while maxing out a credit card has the least numerical impact (as few as 10 points).

    Those with good or excellent credit -- so-called prime borrowers -- put more points at risk with each mistake. For example, someone with an average credit score of 680 who pays a bill 30 days late will see a drop of 60 to 80 points. But for someone with an excellent credit score -- 780 -- that same delinquency can send a FICO score tumbling by 90 to 100 points.

    The Cost in Dollars

    In order to show just how badly a drop in your FICO score can hurt your wallet, we spoke with members of the home mortgage, auto and credit card lending industries. We presented hypothetical scenarios of a consumer who decided to apply for a $200,000, 30-year mortgage; a $20,000, five-year auto loan and a credit card. While all the industry insiders stressed that a FICO score isn't the only factor in determining who gets credit and at what cost (other factors they cited include the borrower's debt-to-income ratio and whether they have already established a relationship with the lender), they were able to provide an idea of what a borrower who had the following credit scores could expect.

    For a Consumer Who Started With a FICO Score of 780:

    Following a 30-day late payment, the consumer's car loan rate would jump nearly 3 percent, costing the borrower $26 more each month.
    Following a debt settlement, the consumer would pay as much as $109 more each month on a home mortgage.
    For a Consumer Who Started With a FICO Score of 680:

    Following a 30-day late payment, the consumer would pay $41 more each month for a car loan.
    Following a 30-day late payment, the consumer would pay as much as $95 more each month on a home mortgage.
    Following a debt settlement, the consumer would no longer qualify for a credit card.

    Some Surprised By the Details

    Consumer advocates say it's important for borrowers to know what can damage their FICO scores. "If they know it in advance, they won't go out and step in a pile of doo-doo. They won't go out and do some of these things," says Linda Sherry, director of national priorities with advocacy group Consumer Action. Even experts found some surprises in today's news. "FICO imposes bigger hits than I would have thought for being maxed out or 30-days late just once, reinforcing my view that it is a cruder, blunter instrument than they like to claim. Nevertheless, it is a powerful, widely used crude blunt instrument," says Ed Mierzwinski, consumer program director for the U.S. PIRG consumer advocacy group.

    Of course, knowing the impact on a FICO score and actually avoiding these mistakes are two separate things: Amid rising unemployment and other daily financial struggles, paying bills and staying on-track financially becomes a much bigger challenge for many borrowers.

    "Some of these things are out of their control," Sherry says of consumers.

    Additionally, as Weston points out, consumers with identical FICO scores can have different credit histories. That means the same slip-up -- such as maxing out a credit card -- could have different impacts on consumers who have the same FICO score. In the examples they provided, FICO assumed each borrower had several active major credit cards, a mortgage, car loan and student loans.

    Sherry acknowledges the benefit of putting a number to a financial blunder. "I don't think we necessarily knew the numbers that a bankruptcy could apply to a credit score," Sherry says.

    Helping You Make Better Decisions

    While knowing the numbers may not keep you filing for bankruptcy if given no other choice, the information may help you make the best decision when faced with a bad situation.

    FICO scores -- and the access to credit they provide -- are a valuable asset to consumers and supply a safety net when incomes are stretched. It's an asset that needs to be protected, Sherry says, even if job loss or catastrophic illness makes bill paying problematic.

    "In that period of time, paying down debt is the last thing on your mind. Paying the minimum payment may also be the last thing on your mind, but you'll be doing yourself a big favor if you do," Sherry says.

    Source:
    Yahoo Finance
    Last edited by Flamingo; 11-29-2009, 03:53 PM. Reason: To conform to forum posting rules - OP PLEASE NOTE FORMAT
    filed ch7 May 09
    341 june 09
    discharged, closed Aug 09

    #2
    Gosh, if I didn't know better, I'd say someone is trying to scare potential BK filers away from court. Not that there's any connection between FICO and the country's largest creditors, of course.
    Filed non-consumer no asset Chapter 7 on 7-12-10 after 4 foreclosures, 7 lawsuits including 2 deficiencies, 2 wage garnishments, a bank garnishment and a partridge in a pear tree. 341 held on 8-11-10. Discharge 11-4-10.

    Comment


      #3
      hmmm, interesting. i didn't think of that...

      however, it's not really news to anybody that bk will tank their scores. although, come to think of it, i am 6 months out of bk and my score is 690 (as of today). so maybe they are exaggerating the effect of bk on a score.
      filed ch7 May 09
      341 june 09
      discharged, closed Aug 09

      Comment


        #4
        This is nothing anyway. All our debt should die, the banks should go to hell and we (Main Street) should rebuild a workable economy like there was before the almighty fico.

        This will only be bad for the job seekers or landlords since too many stupid HR depts and landlords are brainwashed by measuring one's integrity using this score.

        The bankers will probably pass a law (being that they own congress) that if your score goes below 550 you should be executed and your children get sold into slavery.

        I shouldn't give them ideas by writing this since they will suggest it to Obama himself when they go to the strip club together.
        The essence of freedom is the proper limitation of Government

        Comment


          #5
          yes, we should rise against the tyranny of the fico!
          filed ch7 May 09
          341 june 09
          discharged, closed Aug 09

          Comment


            #6
            The wording is indicative. When they talk about Bankruptcy, it's a up to 240 point hit. Or, heaven forbid... foreclosure... you're talking up to 160 points!

            But when talking about just missing a payment, it's as low as 10. Excellent writing style if you ask me!
            Chapter 7 (No Asset/Non-Consumer) Filed (Pro Se) 7/08 (converted from Chapter 13 - 2/10)
            Status: (Auto) Discharged and Closed! 5/10
            Visit My BKForum Blog: justbroke's Blog

            Any advice provided is not legal advice, but simply the musings of a fellow bankrupt.

            Comment


              #7
              240 point drop for bk. Oh well, I'll just have to get over it. My new lifestyle is not fico dependent.
              All information contained in this post is for informational and amusement purposes only.
              Bankruptcy is a process, not an event.......

              Comment


                #8
                Originally posted by frogger View Post
                240 point drop for bk. Oh well, I'll just have to get over it. My new lifestyle is not fico dependent.
                Hey frogger... it's "up to". See, they already have you thinking it's 240 points. Mine dropped only 100 points.
                Chapter 7 (No Asset/Non-Consumer) Filed (Pro Se) 7/08 (converted from Chapter 13 - 2/10)
                Status: (Auto) Discharged and Closed! 5/10
                Visit My BKForum Blog: justbroke's Blog

                Any advice provided is not legal advice, but simply the musings of a fellow bankrupt.

                Comment


                  #9
                  LOL.. mine only dropped 100 points too after I filed. The funny thing here is they can be as stringent as they want to be with credit. It will be only so long before they get greedy and relax all these credit restrictions allowing people with lower scores to obtain credit easily

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Originally posted by Mi Bankruptcy View Post
                    LOL.. mine only dropped 100 points too after I filed. The funny thing here is they can be as stringent as they want to be with credit. It will be only so long before they get greedy and relax all these credit restrictions allowing people with lower scores to obtain credit easily
                    For good reason too, they make the most money from low income / low fico scores.

                    It's the people who can least afford it that end up paying the most.
                    My comments are solely based on my opinion. The information and links that I have
                    posted are provided solely for informational purposes, and do not constitute legal advice

                    Comment


                      #11
                      My favorite is correlating our driving to FICO. I can understand that our FICO would drop due to a bk, as we canceled out our debt. Therefore, I can understand that creditors will be reluctant to lend to us for a while. Some will never lend.

                      However, how does a BK impeded our driving? Prior to claiming BK they said that the debt would possibly lead us to being risk. Okay I can accept that. What's the excuse once the debt is gone? Once we no longer have the stress of debt.
                      My comments are solely based on my opinion. The information and links that I have
                      posted are provided solely for informational purposes, and do not constitute legal advice

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Originally posted by shabam View Post
                        My favorite is correlating our driving to FICO. I can understand that our FICO would drop due to a bk, as we canceled out our debt. Therefore, I can understand that creditors will be reluctant to lend to us for a while. Some will never lend.

                        However, how does a BK impeded our driving? Prior to claiming BK they said that the debt would possibly lead us to being risk. Okay I can accept that. What's the excuse once the debt is gone? Once we no longer have the stress of debt.
                        Ah that's just to piss us off, nothing more. Trust me insurance in America is awesome compared to UK. Let me tell you I had a motorcycle insurance for about 160 dollars a year. I sold it last month and they want their 80 dollar cancellation fee. Silly me I would have been better off if I didn't cancel
                        l! Well somehow I owe them 75! You'd think I'd owe nothing because the policy is paid off to begin with but nooo. Did they tell me this on the online insurance quote? Of course not, it was today I found out. So I told them good luck I ain't paying it. I'm out of here anyways.

                        In any case they charge you at least a 35 dollar fee here for any changes to your policy, some more. And don't forget a huge cancellation fee. You have to get a separate policy for each vehicle, and it ain't cheap trust me.
                        Filed: 6-7-2010 341: 7-15-2010 DISCHARGED: 9/17/2010

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Being several years beyond discharge and having our BK already off our records, everyone needs to know that it's not all about your scores, it's what is listed on your credit reports. You could have scores in the high 700's and with a BK or foreclosure showing that occurred several years before, that BK or foreclosure will be the reason for credit denial. There is a reason that a BK stays on your credit reports for 10 years following a Chapter 7 and 7 years following a Chapter 13...some creditors see that and run for the hills. The only thing that helps one with credit after filing is time and more and more people post on here trying to get immediate fixes to their credit or wonder why they can't get another credit card or car loan...

                          Worrying about credit scores will get one nowhere...being prudent with one's credit after filing and being savvy about applying for credit along with paying ALL bills on time the years after filing will always pay off.
                          _________________________________________
                          Filed 5 Year Chapter 13: April 2002
                          Early Buy-Out: April 2006
                          Discharge: August 2006

                          "A credit card is a snake in your pocket"

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Originally posted by Flamingo View Post
                            Worrying about credit scores will get one nowhere...being prudent with one's credit after filing and being savvy about applying for credit along with paying ALL bills on time the years after filing will always pay off.
                            Seems like good information (:

                            One thing that I have been thinking about concerning this story is why FICO has released this information and why now? I know they say they are trying to help consumers--maybe. Yet, why not release a lot more of how they calculate scores? Would that not help consumers even more? Timing seems interesting to me.
                            Filed Chapter 7 August 18,2009
                            341 scheduled for Oct 7, 2009--DONE!
                            Report of No Distribution Oct 8, 2009
                            Discharged & Closed Dec. 14, 2009

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Originally posted by banca rotta View Post

                              The bankers will probably pass a law (being that they own congress) that if your score goes below 550 you should be executed and your children get sold into slavery.

                              :
                              They definitely want us to live in terror of a :gasp: low fico score. The fact is, once I realized 1) my high FICO score was meaningless because the credit cards companies were rate-jacking me and closing accounts anyway despite a perfect payment record, and 2) I realized that evil elves weren't going to appear in my house in the middle of the night and take me away if I filed, the decision to file for bankruptcy became easy. I refuse to live in fear of a low FICO score.

                              Comment

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