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    Homeowners Walking Away From Homes...

    Interesting article on home foreclosures.



    Homeowners: Can't pay? Just walk away

    By Les Christie, CNNMoney.com staff writer
    February 7 2008: 2:04 PM EST

    NEW YORK (CNNMoney.com) -- Mortgage payments are set to jump. Home prices have plunged. "I'm outta here."

    Homeowners are abandoning their homes and, more importantly, their mortgages, rather than trying to keep up with rising payments on deteriorating assets. So many people are handing their keys back to lenders that a new term has been coined for it: jingle mail.

    "I stopped paying my mortgage in October, after shelling out about $70,000 in interest [over 15 months]," said one borrower, David, who doesn't want his last name used. "Now, I'm just waiting for the default notice."

    The Los Angeles-based writer bought two properties in Hancock Park, west of downtown, using no-down, interest-only mortgages in 2006. He paid just over $1 million for both.

    David had planned to sell them quickly but got caught in the slump. Soon his interest rate will jump by a few points, and his payments will go up by several hundred dollars a month for each place. He figures his properties have fallen in value by at least $60,000 each.

    Tell us what you think: When is it ok to walk away?
    Current lending practices have created an environment where a measure as extreme as abandoning a home actually makes sense to some people.

    Many buyers put little or no money down, so they don't have much invested in them. That leaves them with little incentive to keep making payments when a home's market value dips below the balance of the mortgage.

    The most serious consequence is a tremendous hit to credit scores. For some, that's better than throwing away money they'll never recover by selling their home.

    And while a mortgage default can savage a person's credit record, trying to pay off a loan they can't afford could be worse for borrowers if it leads to bankruptcy, said Craig Watts, a spokesman for the credit reporting firm Fair Isaac.

    Credit scores are hurt much more by missing multiple payments - on credit cards, cars and so on - than by a single foreclosure.

    "The time it takes to regain your credit score [after foreclosure] can be shorter than after bankruptcy," said Watts.

    It typically takes three years of a spotless payment record after a bankruptcy before credit scores recover enough for someone to think about buying a home again, he said. After abandoning a mortgage, a person may be able to buy a new house in two years or less.

    And now skipping out on a home is easier, thanks to the Mortgage Debt Relief Act of 2007. Previously, if a bank sold a foreclosed home for less than the mortgage balance and it forgave the difference, the borrower had to pay tax on that difference as if it were income. Now the IRS will ignore it.

    "That's going to help a lot of people," said Mike Gray, a San Jose accountant who runs the web site Realestatetaxletter.com.

    Most middle class still can't buy a house
    The trend of walking away is most pronounced among real estate investors, according to Jay Brinkman, an economist with the Mortgage Bankers Association (MBA).

    But families are doing it too. "If they have to stretch to make mortgage payments for a home that will not recover its value, then yes, they may walk away," he said.

    Often they chose hybrid adjustable rate mortgages (ARMs) that came with low initial payments. After a few years, interest rates on these loans reset higher. But buyers thought they could count on the increased value of their homes to refinance into affordable, fixed-rate loans.

    Now, that may not be possible. Take Susan (not her real name), a client of HouseBuyerNetwork.com, which specializes in arranging short sales. A short sale is when a bank agrees to accept the sale price paid for a home - even if it is less than the outstanding mortgage on it - as payment in full. An owner might sell a house with a $200,000 mortgage for $180,000, and then the bank forgives the difference.

    HouseBuyerNetwork.com CEO Duane LeGate says that Susan's two-bedroom condo in Sonoma County is worth $340,000, but the mortgage balance is $380,000. She can't refinance and it's difficult to sell.

    She's still trying for a short sale but, said LeGate, "She'll almost certainly end up walking away."

    Beyond anecdotes, some statistics indicate that hard-pressed owners are deliberately courting foreclosure. An analysis by the consumer credit rating agency Experian last spring found that many borrowers were choosing to pay off credit card and other consumer debt before making mortgage payments. They were electing to put their mortgage at risk rather than their credit cards or auto loans.

    Similarly, Richard DeKaser, chief economist for National City Corp., (NCC, Fortune 500) notes that while all credit metrics are deteriorating, mortgage delinquencies are rising disproportionately. "That makes sense if people are choosing to walk away," he said.

    And now reports are emerging of homeowners skipping out on mortgages even though they can still afford to pay them.

    Wachovia (WB, Fortune 500) CEO Ken Thompson described these people on an earnings call last month."[These are] people that have otherwise had the capacity to pay, but have basically just decided not to, because they feel like they've lost equity, value in their properties."

    Lenders are afraid that borrowers may find it's worth the hit to their credit scores, if they can drastically reduce their housing expenses. Someone with good credit and a $600,000 home in a town with cratering real estate prices could buy a similar house nearby for $450,000, and then let the other $600,000 mortgage go into foreclosure.

    The stage is set for this kind of thing particularly in California, where huge numbers of buyers used low or no-down deals to buy homes. The trend has even spawned at least one new business, San Diego-based YouWalkAway.com, which for a fee of $1,000 purports to guide clients through the process of ditching their mortgages. It launched in early January, and says it has already signed up 180 clients.

    California is a bit of a safe haven for these borrowers, since banks that repossess and then sell a foreclosed property for less than the mortgage that was owed on it cannot come after borrowers for the difference - as long as it's the initial mortgage, one that has not been refinanced. So if a borrower owes $200,000 and the bank sells the house for $170,000, the borrower comes out of it debt-free.

    And for many homeowners, the prospect of becoming debt-free is growing increasingly alluring.

    Home equity loan defaults soar

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    Mortgage rates end five-week descent
    Find mortgage rates in your area
    Last edited by HRx; 02-17-2008, 09:40 AM.
    Chapter 7 Filed - 11/27/07
    Discharged - 2/29/08
    Unsecured Debt Discharged - $162k +/- (small business, personally guaranteed)
    Finally Closed - 3/1/09

    #2
    Interesting article....

    I'm curious about something....

    We filed BK7 and were discharged last August (07). We did not reaffirm our home, but are doing a ride-through...all payments have been made ontime since BK. We have very little equity. Our CRs show that the mortgage was discharged in BK, and they are not reporting our ontime payments.

    Hypothetically, if we decided to just walk away from our house, what would change. If I understand correctly, since it was IIB, then they can't report ANYTHING since discharge, right? Which is why they aren't reporting ontime payments, right? So, they probably can't report a default on a mortgage since that mortgage has already been discharged.

    Please correct me if I'm wrong. We are in Michigan, where the housing market is worse than awful! My husband thinks we are going to be stuck with this house forever. I say, if push comes to shove, we really are not responsible for the mortgage payments anymore, anyways...and we can walk away. As of June, we will be down to 1 kiddo at home ( 2 during the summer), in this 5 bedroom, 3 bath home. We like the neighborhood, but in reality will have too much house with our big kids both in college. Unless my step-daughter comes to live with us for the rest of high school, then we really don't need to stay here.

    Any input?
    4/7/07 Filed Ch7 :unsure:
    6/6/07 341 meeting done :blink:
    8/5/07 last day for objections :yes2:
    8/23/07 DISCHARGED!!! :yahoo::yahoo::yahoo:

    Comment


      #3
      Your line of thinking is correct, broke.

      If you did not reaffirm, the mortgage debt has been discharged.

      They cannot report anything to the CRA's. Just write them a letter and tell them your leaving.

      We've actually OFFERED to reaffirm as our payment is only $800/month ($117,000), our house is only 33 years old, and my wife has a lot of sentimental value in the place (it is where she grew up and has been in her family since new).

      GMAC Mortgage has not yet signaled if they are going to reaffirm. They don't have much time left. I'm secretly hoping they don't respond to our request. Then we can walk away later if we want.

      Chapter 7 Filed - 11/27/07
      Discharged - 2/29/08
      Unsecured Debt Discharged - $162k +/- (small business, personally guaranteed)
      Finally Closed - 3/1/09

      Comment


        #4
        P.S. You could also force the mortgage company to go through a drawn out foreclosure process and live in the house for free for several months.
        Chapter 7 Filed - 11/27/07
        Discharged - 2/29/08
        Unsecured Debt Discharged - $162k +/- (small business, personally guaranteed)
        Finally Closed - 3/1/09

        Comment


          #5
          If you force them to go through the foreclosure process, will they end up reporting it as a foreclosure on our CR? My guess is "no", since it was IIB, but I'm not sure.

          I think either way, if we just leave OR we stay (for free for a while) but stop paying (forcing foreclosure proceedings), it's still a foreclosure, but can't be reported since our mortgage was discharged....is this correct?

          For now, we're staying (and paying)...we'll see how the housing market looks next year, I think.
          4/7/07 Filed Ch7 :unsure:
          6/6/07 341 meeting done :blink:
          8/5/07 last day for objections :yes2:
          8/23/07 DISCHARGED!!! :yahoo::yahoo::yahoo:

          Comment


            #6
            how its reported would not change...it will stay IIB

            You could definitely stay in it for a while after you decide to let it go...the amount of time will depend on your state.
            Chapter 7 Pro Se....Discharged Feb. 2006

            Comment


              #7
              broke-

              cindy is right. A foreclosure will not be reported on your CR. Once it has been discharged, it cannot change.

              If for some odd reason it does report as a forclosure, you can dispute it and win.

              Chapter 7 Filed - 11/27/07
              Discharged - 2/29/08
              Unsecured Debt Discharged - $162k +/- (small business, personally guaranteed)
              Finally Closed - 3/1/09

              Comment


                #8
                Originally posted by yoyoma51 View Post
                broke-

                cindy is right. A foreclosure will not be reported on your CR. Once it has been discharged, it cannot change.

                If for some odd reason it does report as a forclosure, you can dispute it and win.
                Are you guys sure about that???? That would be great. We are most likely going to let the house go, but I've been fearful of it doing even more damage to our credit report.

                I recall this type of discussion a few months back, but someone said then that letting the house foreclose after a period of time after bankruptcy would "ding your credit" twice.
                11/29/2007 - Filed Ch 7
                01/08/2008 - 341 Hearing
                03/12/2008 - Discharged
                03/21/2008 - Closed

                Comment


                  #9
                  The mortgage company can't change it. The debt has been DISCHARGED. They can't go back and reverse your discharge.

                  Chapter 7 Filed - 11/27/07
                  Discharged - 2/29/08
                  Unsecured Debt Discharged - $162k +/- (small business, personally guaranteed)
                  Finally Closed - 3/1/09

                  Comment


                    #10
                    my house was discharged in BK and I have been fighting with a mortage company that bought after discharge to remove the forclosure from our credit. I have not been sucessful as of yet and I have disputed with the company and cr's. I sent a certified letter to the company still waitin on the reply. my take on this is that the creditor will report it the way they want then you will be in the fight to get it fixed. on Dec 2007 our mortage said included in BK7 on Jan 28 2008 it says that plus forclosed. funny the company that is reporting it isn't even the lender that we had.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Originally posted by sandhall View Post
                      my house was discharged in BK and I have been fighting with a mortage company that bought after discharge to remove the forclosure from our credit. I have not been sucessful as of yet and I have disputed with the company and cr's. I sent a certified letter to the company still waitin on the reply. my take on this is that the creditor will report it the way they want then you will be in the fight to get it fixed. on Dec 2007 our mortage said included in BK7 on Jan 28 2008 it says that plus forclosed. funny the company that is reporting it isn't even the lender that we had.
                      I have a feeling this is the typical outcome. Did the CRA's do anything for you?
                      11/29/2007 - Filed Ch 7
                      01/08/2008 - 341 Hearing
                      03/12/2008 - Discharged
                      03/21/2008 - Closed

                      Comment


                        #12
                        The Cr's have not done anything so we finally hired a attorney to get this done. Not a credit repair company but a attorney because this should not even be on our report and we are aimed at getting it removed.

                        Comment


                          #13
                          I have asked this type of question so many times--and basically--from people here this is what I understand--
                          Your debt with the mort co is discharged yes---but the legal procedure of foreclosure can and will be reported on your credit report. It is the debt that is discharged. Foreclosure is the act of the co taking back their collateral--this is a seperate procedure. The mort co can allow a deed in lieu of foreclosure (some do some don't)--or they will foreclose if you do not keep payments up. If they foreclose, this is a procedure that can be listed on your report--but somehow it can be listed as "included in BK" IF you surrendered the home--but as I understand it--Any foreclusure will be on your report if foreclosure happens--and the notations are what changes.
                          Someone PLEASE clairify this--I myself am so frustrated by this question--Can a moderator answer this is STICKY it--this question is constantly asked in a million areas here--and answers keep differing--I NEED to know also!
                          Thanks !!!

                          Comment


                            #14
                            My attorney said it should show up at included in BK, even with a foreclosure.
                            Filed November 2 2007
                            341 Meeting January 4 2008
                            DISCHARGED March 11 2008

                            Comment


                              #15
                              i need some advise... we were discharged in aug 07 chapter7. now i'm trying to refiance this sub prime loan that's going to almost double in may. is there any mortgage company out there willing to help people like us.

                              Comment

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