What a stupid thing to do, right?

[NoMoreCards]

My nephew is making a huge mistake, I believe.

He is going to be filing a Ch 7 in the next month and has his truck parked at my house until that time. He is not/will not be driving it before it is surrendered. However, yesterday he came over and removed the tail gate, running boards and mirrors to "sell on ebay".

I called him last night when I got home and told him that doing this could cause a AP and the truck debt might not be discharged at all, due to his intentional parting out and/or fraud type claims. He claims I don't know what I am talking about.

Do you know anyone who did something similar? What happened? Please share your experiences.

I just feel in my gut that this is a terrible risk for him (and a stupid thing to do). But I feel like I am talking to a brick wall. For his sake, I hope I am wrong as to the possible outcomes. I kinda figured this wasn't too unusual and somebody would know someone else who did this type of thing.

[BKOnce]

Let he learns a lession himself.

[debtinohio]

Were these custom parts? I added running boards, tow mirrors, cap, etc. to my pickip and would remove them if it was being repoed.

Now - they have custom tailgates and a lot of trucks have them removed anyway, but I would not let it go back without mirrors.

I'm returning my RV but only switched the propane tanks for empty ones, kept the new battery (since that was my add-on) and took all my own stuff out, nothing that was a part of the trailer originally.

[tigergem]

I might have a difficult time doing it, but yeah, I would take back the transmission, the new rear axle and the front brakes lol. Of course my truck is paid is paid in full, so that is not going to be an issue.

[NoMoreCards]

The parts he removed were not custom parts, just parts he wanted to sell for a few bucks. I could see if these were add-ons or upgrades he put on, but that isn't the case.

So far, he has not removed anything else but he hasn't filed BK or returned the truck yet either, as it is sitting out at my house. I expect he is gathering the funds to pay for the BK filing.

I just think he is asking for more trouble than the few bucks would warrant risking.

P.S. I did swap the tires from his truck to mine, as his had more tread. But at least it has tires that hold air and are the correct size!
:-)

[tigergem]

It might come back to bite him, or it might not. Who knows? If he's an adult he is responsible for his own decisions. I wouldn't worry too much about it.

[justbroke]

First, let him learn any lessons himself. If these were aftermarket then they are probably not considered part of the loan on the truck. Don't worry for him.

I think I should make note of this here. Adversary Proceedings (APs) are not just done willy nilly. They are FAR AND FEW between! Example, my District is one of the BUSIEST in the country. On May 1st I filed the "127th" AP this year in my division. As of May 1st, there were over 9,000 cases filed in this division of my District. We are on track to supersede last year's filings by 50%.

The point is, that only 1.5% of cases have an AP filed. They are expensive to litigate and can prove fatal for a creditor.

[BCA2009]

I don't know what the legal answer is, but what I suspect will happen is that the bank won't file for relief from the automatic stay, then he will either surrender it or it will be repo'd after he is discharged. The bank will then take it to an auction and sell it.

So what can the bank do after discharge? I don't really know, but I bet it would cost them more money and effort than just forgetting about it. There is a good chance no one at the bank will ever see it. It could go from the repo man to an auction pretty quick.

How would they know if the stuff was taken off a year ago vs a month before he files?

I'm not recommeding or approving, just sayin' what I think will happen in actuality.

I surrendered a boat that I have had for 5 years. One of the engines blew up a couple of years ago. I took both engins off at the time with full intention of putting new ones on. I sold misc parts off of both of them (they were 1995 year model engines). I never did replace the engines. When the repo guy came they were laying on the ground behind the boat in pieces. He called somebody and said it would be an extra $100 if they wanted him to get the engines. They approved it, he hauled it off and I never heard anything else. What could they really do? It wasn't fraud. I was already discharged of the debt.


I guess if you bought a truck two months before filing and took the engine and transmission out, they might sue you for fraud, but i bet it would have to be pretty cut and dry before they would even bother.

I have heard of situations where someone let their insuance lapse, then wrecked the car. How would that prevent you from filing BK on the debt? The bank just repo's a wrecked car. Value wise thet would be way worse than taking a tailgate off. It would boil down to proving some type of fraud and that would be hard to do.

[NoMoreCards]

Some VERY good points here, things I had not considered.

I will keep you posted as to what happens. My nephew is planning to come out this weekend for a BBQ and I am curious to see if more parts walk away or if it is even brought up.

Either way, as said earlier...I am not losing sleep over it. He is a grown man and must live with his decisions and their consequences.

[Brazzy]

If we find that someone stripped the collateral of anything remotely valuable we will look to file an AP case immediately. It happens all too often that people think they can strip car or boat. Let him learn the hard way.

O and selling it on EBAY is awesome! Nothing like giving the creditor easy access to hard evidence to make their case. Sweet!

[BCA2009]

If we find that someone stripped the collateral of anything remotely valuable we will look to file an AP case immediately. It happens all too often that people think they can strip car or boat. Let him learn the hard way.

O and selling it on EBAY is awesome! Nothing like giving the creditor easy access to hard evidence to make their case. Sweet!

The AP has to be filed within 60 days of the first scheduled 341. How often do banks file form relief from the automatic stay and get it repo'd in that time period?

Researching E-Bay purchases to identify used boat and truck parts? Now your silly anti debtor crap has just fallen off the charts. Give me a break. What do you do? Get a subpeona for E-bay records to determine who a user is? Then prove that the tail gate came off the truck in question? The police would have a hard time doing that.

I'm not appoving stipping a BK asset of parts, but you need to go to a different forum, if you are just here to offer BS and try to intimidate the newbies on this forum.

Please tell me how many AP's you have filed and what district you are in.

[NoMoreCards]

The AP has to be filed within 60 days of the first scheduled 341. How often do banks file form relief from the automatic stay and get it repo'd in that time period?

Researching E-Bay purchases to identify used boat and truck parts? Now your silly anti debtor crap has just fallen off the charts. Give me a break. What do you do? Get a subpeona for E-bay records to determine who a user is? Then prove that the tail gate came off the truck in question? The police would have a hard time doing that.

I'm not appoving stipping a BK asset of parts, but you need to go to a different forum, if you are just here to offer BS and try to intimidate the newbies on this forum.

Please tell me how many AP's you have filed and what district you are in.

BCA, I agree completely. It is not even remotely reasonable for any financial institution to spend the money and time to get all the research done needed to track down a few hundred bucks in parts sold on Ebay. Not to mention the owner of the truck don't have a Ebay account, the parts are sold through his BIL who sells & buys all kinds of stuff.

That is beyond reasonable, WAY beyond reasonable. LOL!!!

Plus, even if the stay was lifted...don't they need to find the truck to repo it? It won't be found where I live, not a chance. Of course my nephew is not looking to "keep" the truck, as I said earlier it is parked until he returns it. He just retained a attorney last week, but still owes some of the money to get filed. I think that is what he used the truck parts for, but I am not sure.

[Mi Bankruptcy]

I wonder if he will need to explain anything he sold recently when he has his 341 meeting? that were things "might" get sticky?

[Brazzy]

The AP has to be filed within 60 days of the first scheduled 341. How often do banks file form relief from the automatic stay and get it repo'd in that time period?

Researching E-Bay purchases to identify used boat and truck parts? Now your silly anti debtor crap has just fallen off the charts. Give me a break. What do you do? Get a subpeona for E-bay records to determine who a user is? Then prove that the tail gate came off the truck in question? The police would have a hard time doing that.

I'm not appoving stipping a BK asset of parts, but you need to go to a different forum, if you are just here to offer BS and try to intimidate the newbies on this forum.

Please tell me how many AP's you have filed and what district you are in.

First off yes the BK and its automatic stay stops a repo. However, how often is a unit out for repo prior to the BK filing? That happens quite often. Repo agents take into account everything that happens to the unit in question including things such as asking neighbors, taking pictures, etc. If there is noticeable change to the unit or things missing that came standard on the unit. With this info in hand that gives us more than enough time to move for relief, obtain possession, file for a motion to extend the deadline, and investigate where our crap went. On two occasions people have removed valuable items from a unit prior to repo and we found the items on ebay. I give you the most blatant example. Southern california a 55' ridiculous power boat was out for repo prior to chapter 7. Repo agents take photos and wait for the stay to be lifted. Stay gets lifted and our people move to take possession. In doing so they find that the thing has been stripped. All the electronic components were removed. Agents as around and people who happened to be the debtors neighbors rat them out and talk about how they were bragging about the stuff being on ebay. Quick search and the auction was found. Dont have to go much further than that.

People on here need to smarten up and stop trying to jump to half thought out assumptions as to why I am here. First I'm here to sell stuff, then to keep secrets, then to intimidate. Get over it and just take it for what it is. Its not BS. Everything I have posted is 100% accurate and can be used to your benefit. Heaven forbid someone come here and give you the opposing point of view. In this thread I give you this information (and the example) to let you know that your creditors have people hired whose sole purpose is to look into reasons to object to a discharge. On top of that you never know what repo agents know. Thirdly, if you are going to pull something like this off dont tell anyone. 90% of information is found because someone told them where to look (its almost always nosey neighbors). What possible benefit do I get from intimidating people? Especially when you have no idea who I am or what I do. I dont care one way or another what people decide to do. The question was asked is this a stupid thing to do. The answer is yes it is stupid because things like this are caught quite frequently.

[dscurlock]

"People on here need to smarten up and stop trying to jump to half thought out assumptions as to why I am here. First I'm here to sell stuff, then to keep secrets, then to intimidate"

not only that, nomorecards has confessed to aiding and commiting fraud himself.
"I swapped tires" "I am hiding the vehicle so it can not be found"

I think he has done everything except for posting his name/address.
and who needs that these days...world of internet tracking is great.

I would turn him in for a $1 and a hamburger...

yep, i would