Need to file Pro Se in Virginia

[souprebel]

Soup? I am gonna give you some tough love for the soul here so buckle down.

If you can't figure out whether you can keep your car after filing your bankruptcy by virtue of utilizing Google or reading on this site over the last couple of days - you have absolutely no business trying to file Pro Se by the 18th of this month. Now, I asked some pure doozy dumb questions as a noobie on this site, but I always planned on using a lawyer, so my understanding the process was just a bonus rather than a requirement.

What kind of car do you have? How much is the Kelley Blue Book Private Party Value for your car? Once you determine that figure (the value of your car), you then look at what exemptions are offered by your state.

According to a fairly reputable website here is Virginia's info regarding the exemption of motor vehicles:




So, as long as your car is worth less than 6k you are in great shape. If it is worth a little more, you can use the state's Wild Card (in lieu of using the full homestead exemption) to (hopefully) help cover the additional amount.

No one here can help you very well unless you ask specific questions. Saying "Gee, I wonder if I will get to keep my car" does you no good (except I felt sorry for you and told you what to do). Saying "Gee, I have a 1999 Ford Taurus with 150,000 miles that burns a quart of oil a week - do you think I can keep my car if I'm filing a Chapter 7?" is much more informative. See the difference that the details make??

So, go get a set of forms (make at least 5 copies before you start writing on them!) and a pencil and start filling them in - then when your questions occur you can make them specific and folks can help you. The Devil is in the details as my Mamaw used to tell me.

Now, remember back in school? THIS is the time to pull a couple of all-nighters. You need to read about Bankruptcy like it is your job. Nolo Press has a downloadable version of their guide to filing Chapter 7 bankruptcy - this would be worth every penny you spend on it, imho.

If you don't feel comfortable enough to file before the 18th - as a worst case scenario, you can go to your court date as was suggested and follow all of their tips and then file your bankruptcy as soon as you can. Appearing at the court should buy you the necessary time to do this properly rather than hastily.

I hope this was helpful to you. You are at the place where the rubber meets the road - are your tires ready?

I do wish you all the best. Really.

Thank you for the reply...

Well, I have searched Google prior to posting on here and I also know that you can't always count what you "find" on Google as fact. When I searched, I kept coming up with a 2k value allowed on a vehicle. Therefore, that is why I was thinking out loud and typed...I wonder if I can keep my car.

My car is paid off, it's a 2002 mercedes c230 with 91k mies.

As far as hiring a lawyer... as previously stated...I was laid off Aug 2011. I am on unemployment.

As I mentioned before, I NEED the NOLO book, so as of right now I might sound as dumb as a rock to you regarding BK filing, but once I have the book, I am sure I can handle it.

I agreed with "IAmOld" in my posts above... to show-up in GD if I was not able to have this ready to file. I would NEVER slap all of these documents together without the proper time and preperation. I am not stupid. I was merely HOPING I could to avoid the drive downtown and appearing in GD Court.

[souprebel]

That was my thought exactly! Take the time you need to make sure you prepare the best BK petition you can.

I plan on it. That is my goal.

[IamOld]

Soup!!!!!!!!! Car exemption is NOW $5,000 in VA - changed this past summer!!!!!!!!!!!

Also, VA has a $5,000 homestead exemption - if your house is underwater (no equity) or you rent, you can use that $5K for anything BUT you have to file the appropriate homestead deed (a form) with your local CIRCUIT court BEFORE at the latest your 341 hearing!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[souprebel]

Soup!!!!!!!!! Car exemption is NOW $5,000 in VA - changed this past summer!!!!!!!!!!!

Also, VA has a $5,000 homestead exemption - if your house is underwater (no equity) or you rent, you can use that $5K for anything BUT you have to file the appropriate homestead deed (a form) with your local CIRCUIT court BEFORE at the latest your 341 hearing!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Hello!

Thank you and that is great news! I rent, no house.

[IamOld]

Excellent - then you have $5K for anything that you like to use including cash!!!!! (bank account) - plus there are specific exemptions for clothes, wedding bands, etc.

[malf1204]

http://apps.americanbar.org/legalservices/findlegalhelp/freehelp.cfm?id=VA

this is a link for pro-bono or sliding scale legal help for VA BK court

Here in Maryland they have free 1 hour consultations with attorneys at the courthouse every Thursday from 10-2 perhaps there is such a program in VA.

[ValleYum]

My intent was never to be hurtful, Soup. My prior posts on this site sustain that (actually you congratulated someone earlier today who I spent a lot of time helping) so I will stand by what I said to you and apologize if you took in in the wrong way - darn written words without inflection.

But, I never said you should get a lawyer - only that you appeared (to me) to be in no shape to file by the 18th. I did mention that I had a lawyer.

You never really mentioned exemptions - just that you wondered whether you could keep your car, so I was unaware from your prior postings (because I did look) of what you knew about your car or what you had researched.

Again, my heart was in the right place even if I sounded like a condescending asshat.

Take care.

[souprebel]

Excellent - then you have $5K for anything that you like to use including cash!!!!! (bank account) - plus there are specific exemptions for clothes, wedding bands, etc.

Thank you IamOld. I ran the KellyBB on my car and it came out at $6500. Cash in the bank, what's that (LOL), wedding bands (none... since 1995) I have the usual furniture and a treadmill.

[souprebel]

this is a link for pro-bono or sliding scale legal help for VA BK court

Here in Maryland they have free 1 hour consultations with attorneys at the courthouse every Thursday from 10-2 perhaps there is such a program in VA.

Ohhh, thank you!

I will look at this right now

[IamOld]

:-) You're most welcome!!!!!! Then what you'd do is use $1,500 of your Homestead exemption for your car, plus your full VA car exemption...
The rest should be more than fine!!!

HOWEVER - like LadyintheRed said - do NOT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! rush the filing - I know showing up in GD court is NOT what you want to do, but stick to the script!!!! do NOT admit anything and they have to give you a trial date about 1 to 2 months out....

[souprebel]

My intent was never to be hurtful, Soup. My prior posts on this site sustain that (actually you congratulated someone earlier today who I spent a lot of time helping) so I will stand by what I said to you and apologize if you took in in the wrong way - darn written words without inflection.

But, I never said you should get a lawyer - only that you appeared (to me) to be in no shape to file by the 18th. I did mention that I had a lawyer.

You never really mentioned exemptions - just that you wondered whether you could keep your car, so I was unaware from your prior postings (because I did look) of what you knew about your car or what you had researched.

Again, my heart was in the right place even if I sounded like a condescending asshat.

Take care.

Yes, and I wish I WAS that person (LOL), I wish I was in their shoes... with all of this behind me and my stomach free from the acid burn I am feeling. I've had a migraine every single day this week from this and the stress of this judgement. Take a 2 hour nap, 3 advil, put cold ice on my head...it really sucks LOL.

Oh, I know you meant well...plus I like the word asshat...it makes me laugh Plus, I don't think your an asshat at all. You were only trying to make me realize and not screw up ;)

If I could hire a lawyer, I would. Unless the cash falls from the sky, my only option is to file by myself. Scary and daunting task and I'm trying to be positive from reading all the Pro Se filers on here.

[souprebel]

:-) You're most welcome!!!!!! Then what you'd do is use $1,500 of your Homestead exemption for your car, plus your full VA car exemption...
The rest should be more than fine!!!

HOWEVER - like LadyintheRed said - do NOT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! rush the filing - I know showing up in GD court is NOT what you want to do, but stick to the script!!!! do NOT admit anything and they have to give you a trial date about 1 to 2 months out....

Sounds good

I'll admit it scares me to go to GD Court and not admit anything. So I'll have to practice that! It is my debt...but I also paid these money grubbers like 12k on this 14k loan, that they still want the whole 14k!! Insane rate of 24%!

[souprebel]

Just an update with this credit union. I had my auto loan with them as well, which is now paid in full. This letter is becasue of the unsecured loan of $14k that I am to go to GD Court for this coming week.

I received a letter from them today:

As of Sept 28,2011 the above loan was paid in full. We wanted to let you know that your title has not been released for one or more of the following reasons:

Charged off account
Deliquent account

The cross collateralization clause in the "What the Security Interest Covers/Cross Collateral Provisions" section of your Loan and Security Agreements Disclouse Statements states the following about your title:... The security interest also secures any other loans, including any credit card loan, you have now or receive in the future from us and any other amounts you owe is for any reason now or in the future, except any loan secured by your principal residence ...We will not be able to release your title until the matter has been taken care of. if you have questions or of we can be of assistance, please call us at XXX

Any thoughts would be great More stress to the already burning fire

[doni49]

So, as long as your car is worth less than 6k you are in great shape. If it is worth a little more, you can use the state's Wild Card (in lieu of using the full homestead exemption) to (hopefully) help cover the additional amount.

Be very careful on this. You indicated in another thread that the CU is holding title to the car due to a personal loan you have with them. I've been told that MOST CUs (and mine was one of them) have cross-collateralization clauses in all of their loan documents. What this basically means is that when you get a car loan with them, the car also acts as collateral for ANY CURRENT OR FUTURE LOAN you have with them. If that's the case then even though you may THINK you're car is paid for, they can still take it from you. Read every word of every loan document you have from them. If you're not 100% positive that you know the answer, consult an attorney. Go to one with whom you have not already consulted and ask them for their opinion about your loan docs.

EDIT: When I started my reply, I didn't even realize there was a second page. After submitting the reply, I now see the second page and you're already discussing this issue. Sorry to have jumped the gun.

[doni49]

Just an update with this credit union. I had my auto loan with them as well, which is now paid in full. This letter is becasue of the unsecured loan of $14k that I am to go to GD Court for this coming week.

I received a letter from them today:

As of Sept 28,2011 the above loan was paid in full. We wanted to let you know that your title has not been released for one or more of the following reasons:

Charged off account
Deliquent account

The cross collateralization clause in the "What the Security Interest Covers/Cross Collateral Provisions" section of your Loan and Security Agreements Disclouse Statements states the following about your title:... The security interest also secures any other loans, including any credit card loan, you have now or receive in the future from us and any other amounts you owe is for any reason now or in the future, except any loan secured by your principal residence ...We will not be able to release your title until the matter has been taken care of. if you have questions or of we can be of assistance, please call us at XXX

Any thoughts would be great More stress to the already burning fire

The CC clause is a killer aint it! You basically have a $14,000 loan secured by your car. Now since the car is worth less than what you owe, the exemptions will do you NO GOOD. If you really need/want to keep the car, there are only two options:

1. Reaffirmation: You agree to continue to pay the loan after discharge. You MAY be able to negotiate the balance down.
2. 722 Redemption: Section 722 of the U.S. BK code basically allows for a secured debt (many different types of security--one being a car) to be split into two separate debts. The first being secured up to the value of the security. And the second debt being the portion of the original debt that is over and above the value of the security. This second debt will be discharged along with the other dischargable, unsecured debts. The trick with this is that you need to pay the full value of the car NOW.

I'm sorry to say this but if you're still unemployed I don't see you keeping the car.