Job offer after filing CH 7

[rhp]

I was offered a job today, contingent on passing a licensing exam two weeks from now. If all goes well, I would start working around 10/9. I opened my CH7 on 8/10. 341 is on 9/10.

I assume it's something that should be disclosed at at the 341, but is the timing of this going to be a problem?

Any advice or experiences with this sort of thing? I'm in AZ, for what it's worth.

[ttg1]

Getting a job is no big deal, you are not supposed to starve yourselves until you get the discharge. The better question is how much are you making and would the salary be enough to put you into a 13. That's the question.

[rhp]

Getting a job is no big deal, you are not supposed to starve yourselves until you get the discharge. The better question is how much are you making and would the salary be enough to put you into a 13. That's the question.

I'd be making $50k. Debts are $250k. So, I think I'm still in CH 7 territory.

I'm hoping it's not a big deal and that they rely more on the six-months-prior snap shot.

[despritfreya]

Your new job has no impact on your case. Your Trustee may, and I stress the word "may" ask you if you found employment (assuming you were unemployed when you filed). You answer truthfully and that will be the end of it. Post petition earnings are not the Trustee's concern.

Des.

[AngelinaCat]

Congratulations on your new job. I hope you do well on your exam! Please keep us posted!

[ttg1]

Post petition earnings are not the Trustee's concern.

I'm always willing to learn. It's your opinion then that a trustee can never force a seven into a 13 if a person was offered a job post-petition but pre-discharge? I didn't think that was the case but I am willing to be corrected.

[despritfreya]

It's your opinion then that a trustee can never force a seven into a 13 if a person was offered a job post-petition but pre-discharge? I didn't think that was the case but I am willing to be corrected.

Been doing this for 22 years and I have never, repeat, never had a case where a chapter 7 Trustee or the US Trustee looked beyond the petition date, even where my previously unemployed or under-employed client found relatively decent work.

1. In a Chapter 7 post petition earnings are not property of the estate (541)
2. Disclosure of a change in circumstance is only required if you knew about the change before the petition was filed (line 17 on Schedule I).

Now, I can imagine that there could be a circumstance where it would be an issue. . . one has earned a ton of money in the past, quits job just to qualify for a 7 and shortly after filing “finds” gainful employment. But, that is fraud and not your every day occurrence.

Des.

[justbroke]

I agree with Des. There have only been a few cases where the UST went after a debtor for getting a high paying job shortly after filing. In one of those cases that sticks out, the person lost their job, filed bankruptcy, and then got a $100K+ job right after filing. The bankruptcy was "timed" so that the income had fallen off the 6-month lookback.

[rhp]

Thanks for the input and good wishes!

Taking this into account, since I had no way of knowing .. .

2. Disclosure of a change in circumstance is only required if you knew about the change before the petition was filed (line 17 on Schedule I).

Do I offer this new job information at the 341, or only if asked? At this point it's still just a verbal offer. And like I said, contingent on that test. And if the job does start in Oct., do I formally notify the trustee, just to cover myself?

I am unemployed, went back to school, and feel very lucky to have landed something so fast.

[ttg1]

I appreciate the feedback on my question. I now remain even more puzzled than I was before about something that happened to me.

When I filed my chapter seven petition I wrote on Schedule I that I was unemployed and had been for the last six months which, sadly, was true. Since I planned on continuing to look for work I left question 17 blank because while I thought it was reasonable to think that I would get a job in the next year I had no clue as to where or when or the amount of pay. But when I got the Clerk's office she refused to take my petition. She told me that if I was unemployed that I had to fill in question 17. (She did not insist of any similar thing for Schedule J). We got into a discussion and she backed down and said she would take my petition but I would get a deficiency notice in the mail. Well, I didn't want a deficiency notice so I went ahead and wrote in some mumbo jumbo about looking for work to make her happy. She then accepted my petition.

The only thing I could think of was that trustees were looking hard at the job situation to get people into 13s. But if that is not the case, I have no clue as to why the court clerk was so adamant about having an answer to that question.

[LadyInTheRed]

Thanks for the input and good wishes!

Taking this into account, since I had no way of knowing .. .



Do I offer this new job information at the 341, or only if asked? At this point it's still just a verbal offer. And like I said, contingent on that test. And if the job does start in Oct., do I formally notify the trustee, just to cover myself?

I am unemployed, went back to school, and feel very lucky to have landed something so fast.

Do not offer any information that is not directly responsive to a question. A golden rule when questioned under oath: Answer only the question that is asked and do not elaborate.

You do not have to notify the trustee later. If your petition was accurate at the time it was filed, you have nothing to report to the trustee unless you are asked a question or become entitled to an inheritance.

[rhp]

Do not offer any information that is not directly responsive to a question. A golden rule when questioned under oath: Answer only the question that is asked and do not elaborate.

You do not have to notify the trustee later. If your petition was accurate at the time it was filed, you have nothing to report to the trustee unless you are asked a question or become entitled to an inheritance.

Thank you. Feeling much better about all of this.

Are gifts after the filing treated the same then, too? My dad has offered to send me a check, which would really be helpful right now. I'm talking $500 or so.

[rhp]

Thank you. Feeling much better about all of this.

Are gifts after the filing treated the same then, too? My dad has offered to send me a check, which would really be helpful right now. I'm talking $500 or so.

I think I found my answer here:

http://www.bkforum.com/showthread.php?70401-Post-341-questions.-Savings-bank-accounts-legitimate-gifts.&highlight=gift+filing

Unless anyone has a different interpretation, looks like it's OK.

[Kev1235]

Your dads check should be fine. If it should even come up, but it probably won't and don't mention it if it doesn't. As said don't answer any questions that aren't asked. Only question that you'll definately get asked regarding future income is the one if you expect to win the lottery, to receive any sort of inheritance, etc. Stupid question, and my trustee even said everyone always laughs at it. I'd be suprised if the $500.00 check came up, neither will possibly the job situation. I was unemployed when filing and my trustee didn't ask if I had found employment or even a hope of finding employment.

To ease you even if the dad's check comes up, I reported no income on my paperwork, but the trustee noticed I have some monthly bills that need paid. I told him I was borrowing from family every month. And I am. And he was fine with that. Said he would close my case as a non asset case, wished me better luck, and currently I'm awaiting discharge on PACER.

My 341 was pretty laid back, with a pretty laid back trustee. Mine was 1 of 2 Pro Se cases and mine was probably shorter than them all. Seriously 60 seconds maybe.

[Kev1235]

On your question on Schedule I line 17.. I'm guessing it's a procedural thing? I filled in both Schedule I line 17 and Schedule J line 19. Schedule I I put: I hope to find employment but cannot forcast pay rate, and a little about my skillset and job/pay outlook. Schedule J I put: My expenditures will increase to double and they will.

Again probably just procedural, it's a question that can give them alot of info about your intent and future income/asset possibilities. I don't think those questions are to force you into 13, the means test can do that. But more so to tell the trustee if there's any money to be made, if you're being fraudulant, and abusing bankruptcy law. They might have sent you a deficiency notice for not filling out that. But things like that just fill out truthfully, not painting a pretty picture if it's not. You are probably better off writing the mumbo jumbo than trying to leave it blank and having something to send you a deficiency notice for. IMO and the general rule of bankruptcy. Leave them as few of reasons as possible to make you an example.