An update and 2 questions (one involving IRS....)

[koruption]

Gooood morning all!

I have been lurking lately because, well, everything seems to be going smooth...

8/2 is the last day to object, and nothing in yet. Zero updates on pacer, etc. So it's looking good i think lol.

Now a question that both my wife and I were kinda concerned about...

We recently had 3 different companies come out of the woodwork claiming we owe them money, threaten to sue, etc. They are all companies neither of us know anything about, but they had our social security numbers. They are not on our credit reports, and sent letters claiming to be from collection agencies, went through the spiels, etc. But they refuse to send proof of debt... and we don't knwo what to do. They won't leave us alone because we, and I quote:

"Refused to add to bankruptcy so we officially still owe the debt".

Do we just list them even though they won't provide proof or anything (and we honestly don't know what theya re for)? Is it too late to list?

Also, the IRS... oh the IRS...

See, there too everything was fine when we started this. We double and triple checked that everything was fine, we didn't owe any money. (We have had issues over the past few years between my ex-wife and myself about claiming our daughter on taxes. With each round amounts got adjusted, i thought it was settled).

Well last week I get a call from my bank, saying the IRS is putting a lien on the account, claiming now we owe 12k! After a little research, they had "accidentally" sent all the paperwork to a 5 year old address. (I know, sounds like Bull on my part. nothing I can do about that to you good people).

They are all for pre-2005 returns, and no one can give me an answer on why this is happening now. Is there anything BK related i can do with this? Or are we (to put it bluntly) screwed being pro-se this late in the game?

[HHM]

1. Just send them notice of your bankruptcy (the 341 meeting notice), that is usually sufficient. However, if there are a handful, it might be worth the $26 to amend and add them all to avoid headaches later.

2. Not sure on this one given the long time dispute. Probably screwed, but it is not clear what the issue is; if the accounts are settled, what is going on. Did you "list" the IRS claims in your BK (you should have).

[koruption]

Stupidly, we didn't list the IRS, because at the time of filing we were told we owed nothing, and have statements showing that.

This is a "recent audit" that caused this new debt, and we are as of yet unable to get any answers. It's been 'forwarded" to the proper department. That could take weeks for an answer.

edit: That was the term they used, Recent Audit. We were not informed of any audit, and again cannot get answers on that.

Can we list them now or is it just not worth it at this point, just do what we can through seperate venues and keep it seperate as to not delay or potentially harm the rest?

[helpinNE]

I think you need to ask your attorney about the IRS thing. I know taxes are not discharageable in BK but there is something wrong with them sending the mailings to 5 year old addresses. I do not know what the service laws are as they apply to the IRS but if the received a judgment for taxes and were mailing the documents to your wrong address, obviously you were not served properly but I think this is something you should talk to your attorney about.
As for the collector I would tell them to talke a hike. I would also let them know they are violating collection laws by contacting you while you are under the protection of the bk court.
Make sure your attorney notifies them of your bk. Except for child support, alimony, student loans, taxes and very few other items, all unsecured debt and secured debt you do not reaffirm is discharagable in BK.

[tigergem]

The term "recent audit" is a word they use to enable post petition claims. List them. I'm sorry, I can't cite the source at the moment, but I have been knee deep for the better part of the entire last week on IRS issues, and I remember seeing that. "Recent audit" is fighting words. They are gearing up to bypass your discharge.

[biotechsolution]

Contact the IRS, give them you BK case number and the lien should be released almost instantly.
Unless it was placed before your BK filing date.

[justbroke]

I would amend your petition and include the IRS. I'm guessing that you're talking with the Reconsideration Department? They are slow and usually take 45 days to make a decision.

[Flamingo]

You may want to do yourself a favor on this one...if I were you I would seek the advice of a tax professional/attorney as to your situation cause you are talking thousands of dollars, not a few hundred. It is not easy dealing with the IRS. With the letter indicating you don't owe anything and then a decision made and a recent audit, the best that is probably going to come out of this is that they may remove interest and penalties. Best of luck to you...

[tcreegan]

Hello Koruption,

For the companies appearing out of the woodwork, record all phone calls + name of person who called, keep all correspondence. Check in with a lawyer and ask if they want to go after them for violating BK court orders. Some lawyers love to do this, some don't.

YES add them to your creditors matrix and fill an amended one in the format required by your bk court.

YES inform them nicely that you have filed for bankruptcy and give them the case number and date filed.

now the IRS problems.........
Since tax debt does not get discharged, tackle the IRS problems head-on outside the bankruptcy court.
Find out who has the authority to change numbers in your case. Submit to them the reasons why you did not respond and ask for a complete accounting for your debt. Argue to get all interest and penalties removed b/c of the mailing problem. THen negotiate a payment plan that you can reasonably handle. I think there exists a pro-taxpayer committee/group in Washington DC that will intercede in these cases. Not sure....

Tom in Colo