Round and round with the IRS

[tigergem]

Last November, I received a notice of an owed tax in the amount of $2500, which I included in my Ch 13.

No penalties or interest had yet been assessed at the time of my filing. It is my understanding that with the filing, there would be none. Yes/no?

When I filed my 2009 return, there was a set of instructions in it relative to the same thing from 2008 that caused me to owe $2500 in the first place. So I followed those instructions, like a dummy. This made it look like I also owed $2500 for 2009. oops. Doh. Obviously I didn't think this one through very well. I should have realized that since the adjustment was already done by the IRS to my 2008 return, not to fool around and try to make the adjustment to my 2009 return according to their instructions. (Is all of that clearer than mud so far?)

To remedy this, I filed an amended return for 2009 and sent it by CMRR so I know they received it on 3/27, but I haven't heard anything back about it yet. My tax liability for 2009 should actually be zero!

Last month I was (ironically) offered a contract employment position with the IRS subject to a background investigation. I thought the debt matter with the IRS was resolved, and was actually more worried about the bankruptcy keeping me from getting the job, but I was honest in revealing the details to my potential employer, and he said, we'll just ride out the IRS' background investigation and see how it goes.

Today I got a letter from the IRS security agency "proposing denial of access" NOT because of the bankruptcy, but for 2008 IRS debt of $2617.17 and 2009 IRS debt of $2539.56. Boy oh boy.

Well, the cool thing is, they are giving me the opportunity to provide a rebuttal before they officially deny me access. I can do that, and I can even do it nicely and in a politically correct way with corporate speak, but all of this raises some questions for me.

Since filing my 1040X, I have received no other notices from the IRS indicating this matter has not been successfully resolved, but I am wondering if this notice constitutes a violation of the automatic stay, since she is basically also telling me "FIX THIS" with instructions to pay it, and... should I bring this mess to the attention of my trustee? I'm guessing probably not, since so much of it isn't even actually directly related to my bankruptcy.

[justbroke]

An employment notice that happened to come from a creditor?

[tigergem]

An employment notice that happened to come from a creditor?

Yes. The IRS conducts it's own federal background check for the IRS employment contractor.

[tigergem]

I'm really starting to like the IRS people lol.

No. Seriously. I've been on the phone with them for two hours and they have all been very nice.

I called their collections department, who confirmed I was in collections, and the VERY NICE lady I talked to gave me a phone number to the a) Bankruptcy Department and b) My very own personal Field Technician.

I called the Bankruptcy Department and they couldn't really help because they haven't received notice of my bankruptcy lol. But they gave me the number for the Examiner's office.

I also left a message for my personal special agent lol.

The Examiner's office said it isn't an Exam issue. She said it is obvious there should be no tax debt for 2009, so there is nothing for them to do. I need to call Customer Service and have them enter it in the computer, and call Collections back and "make them read" the notes she put on my account about the bankruptcy. She also tried to reach two people in the Bankruptcy (Insolvency) Department, including a supervisor and everybody was gone for the day already.

EVERYBODY has told me that they have not received notice of the bankruptcy. Besides the BNC and my personal service of the petition when I filed, I have faxed copies of the BNC TWICE and annotated on my 2009 1040X that the 2008 amount was included in my Chapter 13 bankruptcy with the case number. So I know they have received notice, but they keep saying they have not, and that is the reason it is not coded properly in the computer.

They have all been really excited to try to help me get this resolved in the computer because I told them about the hiring notice. But I keep getting the department that can't enter it. Or the department who can't enter it without authorization from the other department. I'm having a hard time keeping it all straight in my head, but have been keeping notes.

I really hate to take action against them for this in the form of a Motion, but refusal to hire solely on this basis IS actual damages. And the hiring notice DOES contain collection language.

I'm going to grab some lunch and get back to making new friends at the IRS.

:: Follow up ::

Apparently my personal special agent is the right guy. He said he can see that notice of my bankruptcy was received and yes it is coded incorrectly in the computer. He's going to try to figure out why and call me back. He told me that all of those other people aren't allowed access to the part of the system that shows those notices and wouldn't know whether notice had been received or not. And that I should stop wasting my time with them lol. Sheesh.

[tigergem]

O. My. Lord.

My special agent was at my confirmation hearing. lol. He remembered the announcement that my Trustee made about my confirmation. And I think I remember him as the guy who was sitting in front of me in the pin striped suit lol. He was the only one with stripes, all the other attorneys wore solids.

But he's on it. He asked me to file a claim on behalf of the IRS because what happened was, I included the IRS in my bankruptcy before the IRS knew I owed it. So the reason all the notices went astray was because they didn't have a debt to apply it to.

As well there is a new address for receipt of bk notices and mine were going to the old address.

[justbroke]

But did he fix your employment letter?

[tigergem]

Technically - YES. All he can really do is make sure that it is coded properly so that the amount owing is reflected as included in the bankruptcy repayment plan. It won't show paid off until my discharge, and will actually reflect as an amount still in collections. But so long as I am under a repayment agreement, that is what the Personnel Security wanted to see.

[tigergem]

My Trustee is a little upset, though, because the IRS did not file a proof of claim. So now I have to file a motion for a late claim under excusable neglect and do it for them. I mean I guess it is excusable neglect if I knew I owed them money before they fully realized it. But I got a notice from them in November (a month before I filed) that the matter was coming up for review, and I had to respond or accept their assessment. It really was a mistake on my part, so I didn't argue it. But then they didn't make their assessment until February, after I filed.

[tigergem]

[tigergem]

So my claim on behalf of the IRS got entered into PACER today. One day after my motion to allow it. Do you suppose I confused the clerks? I thought it was pretty obvious. I filed the claim and proof along with the motion to allow it late filed and the proposed order.