Personal Property & Exemption Question

[caj0524]

So here I am working on getting confirmation #3 on a chapter 13 case... This new Trustee is asking for something that was either an oversight on the previous 2 cases, or she's just confused.

On the Personal Property Schedule 6B, #25, Vehicles: She said I need to put in their value in the far right column "CURRENT VALUE OF DEBTOR'S INTEREST...".

Since we owe much more than they are worth, my last 2 cases have had a value of $0 in that column, with no questions asked from the Trustees. This one says they are worth more than $0... and needs a number there.

OK... so playing along, if I put a number there, that increases the value of my personal property from $5,100 to $29,700. The $5,100 is exempted, however the personal property exemption in Illinois is only $8,000 for a couple. Won't we need to somehow use an exemption to cover the additional?

What am I missing?

Thanks!

[justbroke]

On the Personal Property Schedule 6B, #25, Vehicles: She said I need to put in their value in the far right column "CURRENT VALUE OF DEBTOR'S INTEREST...".

Yeah, you put the actual current market value of the item. I don't know how you got away with it last time. Schedule "B" (Personal Property -- Official Form 6B), lists all personal property and its value. If you read the column it actually reads... "Current Value of Debtor's Interest in Property, without Deducting any Secured Claim or Exemption". Emphasis on "without"!

OK... so playing along, if I put a number there, that increases the value of my personal property from $5,100 to $29,700. The $5,100 is exempted, however the personal property exemption in Illinois is only $8,000 for a couple. Won't we need to somehow use an exemption to cover the additional?

There's a difference between what something is worth and what exemption you have on it. Since your vehicles are underwater, you would not put anything on Schedule C to exempt even $1 of the property. Understand?

However, on Schedule D, secured claims, you would then put in the actual value again (from Schedule B), along with what portion is "unsecured". Because a portion is unsecured, that means the item is completely encumbered.

What am I missing?

I think you just been awake too long. Get some rest!

[cmcfall]

Question regarding Schedule D

Yeah, you put the actual current market value of the item. I don't know how you got away with it last time. Schedule "B" (Personal Property -- Official Form 6B), lists all personal property and its value. If you read the column it actually reads... "Current Value of Debtor's Interest in Property, without Deducting any Secured Claim or Exemption". Emphasis on "without"!

There's a difference between what something is worth and what exemption you have on it. Since your vehicles are underwater, you would not put anything on Schedule C to exempt even $1 of the property. Understand?

However, on Schedule D, secured claims, you would then put in the actual value again (from Schedule B), along with what portion is "unsecured". Because a portion is unsecured, that means the item is completely encumbered.

I think you just been awake too long. Get some rest!

Hi Justbroke, on schedule D what would qualify an amount as "unsecured" or "encumbered"?

Thank you