Over-median pro se filer; 341 this week

[joedirtpharm]

Greets! First post, wanted to give thanks to Forums and respective members for their contributions - been quitely lurking throughout the past couple months as I prepared my filing.

Filed Chapter 7 in AZ, over-median income and passed the means test despite my income ($130k/yr) thanks largely in part to a the amount of priority non-secured debt (back taxes, domestic support), lack of equity in the home, and two automobiles. The expenses for maintaining the $120k in student loans is listed in my Schedule J... would have been nice to allow for that in the Means Test as a security blanket in case my expenses are scrutinized.

The 341 hearing is later this week; received a standard request of information from the Trustee - appears to be very professional and polite in her communication thus far - even placed a courtesy call back to me regarding some missing documentation (bank statement from a CU in California ($1 balance)) and a statement letter from the State retirement fund.

Attempting to reaffirm both vehicles (monies still due to two lenders) and the home, of which I have only recevied a reaffirmation from one of the auto lenders...

Received a call from the UST office today, asked a couple questions regarding my filing:

- Wanted to know if I received any help with the preparation and paperwork;
- Was the retirement contribution mandatory (pension account);
- Were both vehicle operable, insured, and necessary for me to keep;
- Stated that I could not include expenses for Cable TV (listed a single-sum amount for the bundled telecommunications costs ) and wanted me to clarify costs for Internet, Telephone, and Cell phone expenses;
- Asked if I provided my Trustee with proof of domestic obligation; the UST stated my Trustee is very thorough;
- Asked if I had any questions for her, and if the number she called is a good numebr to contact me if she had any other questions, and reminded me to attend my upcoming 341.

Means test shows -$350/mo; not taking into account the Student Loans and other expenses on my Schedule J (which came to nearly -$600/mo).

I do not have any charitable contributions, no exchanges of gift or land (ever), no exorbitant amounts of furniture, no vacations, no business expenses, no personal entaglements, no jewelry, inheritances, etc. To me, everything appears straighforward: debt > income.

So.... just patiently waiting until the 341. Not sure if anyone wants me to post more information for FYI purposes on my filing information. I acknowledge it will be a considerable uphill battle given my income range and pro se status... unfortunately, I could not find an attorney that would consider this matter for under $4,000 which is unobtainable at the moment.

Thoughts/opinions/concerns? Will share more information as it occurs...

[tigergem]

I am in a 13. Funny, the Ch 13 Trustee really looked hard at my combined cell/internet bill, and specifically questioned me on that. There was no mention at all of the $15/month I allowed myself for Netflix since I don't have TV at all. (Watch dvd's on the 'puter) I had coincidentally switched to a much cheaper cell phone plan between the time of my filing and my 341, and told her so in response to her question. She made me amend my budget! I haven't heard from the UST at all, so I guess they decided I wasn't speshul.

All I can say is good luck. If you have to amend anything after your 341, be sure to pay particular attention to your LOCAL rules of bankruptcy procedure, and lean on your local bankruptcy clerk for procedural questions. Mine have been most helpful. So was my trustee once I finally got his attention.

[Meatstick]

Thanks for the info. We also will be filing a Ch7 in AZ but are using a lawyer. Great info.

[joedirtpharm]

Well, back from an uneventful 341... dunno if that's good or bad?

Would like to provide the link to the thread regarding the Phoenix, AZ Fed Courthouse info; everything was as described: http://www.bkforum.com/showthread.php?p=357994

The questions asked were the standard set one could expect:

• What is your full name?
• What is your current phone number?
• Did you read the schedules that were submitted? Are they accurate to your knowledge (I shared with the Trustee that at the close of business on my filing date, an item had not yet cleared as expected and my checking account balance was about $100 more than stated on Schedule B - she just smiled and nodded)
• Did you list all of your assets?
• Did you list all of your creditors?
• Did you know that signing the schedule was the same as saying "yes" to the oath I just read?
• Have you filed bankruptcy within the past 8 years?
• How long have you lived in Arizona?
• Do I have any domestic support obligations; and if so, am I current?
• Are you party to any lawsuit?
• Did I receive/expect to receive any inheritance?
• Do I have any offshore accounts?
• Do I promise to contact the Trustee if I come into any lottery winnings or inheritances?
• Who completed the paperwork on my behalf? (myself)

Trustee thanked me for my appearance, and said that was the conclusion of our meeting. I was expecting the UST to be present, or further scrutiny on the items the UST contacted me about earlier this week... but nothing of the sort mentioned. Done in 5 minutes...

Debtor immediately before me was questioned about some checking and savings accounts he had not listed in his schedules, and that the Trustee discovered them during 'forensic accounting' (whatever that is); the debtor's attorney was noticably pissed about this omission.

The Trustee's introduction was a sternly worded summary about how thorough her office is regarding the discovery of assets, and that BK fraud would be prosecuted and your case dismissed, etc; I guess this supports the UST's statments that my assigned Trustee 'is a very, very thorough Trustee". There were 3 other pro se debtors there in our group of 6.

So, a wait-n-see moment I guess as to whether any objections from the UST come up. As per the request of another member, this is the following situation for myself:

Monthly Income: ~$11,000
Means Test: Passed, ($400)
Unsecured liabilities: $580,000
Total liabilities: $750,000
Schedule J: ($600/mo)

So, thank you again for everyone's participation in the Forums - more info to come as it is received.

[tigergem]

Good post Joe! Glad it all went smooth for you. Interesting that mention of forensic accounting and discovery of assets. I guess that means that if I had any bank accounts open somewhere that I had forgotten about, the Trustee would have let me know? lol! That was my greatest paranoia moment, actually, going in to my 13. "What if I have assets I forgot about?" Which, given the nature of my disability, would be entirely possible for me to do. I guess I didn't though. Or at least he hasn't said so.

[joedirtpharm]

PACER lists a "Chapter 7 Trustee's Report of No Distribution" as of this morning, guess that means the clock is ticking on the 60 days...

[tigergem]

Good job!

[joedirtpharm]

So I've hit what could be considered a snag, and could use some direction on the matter.

The second week of March, I filed two reaffirmation agreements (and subsequent motions) with the court and then waited patiently for a reaffirmation hearing date and then a discharge.

Last week (approximately 7 weeks after filing), I get a notice that each reaffirmation was denied because I failed to include copies of the original instrument that established the leins on the house and vehicle - now mind you I didn't see that requirement anywhere, on anything, but if that's the only hiccup throughout this process then I don't believe I did too bad on this. The notice said I had 15 days plus 3 days mailing to correct the deficiency and resubmit the required documentation - that letter is dated May 6, 2010.

So I contacted my home and auto lender, for copies of the original contracts; the home lender's copy arrived today - still awaiting the auto lender. However...

What also came in the mail was my notice of discharge dated for May 12th, 2010... WTF?!

Don't get me wrong, that's great, but I thought the reaffirmation agreements had to be signed-off prior to discharge? Of course, the courts are closed so I have to mull this over for the evening.

Did I just lose the opportunity to reaffirm? Can I reopen the matter for the reaffirmation agreements? Do the 15 (18) days permit reconsideration of the the debt despite discharge?

Any information is appreciated - thank you in advance!

[justbroke]

Congratulations.

Yes, reaffirmations have to be filed and entered BEFORE the discharge date, otherwise the debt is discharged. Did you really want to reaffirm the mortgage? Think about that? If your lender will let you ride-through... DO NOT REAFFIRM. Do not reaffirm even if you "need the tradeline"! You'll thank me later.

As for the automobile, think about that one too.

[joedirtpharm]

Congratulations.

Yes, reaffirmations have to be filed and entered BEFORE the discharge date, otherwise the debt is discharged. Did you really want to reaffirm the mortgage? Think about that? If your lender will let you ride-through... DO NOT REAFFIRM. Do not reaffirm even if you "need the tradeline"! You'll thank me later.

As for the automobile, think about that one too.

I appreciate the advice - it's given me pause to think about it...

I contacted the courts today - they acknowledge the timelines and stated that I still have the remaining number of days left to cure the deficiency despite discharge, says, "It happens all the time" since I initiated the process prior to discharge. Now, my understanding is this runs contrary to everything I've read about the reaff process, but if the judge OK's it, well...

So, I can do without reaffirming the vehicle - it's almost paid off and the CU openly suggested a ride-through option was available and to continue making payments. The home is what I'm concerned about - I could do without the worry that GMAC may decide to get a wild hair and foreclose on a whim. I am not behind on payments, but they are bastards to deal with, as I'm sure many can attest.

End the end, it's about peace-of-mind and the benefit of the tradelines... open to thoughts on the matter - I have until the end of the week to file the deficencies. Thank you!

[justbroke]

It's not against what you heard. The Reaffirmation needs to be "filed" prior to the discharge. Then, if you're pro se, the Clerk will schedule a hearing so you can beg the Judge to let you reaffirm the property. The key is filing before the date.

If you filed pro se and if it's never "approved" by the court -- at a hearing -- then it is unenforceable.

[lezlovin]

tigergem, wow your trustee sounds like a huge pain in the butt, making you ammend the schedule over a cell phone bill. come on.

[tigergem]

tigergem, wow your trustee sounds like a huge pain in the butt, making you ammend the schedule over a cell phone bill. come on.

Oh yeah, lol, that was a piece of work. It so happens that my health insurance or something had also gone up just enough to just about offset the drop in my phone bill, so my net change to my schedules was less than $5.00/month or something like that. It was really stupid. Stuff has changed even since then. I wonder how they would feel if I submitted quarterly schedule changes?