Homeowner insurance question in light of BK & foreclosure

[KevFinnerty]

Thanks housepoor. Good luck again with your situation.

As of today my insurance is NOT canceled. The rep cleared up the mess with the underwriter as of today. I asked for confirmation of "not being canceled" in writing and he said I would be getting some kind of "not canceled" notification so I guess I will just wait for that next.

I did ask him (again) who notified the insurance company that the house was vacant and he said he did not know, but that by all logic it had to be the bank. However he/the insurance company will not get involved in this any further than that. They will not go back to whoever "notified" them and tell them "no you're wrong" etc.

I do leave my front blinds open during the day in the kitchen, as well as upstairs. There isn't anything valuable exposed, unless they are interested in stealing my dirty dishes in the kitchen sink, or climbing up a ladder to peer into my bedroom. Leaving those open during the day reinforces that my house IS NOT VACANT and I intend to keep doing that.

As far as your idea about putting a note up on the front door, I am not comfortable with that. I think that accomplishes nothing since in theory a house could be vacant but the owner could put a note up to say its not so the snoopers are probably trained to ignore something like that no matter what you put in a note, and in my case, with a townhouse and neighbors all over in close proximity that kind of note would attract attention that I do NOT want (from my neighbors, delivery men, meter readers, people I know coming over, etc). I do NOT want to be part of the neighborhood gossip mill - "oh my god did you see that Mr. so & so has a note on his door saying his house isn't vacant, he must be facing foreclosure!!!" etc.

As far as calling the bank atty's I think that is a bad idea. I want no contact with them at all outside of a courtroom or something my atty would communicate with them in legalese.

I think posting no trespassing signs is a great idea, but in my case I am not allowed to do that because of homeowner association regulations. I do have a video camera recording all day anything that happens at the front of my house though. Small comfort if they break in and change the locks though. I'm definitely paranoid about it even though it SHOULDN'T happen. Every time I go out for whatever reason I look all around the street & the neighborhood to see if some strange car is hanging around, perhaps waiting for me to leave so they can "secure" the property. If I had to go away for a couple days I would be sick with worry wondering what might happen in my absence.

[housepoor10]

Kevin,

Any updates on the snoops?
I found this today, and thought you would like it. Food for thought in case something does happen.

Wells Fargo commenced a foreclosure action on a New York Homeowner. The homeowner notified Wells Fargo that, although he had discontinued utility services and winterized and secured the dwelling, he had not abandoned it.

He visited the property regularly and had a neighbor watch it in his absence. After Wells Fargo found the front door of the home open, it had the locks changed, and secured and winterized it.

The homeowner claimed that damage was caused to the home and various items of personal property were taken. The mortgage stated that the lender could enter and inspect the property in a reasonable manner and at reasonable times on notice.

However, there was no indication that notice to the homeowner was provided by Wells Fargo. The mortgage also stated that if the property was abandoned, Wells Fargo could secure and repair the property, including changing the locks.

The New York Supreme Court, Suffolk County held that Wells Fargo had committed a trespass and awarded the homeowner $200 in damages for the trespass, $4,982 for the value of the personal property that was lost and $150,000 for punitive damages.

Sweet Justice there!!!

[KevFinnerty]

Interesting story. Good for them. I doubt there are many positive home owner type stories like that though; although I'm sure they went through a tremendous amount of hassle.

As far as my case goes I don't have any updates. I haven't noticed any snoops in June although they could have been here unknown to me. No neighbors have stopped by to tell me anything weird going on. Have not had further communications from the bank.

I'm still just kind of holding my breath to see what happens next. I live in a perpetual state of unreal stress & depression with all that is going on with me, just trying to ignore the bk & foreclosure worries as best I can, struggling to survive, trying to get a job while I am still living here instead of waiting until I moved which is what I had originally planned on.

Hope things are OK on your end.

[KevFinnerty]

I wanted to share a frustrating update to this crazy mess.

My house has been out of foreclosure since around March. For unknown reasons (actually I have some guesses as to why), Chase (my bank)'s lawyers filed with the court to "vacate" the foreclosure judgment against me and close the foreclosure case. So as of then I no longer had to have a daily watch checking my county's website for upcoming foreclosure sheriff sales - instead they would have to go back and restart the whole process, file in court again to get a foreclosure judgment - and who knows how long all that would take.

However in the meantime since I have been working again since last December and slowly getting back on my feet, I applied for a mortgage modification through the HAMP program and was approved! I passed through the trial period and am now in what is known as a "permanent loan modification". My mortgage is not technically even delinquent anymore. Of course that in itself is a long story I won't go into (their income calculations are wrong and the new monthly payments are about 38% of my monthly gross instead of 31% as per HAMP rules but I am managing to make ends meet with mega-OT, and trying to get a better job but I digress).

So with this now behind me, I would have thought the bank's "your house is vacant" type of threats were over. Not so. My home insurance company just contacted me & said that Chase had contacted them to notify them that my house is vacant and that they have to cancel my policy unless I can prove I live here. Unbelievable. I called Chase & raised holy hell, and also told my insurance agent that Chase needs to correct this - not me "proving" I live here. At this point my policy could actually get canceled as the agent told me he can't control what will happen next because it is up to the insurance company's "underwriter" what to do.

I would like to know if that happens (my policy getting canceled because Chase has screwed up YET AGAIN) can I SUE THEM and how?????? I am so fed up with their numerous mistakes and b.s.

[keepsmiling]

I would talk to someone at the top both places-- in person preferably---and also seriously consider suing Chase.
I know they have deep pockets and it could be a losing battle, but it might get their attention.
Your story would make a good movie of the week. Hope you get a book deal out of it at least

[keepsmiling]

Oh and I always like the idea of bringing it to the local news. People love to hear about big banks screwing people.

[ValleYum]

A utility bill in your name at the property's address is what my insurance company required. It was also a requirement on the loan mods we attempted as they wanted to make sure we were living at the property at that time. Sorry for all your troubles, Kev. Geesh!

[keepsmiling]

I have found 3-way conferencing helpful at times.

[tobee43]

I wanted to share a frustrating update to this crazy mess.

My house has been out of foreclosure since around March. For unknown reasons (actually I have some guesses as to why), Chase (my bank)'s lawyers filed with the court to "vacate" the foreclosure judgment against me and close the foreclosure case. So as of then I no longer had to have a daily watch checking my county's website for upcoming foreclosure sheriff sales - instead they would have to go back and restart the whole process, file in court again to get a foreclosure judgment - and who knows how long all that would take.

However in the meantime since I have been working again since last December and slowly getting back on my feet, I applied for a mortgage modification through the HAMP program and was approved! I passed through the trial period and am now in what is known as a "permanent loan modification". My mortgage is not technically even delinquent anymore. Of course that in itself is a long story I won't go into (their income calculations are wrong and the new monthly payments are about 38% of my monthly gross instead of 31% as per HAMP rules but I am managing to make ends meet with mega-OT, and trying to get a better job but I digress).

So with this now behind me, I would have thought the bank's "your house is vacant" type of threats were over. Not so. My home insurance company just contacted me & said that Chase had contacted them to notify them that my house is vacant and that they have to cancel my policy unless I can prove I live here. Unbelievable. I called Chase & raised holy hell, and also told my insurance agent that Chase needs to correct this - not me "proving" I live here. At this point my policy could actually get canceled as the agent told me he can't control what will happen next because it is up to the insurance company's "underwriter" what to do.

I would like to know if that happens (my policy getting canceled because Chase has screwed up YET AGAIN) can I SUE THEM and how?????? I am so fed up with their numerous mistakes and b.s.

ahhhhhhhhhh Chase, my favorite and also they are the one's that hold my property which they haven't even attempted to foreclose on in over 4.5 years. in the state we own the property and most likely the same with yours a home owners insurance company will only insure if "owner" occupied. you can easily ask the insurance company what they would consider "proof"...an electric bill, a gas bill, phone bill....TAX bill?? what do they EXACTLY need as proof, i'm certain you can fax them something. don't count on Chase to do anything, i have never seen such incompetence, well, i take that back, i have seen that much incompetence, it was when all the large companies let all the experience people go and put these types in these jobs that all don't know what they are doing.

another suggestion i have, is don't call Chase, go in, as much as that hurts go face to face and straighten it out.

wish we can all sue Chase....unfortunately, it comes time to pick our battles and stop picking our pockets dry for legal fees trying to fight the banks. they will win, no matter.

best of luck, i'm certain it will work out!

[KevFinnerty]

Supposedly this is straightened out now after me blowing my top when calling Chase about this. I have to see what happens next though, I would not be too shocked if in 3 months this happens all over again....thanks for the replies & for letting me vent.

[KevFinnerty]

Well I spoke too soon. Chase had ASSURED me that this was all straightened out and they had even called my insurance company to explain. Yet HERE WE GO AGAIN...

....Got a notification in today's mail that my insurance company has CANCELED my policy because my house is "not owner occupied".

I will be calling my BK atty on Tuesday (my next day off) and ask how I can go about SUING Chase. If anyone has any advice or experience along those lines PLEASE comment.

[keepsmiling]

Ah Kev. Never a moment's peace.
So sorry.
Have you gone and sat in the bank president's office yet?
btw we have had some minor success suing Chase. They are real pips.

[tobee43]

kev, i wish you had the money to sue chase. maybe we can all get a class action suit going????

i'm sorry to say, i'm not surprised. have you tried to contact your insurance carrier directly. i would do that, and no longer deal with chase on this matter. really, they just like hitting yourself against a brick wall. you need to get this deep into your pockets and enjoy the holiday season without stress...

[keepsmiling]

Tobee, for good or bad, we are part of one of the class action suits against our pals at Chase. Probably a few others here are as well. The only ones who make out on those are the big firms that can afford to initiate the action.
So maybe I'll get my 1.63
But because of that I can't get a nice judgement against them...
I did, however, get their suit against me dismissed, with prejudice; and dh has sued them for others and gotten decent settlements.
They do not always cross all their t's. They're perhaps...cocky.

[KevFinnerty]

There has GOT to be something that I (we) can do to make these bastards bleed. I am not putting up with this garbage anymore. A national media story perhaps? A criminal investigation through the state attorney's office? WHAT?

At this point I believe that gross incompetence can no longer be responsible for this ongoing mess. THIS HAS TO BE HAPPENING ON PURPOSE. I can think of no scenario whatsoever where any honorable company could not have corrected this as a mistake ALREADY.

In the meantime if anyone can save me some much valuable time and steer me in the direction of how to learn about issues connected with getting a home insurance policy I would appreciate it. I am fearful that this will be another HUGE MESS, complicated by my recent bankruptcy/poor credit rating, recent foreclosure action (which is over), any company wondering why my existing company has dropped me, and of course should I get new coverage then that company will start getting Chase's "this property is vacant" crap, hell that may even come up BEFORE I can get a policy! I can't believe this. SUcks that I have to wait until tomorrow to hopefully get a voicemail from my insurance agent, and it will be Tuesday (my next day off) before I can call him back or talk to a lawyer. I so do not have ANY time for this AT ALL either.