file BK without spousal approval.

[kathyc02124]

I had a gambling problem. I ran up large debts. He took money out of his retirement funds to bail me out. Not once, but twice. Each time he warned me that I was getting in trouble and he would not help me again. Then, again I got into more trouble. Now he will not help me. And I don't blame him. I am ok with that. I understand what I did. And I want to come straight. But he said he will not bail me out again for I must learn this on my own. The problem is, I cannot get a chapter 7 due to is income?

[Pjmax]

Kathy, thanks for being honest, I'm sure it's hard for you. You are among friends, and there are others here with gambling issues.

Are you in GA? That should be the first step, you are going to need help to kick this and resist the temptation to relapse. Solving your financial issue is not going to happen until you deal with your addiction. I say this with love and concern.

Who do you owe money to? Payday loans? Or, did you run up the debt on your joint credit cards? If C7 isn't an option for you, and it sounds like it isn't, if you could share some more info, maybe someone can help you figure out how best to deal with it.

[keepsmiling]

Your dh has to understand... it is, in fact, his problem, since his name is on the cards.
Step One- tear up cc's NOW.
Step Two... get to GA.
Step Three... counselors/attorneys.
All in rapid succession.
I wonder if you might want to try hypnosis for your compulsion? It may be helpful and couldn't hurt.
Even if you got divorced--- and I am not wishing this on you... the problem would STILL be his. Any leg-breaking (just kidding) ,lawsuits, effect on credit score, or garnishment will be done to him as well as you.
He needs help to see this clearly, which is just one good reason to get him to the appointments with you.
It's a shame that he raided his retirement account and then didn't insist that you get some professional help for your problem. Not everyone understands how hard it is to control an addiction.

There is a possibility,if these were illegal payday loans.... that you could get them discharged based on illegality. Any chance that's the case?

As you can see, the more you tell us, the better we can help you.

[AngelinaCatHub]

Kathy, there are worse vises than gambling. Our god-daughter has a drug problem (coke) and a lot more damaging in many ways. Your pseudo-family here has and will give you good advice. Whether you take any is your call. My two cents now is this: As you were advised to do, turn over all your cards, check books, etc. cut up to hubby. Talk to him and do NOTHING behind his back. He is expecting now to see what you are going to do on your own behalf (I am putting myself into his place as to what I would do). ASK him if you can use 100% of your income from YOUR job in a pay down attempt of your current bills. Take the smallest first and work up. Talk to your card companies and pay the minimum on each but pay as much as you are able to to the smallest account, double payment if you can. Keep doing this as best you can until one by one the account become zero. Making this heroic effort will be noticed as good faith by your hubby. Don't make more of this than what it is, but this MUST be your last time. You can lick this sickness and yes it is a sickness the same as dope to others. We all have an addiction of sorts, but those that do not damage us can be normal. Your addiction is damaging your marriage, peace of mind, economical security, and mental health. Some people are addicted to chocolate cake. It may work out for them but to some, even chocolate cake could kill.

We are all rooting for you and are proud that you have been candid with us. I really don't believe you need a bankruptcy. I believe you could work with your creditors and they would rather work with you than lose your money. The important thing is to get that habit behind you and time will fix it. 'Hub

[Pjmax]

Nicely said, Hub!

[kathyc02124]

I'm embarrassed to say this but I owe a lot of money to people that I never should have borrowed money from. They are no companies but other people in the business of fronting money freely at very high return rates. So they have to be paid before I can pay anything else. I really don't want to say much more about that. Just suffice to say there is no money to pay a credit card payment. I had a dream that all could be ok if I could file BK and get rid of all those payments, that would have made it bearable. When a credit card company calls and tries to put pressure on me to make a payment it's actually nice to hear a somewhat friendly voice on the other end of the phone. That should tell you what my social life is like right now. The other people looking for a payment, well, they don't "ask" for it. So they are paid first.

[Pjmax]

Kathy, I'm so sorry for you. I've spent most of the day trying to figure out the best way to reply. I still think you need to get to GA. I would imagine DH can no longer trust your promises to never do it again. You are going to have to prove yourself. You are in a desperate situation and frame of mind, and that increases the chances of making rash decisions. Get to those meetings and keep going. You need the support of those who understand what you are going through to keep you straight, and DH needs to see you are taking steps to conquer your problem.

Most BK attorneys offer free initial consults, so maybe you and DH should make a few appointments and discuss the situation. You will probably hear the same answers you've heard here about filing on your own.

Who is currently in charge of paying the bills, working out a budget? Under the circumstances, you should be doing it together. You also need to give up the credit cards now. Hand over your paychecks to DH if that's what it takes to earn his trust. Live on an allowance for awhile, a few months, a year, whatever it takes.

There is no instant fix here, and on your income alone without help, you will be paying off that debt for years. Trying to figure out how to BK and instantly free up some of your CC payments to pay the loan sharks isn't going to work. DH is in this whether he wants to be or not. His money and share of everything is in jeopardy. You have to work this out between you, with a counselor if that will help.

Now, stop beating yourself up over this. What you've done in the past is done. What is important now, is what you do from here on. I do hope you and DH can work through this together, if it's successful, your marriage will just be stronger.

My thoughts are with you.

[kathyc02124]

"there's no instant fix here..." Then what is the bankruptcy law for? I thought when a person has no where else to turn, this was a last resort. But it just doesn't work out. Thank you for trying. I guess it isn't meant to be.

[keepsmiling]

And you are correct. You CAN still file for bk.
You just have to do it together.
Because you are married and the credit is in both names.

Except... even that might not help you, because your particular creditors don't sound like they operate like banks. They probably don't care about things like 60-day stays, credit reports, cease and desist letters, fdcpa violations......
And now that gentle reprimand.... time to face reality. Did you speak to hubby yet? Get yourself to GA yet? if not do it today!!!

[Pandora]

I feel sorry for your situation if you're into owing "those types of people" money. As Keep pointed out, you cant discharge that kind of debt, hopefully if you file BK you'll have enough money to pay them off if this is the case. I pray if this really is the situation, that your husband (and yourself) have a heart to heart soul searching discussion of how these types of people work when money is owed to them and pay them off as soon as possible, never getting into that situation again.

Your husband should be more concerned (again if this truly is the case) about owing these people money (doesnt matter WHO owes it..you're married - half a dozen of one, half a dozen of the other, ya know?) than his credit rating.

Good luck in whatever you decide.

[dina13]

Pandora, payday loans CAN be discharged in BK. And if they violate BK stay, they can be sued like any other creditors.

[keepsmiling]

We said that right away. I suspect these lenders are even less kosher than payday guys.

[CarolynTIXE]

Hi Kathy,

If you are anywhere near Harvard, they offer pro bono services for chapter 13 filers that fall under certain income guidelines. You always have the option to attend the pro se (meaning people without an attorney) clinic at your local bankruptcy court for assistance. These clinics are free of charge as well. Although these resources may not answer all of your questions, you may find it helpful to be in the company of others in the same situation and get clarification regarding the different kinds of bankruptcy protection available to you (e.g. chapters 7, 13, and 11). You can try running terms like "massachusetts pro bono bankruptcy clinic" through your search engine.

When I was with the Office of the U.S. Trustee, we saw plenty of married individuals file without their spouses in a variety of chapters. It happens. The best bet is to make sure to be completely forthcoming about your financial picture on your petition: assets, liabilities, income, expenses ... the whole nine yards. Bankruptcy is our government's solution to give people a chance to recover from bad financial situations. That's one reason I respect this process so much ... a chance for everyone. But according to the Bankruptcy Code, Local Rules, etc., an entity has to fall within certain guidelines to receive this relief. The complicated nature of these rules and regulations makes it very important that you seek the advice of licensed, qualified legal counsel. And I stress "licensed" and "qualified".

You're doing some great preliminary research here. Be sure to exercise the same diligence when deciding who will prepare your petition and represent you, if anyone.

[LadyInTheRed]

We said that right away. I suspect these lenders are even less kosher than payday guys.

Yeah, I think these are the type of creditors that don't use the courts for collection. This is the husband's problem whether he likes it or not. They both may be in physical danger.

[Pjmax]

Kathy, you haven't been too specific about your total finances, but I'll try and explain in simple general terms, as I understand it. IF all your accounts, assets, debts are JOINT, IF you could successfully BK on your OWN, you would be discharged from responsibility, but DH would not and would be solely responsible for the debts, and in addition, his credit report would be affected, because these BKs on joint accounts have a way of intruding on the non-BKer's reports. AND, as a couple, you would still owe the full amount, nothing will go away, it just gets shifted from both of you to DH. I'm sort of getting the impression that you think filing BK yourself would wipe out your half of the debt.

And, I'm not even considering the loan-shark debt (I don't know what else to call it.) As said above, it sounds like these lenders may not operate within the law.