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Utility company charging tap fee post-bankruptcy.

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    #1

    Utility company charging tap fee post-bankruptcy.

    I would greatly appreciate it if anybody can provide some guidance on an issue that my client has.

    I represent this individual in a Chapter 7 Bankruptcy. He has had issues with the water company for several years regarding his delinquent water account and their suspicion that he was illegally tapped into their system. The water company removed the actual tap from my client's property, because he would simply turn the water on at the valve after the water company would turn it off. This happened 2 years ago and my client's residence still does not have water.

    Fast forward to the present. He filed for bankruptcy a few months ago. I contacted the water company and advised them of the bankruptcy and requested that they resume service to the residence. The water company informed me that they would resume service, that my client had to pay $2,500.00 for them to install the water tap. This is the amount that they charge every new customer/residence needing a tap.

    Obviously my question is does my client have to pay this amount. I'm inclined to say that he does, as this was not a debt incurred prior to bankruptcy, nor is this an attempt by the water company to collect on a pre-filing debt. This is simply an amount the water company charges to install a tap. I have been unable to find any case law regarding this issue. Any thoughts or ideas are greatly appreciated.
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    #2
    I don't know that there is going to be case law on this....

    From what you state, your client was using water from an "unapproved" tap into the system. Now.... it's not unusual for taps to be around, for many times they are placed there during the construction phase of new pipelines. It appears that your client had hooked onto one of these sources, and had that "free" water.

    There is nothing wrong with the water company removing/uninstalling the tap that was there. There is nothing wrong with the water company charging the consumer the normal fee for the new tap.

    That is standard procedure, the way it is done, and has nothing do to with bankruptcy (in my opinion).

    Not only did I not cite any laws, I didn't even stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night. Your mileage may vary........
    All information contained in this post is for informational and amusement purposes only.
    Bankruptcy is a process, not an event.......

    Comment

      #3
      Originally posted by GbgBkrAtty View Post
      I would greatly appreciate it if anybody can provide some guidance on an issue that my client has.

      I represent this individual in a Chapter 7 Bankruptcy. He has had issues with the water company for several years regarding his delinquent water account and their suspicion that he was illegally tapped into their system. The water company removed the actual tap from my client's property, because he would simply turn the water on at the valve after the water company would turn it off. This happened 2 years ago and my client's residence still does not have water.

      Fast forward to the present. He filed for bankruptcy a few months ago. I contacted the water company and advised them of the bankruptcy and requested that they resume service to the residence. The water company informed me that they would resume service, that my client had to pay $2,500.00 for them to install the water tap. This is the amount that they charge every new customer/residence needing a tap.

      .
      No case law here either for you, just plain old common sense. It sounds like your client needs to pay for water service and a new tap fee, bothersome as that may be to your client. Perhaps let him know that the tap fee may be equal or less than all the free water he received while turning on the service after the water company shut it off. Perhaps that will make it easier to swallow...
      Last edited by newbie2; 07-15-2011, 02:10 PM.
      Filed Chapter 13 02/2006 - Confirmed 05/2006 - Discharged 09/2011
      I'm not an attorney. My replies are merely suggestions or observations, not legal advice. As always, consult with an attorney before making any decisions.

      Comment

        #4
        The key is whether he had serviced when he filed bankruptcy. Where you want to look is no further than 11 USC 366 and the combination of non-bankruptcy law. Specifically, for the latter, you would look at the public utility laws and what they allow in your State (Pennsylvania).

        I would say that this is not a violation of the stay under 11 USC 362 and is not a violation under 11 USC 366 regarding utility services. For all intents and purposes, your client IS a new client to the water company.

        You may want to pursue "adequate" assurance under 11 USC 366, but I don't think that works here. I find this no different than a post-petition deposit, albeit that the post-petition deposit can be modified by the Judge under 11 USC 366.
        Chapter 7 (No Asset/Non-Consumer) Filed (Pro Se) 7/08 (converted from Chapter 13 - 2/10)
        Status: (Auto) Discharged and Closed! 5/10
        Visit My BKForum Blog: justbroke's Blog

        Any advice provided is not legal advice, but simply the musings of a fellow bankrupt.

        Comment

          #5
          I had one other thought on this..... perhaps your client should understand that the possibility is there for theft of services charges from the utility. It doesn't happen a lot, but it's not pretty when it does.

          Your client needs to come up with the $$$ and not rock that boat too hard.
          All information contained in this post is for informational and amusement purposes only.
          Bankruptcy is a process, not an event.......

          Comment

            #6
            How has this client managed to live without water for 2 years??????

            Comment

              #7
              Discouraged - I wondered about living without running water for 2 years too. But maybe we don't want to know the answer

              Comment

                #8
                Originally posted by GbgBkrAtty View Post

                He has had issues with the water company for several years regarding his delinquent water account and their suspicion that he was illegally tapped into their system. The water company removed the actual tap from my client's property, because he would simply turn the water on at the valve after the water company would turn it off. This happened 2 years ago and my client's residence still does not have water.
                How can he have a deliquent water account if he was illegally tapped into the system? If they kept shutting it off due to him not paying the required hook-up fee, then they could get him for theft; I've seen it happen to many people (Hubby is in the water/wastewater field).

                Another concern would be if he has no running water (well or otherwise) and the Health Dept gets wind of it, his house could be condemned and/or mandated he hook up and pay all fees plus penalties; something to check into.

                Comment

                  #9
                  Exactly. Excuse me, but we all have bodily functions. How is this person able to resolve that with no water, unless he possibly has an outhouse and a well to pump water from.

                  Comment

                    #10
                    It would seem that the issue of your client and what he had or had not done is an issue for the criminal court (for the crime of stealing the water) and an AP for making the debt for the stolen water non-dischargeable.) Going forward, your client must be treated by the utility as anyone else coming out of BK. I would contact the public service commissioner - I'm sure the utility cannot do anything without due process.

                    As for the stolen water, the utility would need to get a tort judgement in regular court via proof of a preponderance of the evidence that he stole the water (I suppose the utility could do that during the BK AP.) The utility could also press criminal charges, but I would tend to think that it would be hard to get proof beyond a reasonable doubt to get that.

                    Comment

                      #11
                      Originally posted by JackBondLove View Post
                      The utility could also press criminal charges, but I would tend to think that it would be hard to get proof beyond a reasonable doubt to get that.
                      Actually its not hard to prove at all; every utility company logs (usually via digital scan hooked up to main computer system) each time they must go out to a residence. Most water meters are digital, and a shut off code is usually issued and annotated.

                      Trust me - if they've shut off the water several times, and this person simply turned it back on, resulting in water co. removing the valve - they dont need any further proof. And... to lie when this person's attorney knows full well that the water was accessed illegally, well.... dunno about ya'll but when I raise my hand and say "yep, whole truth, so help me God"... that means not lying.

                      Comment

                        #12
                        Dont know where in PA you are; however here is an entire reg that cites PA law. While it may not be in your location, it does give specifics.

                        http://gvma.pa.us/GVMARulesandRegulations.pdf


                        Also look up Water and Sewer Tap-in Fees (Act 112 of 2000)

                        The question is was it mandated? My guess is yes it was..

                        Comment

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