Why does everyone say NOT to file Pro Se?

[Wantmypeace]

I'm curious why everyone seems so against filing Pro Se, yet when I go to the Pro Se forum, I see that a lot of people are doing it successfully. Is there something I'm missing?

[free2breathe]

I honestly think it depends on the individual, a case by case basis. If we had a bunch of unusual circumstances, we probably wouldn't have chosen to file Pro Se. Ours is pretty cut and dried. We have income far below our state's median, and we have debt that far outweighs our assets, so for me it just made sense not to shell out $1500 to an attorney to do it. That being said, it's not easy. I have major anxiety over it, but so far it seems to be fine. I'll find out more in three weeks when we meet the trustee.

[AngelinaCat]

If we had found this site in 2006 when we first started realizing that we had no other choice but to declare BK, we would have educated ourselves and filed pro se ourselves. Instead, we found an attorney on the Internet, and hired her on the spot.

After the initial meetings, which went well, communication and education of us died hard. As a result, we made many mistakes both before and during the process that should not have happened. Had we found this site, things would have been far different.

But had that happened, we might not now be sticking around here to share our experiences.

[DaddyDavid]

Because they have 2000$ to waste, I suppose.

If you are going to file BK, you are responsible to see it through. Even if you pay a lawyer, you'll see how maany times people are screwed by them, etc. You must be sure you know what you are doing, and basically rely on the lawyer for bits of information only. If you are going to file, and have time, and critical thinking ability, and are organized, if you stay in here long enough you'll be more of a BK expert than MANY of the lawyers out there that are simply processing their clients through a paperwork mill. And save yourself a few thousand dollars, also.

[lrprn]

Looking for a good bk lawyer is like finding a good doctor. There are a few bad apples in the mix, mostly ok ones, and a few really excellent ones. Not all lawyers are crooks just like not all doctors are quacks.

It's up to you to figure out several things about whether you can file a Ch 7 pro se or need to file with an attorney (filing Ch 13 pro se....we'll discuss that later):

1. How simple is your case? If you have a straightforward, no-strings-attached case with no complicated assets, no preferential payments, etc., then that increases your chances of filing Ch 7 pro se successfully.

2. Are you personally willing to do the intense homework and study necessary to understand how to file Ch 7 on your own and not make mistakes and wrong assumptions that can create a financial disaster for yourself? (We've had members crawl in here after filing a pro se case in terrible shape when things went horribly wrong.)

3. Take a hard look at why you want to file pro se. Almost 100% of the time, the filer thinks they can't afford a bk lawyer. Often after taking a hard look at their finances and taking some good advice here, most filers can afford a lawyer. It just requires a good budget, stopping paying all unsecureds, making tough decisions about assets, and sacrifices.

Now about filing a Ch 13 on your own....less than 5% of pro se Ch 13s filed actually make it to confirmation. That alone should tell you how difficult it is. The Ch 13 part of the bk law is full of contradictions, case law decisions are different in different parts of the country, and Ch 13 trustee and local court practices differ widely across the country. It's a minefield and it's terribly easy to get yourself blown up trying to file one on your own without a lawyer. Is it possible to file a pro se Ch 13 and succeed? Yes. The odds of successfully doing it? About the same as a meteor hitting your house today .

We have had two members here who filed their own Ch 13s successfully pro se. Look up JustBroke's early posts and threads to see how it's done when you are intimately familiar with the bk law and with the oddities of Ch 13 law. But JB is one in a million.

This is why so many of us recommend at least speaking to 3-4 bk lawyers by setting up free or low cost consultations before deciding whether you will file pro se or with a lawyer. You'll find out what problems may exist in your case if you file, and can also discuss ways to set up payments if your case isn't one that should be filed on your own.

Don't let the bad lawyer stories here make you fearful of interviewing a few or make you think that all lawyers are bad - they aren't. BK Forum attracts a lot more people who are having lawyer problems than those who have a smooth filing with a competent, even excellent lawyer. Those smooth, uncomplicated filings don't need a bunch of strangers on the internet to help them figure out what to do when their filing ends up a mess. the picture you may get here is somewhat skewed to the 'bad lawyer' side. It's key to keep things in perspective.

[Flamingo]

It takes time and research to file pro se, especially if the BK is complicated and not cut and dry. If one is working full time or has a family to support/take care of and can spend lots and lots of time researching, reading, making phone calls, hoping the information they have is correct, meet deadlines and is highly/completely organized as to paperwork, financial information, legal documents, court proceedings, etc., etc., they might have a chance to pull it off. I have been in the legal world most of my career and would never have attempted to even try to pull off filing our Chapter 13. Our attorney absolutely earned his fee and went over and above the call of duty for us. Many times posters come in here wishing they did not attempt to file pro se and several times I have told them that now you know why the attorney's charge so much. It's a lot of work, research, time, reading and if employed, one has their hands full.

It's a personal decision and all situations are different, especially as to finances. I myself personally would never consider it after going through our Chapter 13 and working full time with a family.

[keepinitreal]

Originally I thought I would file bankruptcy and my spouse would not have to. It would have been a simple Chapter 7.

Once I read the NOLO Chapter 7 book and was on this site for a while, I committed to hiring a bankruptcy attorney because I realized my spouse and I would have to file jointly and it would be more complicated.

[Pandora]

For us - it was just easier to hire a lawyer, especially filing a 13 with an AP to strip the 2nd. No way I would do that on my own! Even if it were a 7 - I'd still leave it to the professionals as I'm under too much stress as it is. Let the lawyer handle it, I'll sit back for the ride

[ssmdem]

With as much research as I have done in this process, I think I could successfully file pro se, but I'm a worrier by nature, and I want my safety net to fall back into. My attorney works part time as a trustee herself and has come highly recommended by friends who used her. There have been several things along the way that I have questioned, and her response has been, 'Um, yeh, that might work, but I can't guarantee they won't have an objection." So, she's helping me get set up for a quick and painless discharge so that I don't lose my mind. I like that she's looking at it from the other side of the table in helping me to get prepared. She has mentioned several times that I'm doing everything right and should be no problems, so I think I COULD do it by myself if it came down to it, but I'm hiring her for my peace of mind.

Not to mention, I have LOVED going from my phone ringing off the hook daily from creditors calling to NADA, not one phone call in over 30 days!! It's been heavenly!!

[ccsjoe]

We thought after researching that we would file pro se and save the $$$$ from attorney's fees. However, after realizing we were not exactly a simple case, we thought spending a couple grand to shave off much more than that was worth it once we found the right attorney. Piece of mind outweighed chunk of wallet.

[missjean]

Hubby and I filed pro se because our case was very simple. We knew that it would be a Chapter 7, and with all of the information available online (including this forum, of course!) I did not find it difficult at all. If, however, our case had been complicated we would have, at the very least, tried to get representation from a Legal Aid attorney. Everyone's situation is different, and some individuals are not comfortable with all of the forms and research that has to be done. Thankfully, I had no problems, and things went fine.

[Wantmypeace]

Wow! Thanks for all of your experience with this. This really makes me think twice. I'm just not sure what to do, and I will have to make a decision soon...lots to think about!

[mommi2many]

We decided to file pro se chapter 7 because we are an easy case. We don't own anything and we were way under the median. Also, I'm unemployed right now so that gave me more time for research and filling out the paperwork. We contemplated hiring an attorney, but after researching bankruptcy, I felt I could do it and save the money for much needed things. We are still in the process and I am very nervous about everything, but then that's just how I'm wired. When I come on here and read through the forum everyday, it helps to alleviate some of the stress. Personally, I think everyone must look at their own situation and make the best decision for them.