30 day extension, and stressing!

[magoo]

Filed bk7 on 10/14/05 (old law), and had 341 on 11/23/05. Things were going smooth, no-asset and property abandoned, and last date for objection was on 1/23/06.

Well, on 1/18, just a few days before I was in the clear, the U.S. Trustee wants more info, and filed for a 30 day extension. They asked for a ton of info, bank statements since 10/1, proof of unsecured creditors, paystubs for Dec. and Jan., 2004 tax returns, property tax and all insurance info, child support order, 401-k loan documentation, AND documentation to back up the Schedule J monthly expenses! For this, I used my MSMoney program, and broke it down into each category listed for each month from the first of Jan. to the end of Sept., and averaged it out matching what was on the paperwork. This included the date, payee, check number where applicable, the account it was paid from, and the amount. I'm REALLY hoping that they'll just take a glance over this and see that it's pretty organized, and call it good. It's all pretty legit, there's just some cash receipts I didn't keep in my shoebox after I entered them into the program.

Ended up being 171 pages to send to them! Got that into my attorney last Monday (1/30), who was going to send it off right away. Now, I'm just waiting, and keep checking pacer for any changes. I didn't see any objections from creditors, just from the trustee. It's gonna be a long wait until Feb. 23, I'm really hoping they're busy enough to just push me on through, and get this sucker closed. Wish me luck!

[LostinMi]

There wasn't any mention of any of this at your 341 meeting. Or any hint/clue that the trustee would be looking into your case further?

[bkfiler]

that sucks! i wish you luck!

any ideas why they are asking you for this?

if you want, lets talk about your expenses.

what was your disposable income?

what categories might the trustee object to in your mind?

any expenses changed when your attonrey created the peition?

if you want, lets talk about cash advances:

when was your last cash advance? how much?

any gambling show on your form?

if you want, lets talk about your income:

how much do you make compared to how much did you file bk on for total debt that you want discharged?

[magoo]

[QUOTE=bkfiler]that sucks! i wish you luck!

any ideas why they are asking you for this?

Maybe due to income level?

Note: all based on family of 3. Now it's about 3 1/2, step-daughter lives here while not active on National Guard duty.

if you want, lets talk about your expenses.

what was your disposable income?

$85/month

what categories might the trustee object to in your mind?

Medical @ $485. 17 y.o.Step-son with long term epilepsy, wife with chronic pain and depression, denied disability so far.

Telephone @ $133. Have cell phones, can't get land-line due to disconnection (bill included in bk). Have to have cell phones to always be in reach due to son's seizures)

Food @ $700 (?).

Child support @ $425. Natural daughter, living with her mom, 19 1/2 y.o., attending college. Will be paying for probably another 1 1/2 years. Have no "official" court order for this, just the divorce decree from 1990, stating $200/month. Have worked with the ex-wife through the years about increases, without going through the courts.

any expenses changed when your attonrey created the peition?

Step-Daughter being here most of the time now raised almost everything up just a little.

if you want, lets talk about cash advances:

when was your last cash advance? how much?

Cashed in 1 week vacation at end of this year for $836.

any gambling show on your form?

None.

if you want, lets talk about your income:

how much do you make compared to how much did you file bk on for total debt that you want discharged?

Yearly income (including $8544 child support) = $77,500 (pre-tax)
State median = $54,633 for 3, $61,209 for 4

Non-secured to discharge = $55,120

Secured (not including mortgage) = $3200 (property tax, was $1100 when filed)

Most debts are from 4 to 5 years ago. Wife and I were separated for about a year. Step-d had suicide attemp, then drug addiction. About $20,000 is medical for this, and rehabs that did no good. Also, many items stolen from the house, and we were some of the first victims of identity theft, before anyone knew what to do. Just gotta love it when the credit places send you those blank checks to your mailbox, for anyone to use. Also, credit card debt going from $1500 to over $5000 with all the interest and fees. Been honestly trying to catch-up, but everytime I get 1 thing paid, 2 more come in.

Also, had to check the wife into rehab this past June for prescription problems. Had to withdraw $3000 from 401-k for down payment for that. It was a life or death matter at the time.

To a CPA, it might look like we could repay, on paper. We have 2 cars, both from 1988, and each over 150,00 miles, that won't last much longer. At our 341, the trustee just shook her head, gave us her sincere condolences, and wished us the best of luck in the future. We're just looking for a fresh start, which is the intention of the bk law. We could probably win our case at a hearing, but it sure rips open a lot of old wounds. I sure hope that this will end soon, with what we just sent in.

[bkfiler]

well havnt reviewed it al yet but right off the bat if you are making so much then it means there are a lot of expenese to be looked at. also with a disposable income of +$85 then all he has to do is get $15 out of you and its the start of a possible chapter 13.

why did you attorny let you file with $85 positive. bad idea in this case.

start looking for expenses you missed just in case you need to change things later. even though that will cause you to loose credibility wuth the court. but there is nothing you can do but fight if you have too.

[bkfiler]

when was your last cash advance? how much?
Cashed in 1 week vacation at end of this year for $836.

cash avances on credit cards im talking about.

[StaciMM]

My guess is that the undocumented child support will be the biggest issue, as you're claiming $225 more than 'required' by the divorce order. The medical, I'm sure you can back up with proof. You might have a hard time claiming extra expenses for the Step-D, especially if she only recently moved in. Plus it sounds like she is old enough to help support herself.

[magoo]

No, hadn't even used any credit card for anything for over 90 days before filing. Just kept making minimum payments until the day I filed. So, there shouldn't be any abuse or preferences there.

It seems that $50 to $100 is pretty customary around here, and what he usually tries to go with, and not had problems. He seems pretty confident about it, so I'm hoping he's right. He's been specializing in BK's in this area for over 20 years, and has a great reputation. Hopefully, a mix of the old law/new law isn't going to screw him up on this one.

In the meantime, I will keep looking for more. Hopefully, there's enough now in the priority claims with the property taxes that it won't go any further than having to pay that off.

[magoo]

My guess is that the undocumented child support will be the biggest issue, as you're claiming $225 more than 'required' by the divorce order.

Yes, this one's not real good. I did write quite a narrative with all the details. Listed the dates of the increases, and the reasons why, such a me getting a raise, and bumping it up $100 for tuition. Included a printout of supports checks written over the last 3 years, and a copy of the last 5 cancelled checks. I even have every cancelled check I've written for support since 2000, if they want to see them. I was quite the pack-rat with this!

ALSO, I sent a copy of a completed state form for the calculation of child support, using our current figures. It shows that I "should" be paying about $192/month MORE than I'm currently paying. If need be, I'll get the court order to raise it, and put the money to better use. (I hope I don't sound "cheap", or that I've been depriving my daughter of what she deserves. The ex's current husband does well, and we've made up for it through plane trips and clothes shopping, etc., through the years!)

You might have a hard time claiming extra expenses for the Step-D, especially if she only recently moved in. Plus it sounds like she is old enough to help support herself.

Yup, I'm not really banking on that one too much, either.

[magoo]

You know, our original trustee was REALLY swamped cases during those couple of months when we filed. They were hearing cases every 5 minutes, all day long in 5 different rooms, for weeks on end. I'm wondering if it's just the U.S. Trustree being aware of this, and doing a quick double-check on all the lower trustees cases? Not sure if there's any way of finding that out?

[bkfiler]

just a side not: anyone reading this should make damn sure you never ever have positive disposable income. period.

and this thread is a case in point. all the trustee has to do is challange any $20 expense amount and you could be in a chapter 13 paying for 3 years.

[StaciMM]

I think it is pretty standard for the US Trustee to review all higher than average income filers. The US Trustee's mission is different from the one you met at your 341. That one wants your stuff, as he gets a commission on it. The US Trustee wants to convert you to a 13. (The local trustee doesnt' benefit if you end up in a 13, as he gets no stuff then!)

[StaciMM]

Bkfiler-my guess is the US Trustee would have gotten involved anyhow, just based on the income amount.

[bkfiler]

not true. if he filed with over -200 in expenses then no one would have touched him. would have took too much to figure stuff out.

[edwards2]

Okay LostinMI...in answer to your question about a hint of trouble at the 341...definitely not always the case because it happened to us too. We thought we were home free because the trustee seemed to accept what we told her and submitted...little did we know...

magoo..been right where you are. The trustee did the same thing to us and in fact we do share some similiarities...our income was even higher than yours so I am sure our case was "set aside" for that reason to begin with too BUT the fact is the trustee was challenging our Chapter 7 because of an expense not because of our income. She demanded the same documentation you are being asked to produce and in fact we had 2 pages of requests from her. She literally wanted everything but our blood type. Our case ended up in a 2004 Exam with she and our attorney which we subsequently won. As long as you are upfront and submit what the trustee wants you have literally done everything you can do to get your case discharged. Believe me I know it is hard not to freak out..people on this forum and others can tell you I was a total wreck when we got the letter ONE day before discharge and on a Saturday no less. But we did win and you will too...I know it means waiting a little longer but it will be worth it...good luck..keep us posted!