Dating someone new: At what point do I confess about my financial mess?

[bluemartini]

Easy answer: Tell them right away.

.

Thanks for your input, Lajazz, because I value everyone's advice.

But I just think it is kind of weird to tell a perfect stranger about my personal finances.

I mean stop and think of it this way. Let's say you are at a party. You meet someone new and interesting. You're chit-chatting and getting to know each other: Where do you live, what do you do for a living, how's the weather? Let's go have another cup of punch. Oh yeah, and by the way I need to let you know I'm in foreclosure?

See what I mean?


I agree with most of what you said though.

[Widdle]

LOL... very funny!

Maybe though when they said "can't stand someone who is financially irresponsible" they were talking about something different, maybe some personal experience where they had been burned. For example maybe they used to have an ex who ran up the credit cards shopping at the mall.

In fact on my list of "can't stand's," I had chosen "cheap and tight-fisted to the point of being impractical." Because one of my pet peeves is when people leave cheap tips for the waiter in a restaurant, for example. But I ended up going back and removing it because I thought that from a guy's perspective, maybe it would seem like I was saying: "I can't stand someone who is cheap because I want to be taken on lavish, extravagant, expensive dates" (which is SO not the case with me)....

It's so easy to read things into a dating profile that someone may never have intended.

But anyway....

On the other hand, you could use your situation to your advantage. Think of it as a lost little puppy.

In your emails, I would gingerly mention my situation in a "woe is me" kind of tactic.

I remember telling my boss my personal financial difficulties (single mom, barely making the rent, loads of credit card debt) that I was going to have to file BK. We would talk for hours about what to do and managing my money, etc. We became very good friends. He was so sweet and supportive.

Well, lo and behold, he came to me and told me he had a plan. That we could start a new life together and he would take care of me and my child and I would never have to worry about things again.

Would have been a great idea had he not been "married".

[JustFileSuit]

what do you do for a living,

Just to show you how much of this is local-culture, it it considered very gauche to ask someone in Europe, when you first meet socially, what they do for a living! Here, we seem to go into a "default" mode and do ask because we have nothing else to talk about (?). Europeans do not define themselves by their work. Americans apparently do. Which is surprising considering how many career changes we go through.

Incidentally, little-known detail, that "E-harmony" website BlueMartini is at, is apparently run by a group of quite conservative evangelicals. Explains the emphasis on certain questions.

Remember, women, if you are out looking for a new man, you have to go where the guys are! So pick up a Saturday crew job on a sport-fishing boat!
The other thing to remember is that guys like to feel "useful" to their women. I suspect that goes back to the cave-man days, in taking care of the family. No need to fight it. Let that new guy volunteer to take care of swapping out your car battery or the tires. That's "guy stuff." Guys like to do things for their women; it validates their maleness. Enjoy!

[OhioFiler]

But when they sent me their list of "must have's" and "can't stand's" (part of the e-harmony process).... both of them said:
* they can't stand someone who is financially irresponsible
*they must have someone who knows how to manage their finances responsibly.

May I translate this for you?

"If you don't have enough money to take care of both of us then I'm not the guy for you."



How do they know they can't stand someone who is financially irresponsible? What if you gave them EVERYTHING they needed or wanted except you liked to shop too much. Would that mean they couldn't stand you? I call BS and the question sucks anyway.

Why is managing your finances a "must have"? Wouldn't this egotist already know how to manage money? Why would he need you to be a financial wizard if he already has the tools? Or is he saying he doesn't know how to manage finances and needs YOU to manage his for him?

I'd avoid any moron who chooses either the "can't stand" or "must have" listed above if I were doing the internet dating thing.

The easiest way to avoid having to disclose your current financial situation and any perceived shame is to date someone you meet here on BKforum!

[JustFileSuit]

[QUOTE=OhioFiler;360715]

"If you don't have enough money to take care of both of us then I'm not the guy for you."

Several years after The Day, my bride confessed to me that she and her long-time girlfriend both decided that the time had come for them to find hubbys, and they went "shopping" for men. She made "the List," which I never knew about, and it was eight pages long. The "candidate" had to meet every single criterion. Conspicuously absent from the list were: race, whether or not divorced, previous children, and how much dough you made. All the stuff that E-harmony gets so uptight about. The relatives all figured she would never marry. She held fast until age 38! We met in the Grand Ballroom of the Plaza Hotel in NYC, at the Russian Nobility Ball; took one look at me and decided I was her man! And yup, I met every single one of the criteria on those eight pages. Amazing. (Just as well about the "dough" part; I've made and lost millions. Oh, well; it's only money.) PS her girlfriend shopped for and found her man too. Still together 20 years later.

[OhioFiler]

Several years after The Day, my bride confessed to me that she and her long-time girlfriend both decided that the time had come for them to find hubbys, and they went "shopping" for men. She made "the List," which I never knew about, and it was eight pages long. The "candidate" had to meet every single criterion. Conspicuously absent from the list were: race, whether or not divorced, previous children, and how much dough you made. All the stuff that E-harmony gets so uptight about. The relatives all figured she would never marry. She held fast until age 38! We met in the Grand Ballroom of the Plaza Hotel in NYC, at the Russian Nobility Ball; took one look at me and decided I was her man! And yup, I met every single one of the criteria on those eight pages. Amazing. (Just as well about the "dough" part; I've made and lost millions. Oh, well; it's only money.) PS her girlfriend shopped for and found her man too. Still together 20 years later.

Do tell! What was on the list?!

[lindsay2181]

I think people should just be upfront and honest with one another, period, but especially when they are aware that a certain issue would affect the other person's decision whether to get involved in a relationship. However, I don't really think online dating is a great idea anyway; how many of these people signed up and told the whole truth about themselves on their profile? Lots of people use less recent pics, fudge about small details...you may be keeping your financial problems a secret from them, they may be keeping who-know-what kind of secrets from you!

Myself, if I were single and looking to date, would be honest about my financial problems, and explain HOW I came to be in the situation, regardless of whether it was due to my own lack of responsibility or just bad luck, which is what you described you've had. I don't see the need to string someone along and let them fall for you, only to disclose pertinant info at a later point. I say, lay it all out on the table from the beginning. I mean, not the VERY first date....but I would not take things too far without letting them know. Just suppose someone fell in love with you, and then felt they had to overlook this issue that would have sent them running in the opposite direction a few months earlier...and now they may become sucked into your problems, be affected by your credit score if you were to get married, etc. and feel resentful about it, resulting in problems with the relationship, which could have all been avoided by simply being honest in the beginning.

That said, I found out AFTER getting married that my husband had a less-than-stellar credit report. When we were dating, he seemed financially "okay" from what I could tell, his parents looked/acted well-off, and I didn't think there would be any issues. I was honest with him about my own money troubles, I was working a dead end job and barely making ends meet. I did not expect him to take care of me financially, nor did I expect to have to take care of him financially. He did not use credit cards and I wrongly assumed that he never had. I figured he had no credit, which was better than bad credit right? A few months into our marriage we applied for a joint loan and were turned down because of his negative credit. Only then did he confide to me that his ex-wife had ruined his credit by racking up cc bills in his name during their separation. I was more than upset that I was only just now finding out this information. I was already married (and pregnant!) and this info COULD have affected my decision regarding the relationship. Was I going to divorce him b/c of it now that we already were married, and had a child on the way? No. But it would have been nice to have known beforehand. Sure, maybe it was my responsibility to seek out that info instead of assuming things were "ok," but really? Do most women run a background check on their boyfriends? I think rather than me having to seek out that info, he should have provided it. Would have been the nice thing to do, dontcha think?

Also, when dating and having separate accounts, I did not notice anything out of the ordinary on his part. He spent his money on what he wanted/needed and I did the same. After combining accounts I was flabbergasted at the overdraft fees we were getting. I realized how irresponsible he was and had to take away his debit card. And now having to give him an allowance and school him on basic subtraction. (Not comparing you to him, just giving my own personal experience and backing up my reasons why I advised to be honest from the get-go.)

Good luck in the dating pool, I know it's not easy!

[bluemartini]

I think it may be easier for you to find a trusting guy who would ignore your financial background, than for me to find a woman who would ignore mine. Sorry if that sounds sexist everyone.

I don't think it is sexist at all. I think, sadly, it is true. If it makes you feel any better, I would be perfectly willing to date and marry someone who were in your financial situation. It's really more about chemistry and character compatibility, IMO.

May I translate this for you?

"If you don't have enough money to take care of both of us then I'm not the guy for you."



How do they know they can't stand someone who is financially irresponsible? What if you gave them EVERYTHING they needed or wanted except you liked to shop too much. Would that mean they couldn't stand you? I call BS and the question sucks anyway.
Why is managing your finances a "must have"? Wouldn't this egotist already know how to manage money? Why would he need you to be a financial wizard if he already has the tools? Or is he saying he doesn't know how to manage finances and needs YOU to manage his for him?
I'd avoid any moron who chooses either the "can't stand" or "must have" listed above if I were doing the internet dating thing.

Now, those are some d@mned good points, OhioFiler.

I honestly had not considered it from that point of view. When I read your comment, it's kind of throwing a whole new light on this for me.

Interesting. Verrrry interesting. Hm.

[TroubleinCalif]

Easy answer: Tell them right away.

There is a real difference between financial irresponsibility and bad luck.

I know people who have had both happen to them.

The key is, have you learned from your mistake or misfortune?

If you have then that is a tremendous quality to have and one that I would certainloy view as a plus in a companion.

Amen!

First off, Everybody pumps themselves up on those sites! Trying to make themselves appear better and more attractive, because lets face it, your trying to sell yourself on those sites.


I as you went the dating sites route and after responding to and talking to people, I found a girl whom i never mentioned my BK in my profile. I listed divorce, ect.... Had to paint a good picture not a bad one? We finally after emails, then progressing to phone conversations, we go on a date and we hit it off great! This was almost 1 and 1/2 years ago. Our 2nd date was lunch on a Sunday afternoon at a park, laying on a blanket ect.. You get the picture. Weather was beautiful, It was a great day. During that date we talked about a lot of things. I decided then to be completely up front on my financial situation. I was not going to let it go any further because, if you do, the damage will be done and there's no going back and your % of failure will be higher. We talked about my divorce, she talked about her's. I told her about how my situation had put me in the position i was in financially with the divorce and everything associated with it and how i was moving forward with life. Best thing i ever did! She completely understood. Long story short, 10/10/2010 we are getting married. She knew up front my credit was crap, but is OK with it because she knows the situation and that i am responsible person who had a run of bad luck and things will get better in my financial dept down the road. I guess my point is, Some things are better left UN-said until the right time presents itself, I.E. second date or when you have had some decent conversations with them? The person whom you finally hook up with, needs to accept you for who you are and everything that comes along with you, including your baggage. Everybody has some baggage. If they say they don't, there lying..... Get your foot in the door! Then proceed with caution...

Good Luck,
I'm betting on you to win!

[bluemartini]

Wow, that is a really touching story, TroubleinCali.

Congrats to both of you.

And thanks for this....

Good Luck,
I'm betting on you to win!

.... You are giving me hope!

[DiamondsR]

Tell them IMMEDIATELY. When you are talking to them, even include it in the free text portion of your profiles.
I met someone on eScarmony and MatCh (the same guy on both websites). We were going out for six months. Two days before my health scare, he asked me to marry him and I told him that I had financial problems and was thinking about declaring bankruptcy. That ring went back in the box faster than you can say "Chapter 7". He went into a he could "never be with a woman who declared bankruptcy since that is a character flaw" speech.
I wish I would have told him back when we were just talking on the phone that I had financial problems (although he knew I was unemployed so I don't know how he thought I'd be a 750 FICO person with no income, two kids and no child support). I get angry when I think of all of the time, energy and emotion I wasted on him just to be cut off when the word "bankruptcy" came up. We seemed so well suited for one another except for that comment (and the fact he said he hated special needs people and my son is special needs. Oh and that he looked NOTHING like his photograph whereas I did. He was at least 100 lbs heavier and I was willing to overlook that but he couldn't get over the bad credit. He still calls me to go out, though, but says he could never marry me but would live with me. Sorry, just because I declared bankruptcy doesn't mean I'm a consolation prize).
(Try to meet people in the real world anyway. Those dating site people always know there are "20 more waiting in the wings" if you don't work out. I met my ex husband years ago on Compuserve and that turned out really badly because I filled in the blanks with what I wanted, as opposed to the reality of who he was).
Don't waste your time getting attached or meeting someone to think they are great only to be confronted with a "see ya" when you tell them about your financial past.

[Flowers]

wow, this thread has really raised some emotions on the topic of the dates themselves and the Internet sites.

I can not imagine one would tell all immediately. Just like sexual history or family responsibilities, you've got to get to know one another. You will know the right time to tell.

I think the best advice here is, get to know one another, you are more than just your BK right?

[OhioFiler]

Tell them IMMEDIATELY. When you are talking to them, even include it in the free text portion of your profiles.
I met someone on eScarmony and MatCh (the same guy on both websites). We were going out for six months. Two days before my health scare, he asked me to marry him and I told him that I had financial problems and was thinking about declaring bankruptcy. That ring went back in the box faster than you can say "Chapter 7". He went into a he could "never be with a woman who declared bankruptcy since that is a character flaw" speech.
I wish I would have told him back when we were just talking on the phone that I had financial problems (although he knew I was unemployed so I don't know how he thought I'd be a 750 FICO person with no income, two kids and no child support). I get angry when I think of all of the time, energy and emotion I wasted on him just to be cut off when the word "bankruptcy" came up. We seemed so well suited for one another except for that comment (and the fact he said he hated special needs people and my son is special needs. Oh and that he looked NOTHING like his photograph whereas I did. He was at least 100 lbs heavier and I was willing to overlook that but he couldn't get over the bad credit. He still calls me to go out, though, but says he could never marry me but would live with me. Sorry, just because I declared bankruptcy doesn't mean I'm a consolation prize).
(Try to meet people in the real world anyway. Those dating site people always know there are "20 more waiting in the wings" if you don't work out. I met my ex husband years ago on Compuserve and that turned out really badly because I filled in the blanks with what I wanted, as opposed to the reality of who he was).
Don't waste your time getting attached or meeting someone to think they are great only to be confronted with a "see ya" when you tell them about your financial past.

No offense intended, but your decision to overlook these issues was what caused you the "wasted" 6 months. You should have run the moment you realized he was an internet fraud.

This clown called off an engagement because you weren't able to finance his future. You should have offered him a golden shower on your way out the door.

[DiamondsR]

No offense intended, but your decision to overlook these issues was what caused you the "wasted" 6 months. You should have run the moment you realized he was an internet fraud.

This clown called off an engagement because you weren't able to finance his future. You should have offered him a golden shower on your way out the door.

No offense taken. Aside from realizing the magnitude of my financial problems, my bankruptcy has made me take a good look at my life and I was completely responsible for the wasted 6 months. You know you're right (but at the time I felt like I was willing to overlook his issues because no one is perfect and yet he couldn't overlook my bk). I told him that while he was putting the ring back that he was a piece of work (and then some).

Considering his girth, that would have needed to be a golden tsunami (don't mean to offend anyone who is overweight. In fact, I don't have a problem with that but I do have a problem with someone lying and getting to know you and putting up a ten year old photo of themselves 100 lbs lighter and thinking I'm going to meet Johnny Depp and meeting them and having to overlook that I'm out on a date with Colonel Sanders).

[bluemartini]

That ring went back in the box faster than you can say "Chapter 7".

Wow. That is scary!

That is actually my worst fear.

(sigh) ... What a mess.