secured vs unsecured

[klandsb]

Maybe when u went in front of the judge it was your 341 meeting and u just weren't aware that what was taking place ...Just a thought

[joek]

if so, there wasnt any creditors there, just other people filing

[joek]

and there wasnt a creditor there, only a judge. Isn't the creditor at the meeting of creditors, if so, this must not have been that meeting

[justbroke]

No, creditors are not required and more often than not, do not show up at the meeting.... which bears their name! (The 341a Meeting of the Creditors.)

Also, Judges are not allowed to attend or preside over a 341 meeting. The Trustee or his/her designate runs the meeting.

[joek]

that tells me i wasnt at a 341 meeting then, I attended only one meeting where a judges ask some questions. Any ideas about why the "chapter 13 plan" mailed to me by the trustee only had the IRS on it and didnt list any other creditors? Why was there a 341 meeting if neither me or any creditors were there?

[justbroke]

that tells me i wasnt at a 341 meeting then, I attended only one meeting where a judges ask some questions.

Judge doesn't usually ask questions of Chapter 13 debtors, as Chapter 13 debtors who filed with an attorney almost never (98% of the time) need to see the judge for ocnfirmation. Just because this meeting was in the courthouse -- which most 341 Meetings are -- doesn't mean it was in a court room (although it may look like a court room).

Any ideas about why the "chapter 13 plan" mailed to me by the trustee only had the IRS on it and didn't list any other creditors? Why was there a 341 meeting if neither me or any creditors were there?

I don't think you "didn't" attend a 341 Meeting. The 341 Meeting is the only appearance the majority of debtors ever attend. A 341 meeting is absolutely mandatory and is, really, the only event you go to at the courthouse. No 341 Meeting... no case.

If the "judge" asked you any of these questions... it wasn't the Judge. it was the U.S. Trustee, the Standing Trustee, or someone from their office:

1. State your name and current address for the record.
2. Please provide your picture ID and Social Security number card for review.
3. Did you sign the petition, schedules, statements, and related documents and is the signature your own? Did you read the petition, schedules, statements, and related documents before you signed them?

If the questions were like that, you absolutely were in a 341 Meeting.

[joek]

almost postive it wasnt the trustee, the trustee is female and my judge is male. Attourney said it was the judge. Any ideas why there wasnt allowed or for that matter not disallowed creditors listed on my ch 13 that was mailed ot me

[justbroke]

almost postive it wasnt the trustee, the trustee is female and my judge is male. Attourney said it was the judge. Any ideas why there wasnt allowed or for that matter not disallowed creditors listed on my ch 13 that was mailed ot me

The Trustee himself/herself usually doesn't attend or actually run the Meeting of Creditors. My Trustee is female, and one of her male attorneys ran the meeting. She was not there.

Anyhow, the only way to tell what claims are allowed, is to check your Claims Register on PACER (or CM/ECF). Also, your lawyer should have been keeping track of any claims that were filed. Your claims bar date may not yet have passed. Your lawyer should have updated you on any claims that came in, and worked with you to insure that they were accurate and/or legitimate..

[joek]

thanks for being patient with me in trhe questions lol. When looking at pacer, what exactly do i need to look at to deteremine these creditors? i have looked over it and cant find "allowed" unsecured creditors, can you guide me thru it some, which topic to exacltly look under?

[justbroke]

thanks for being patient with me in trhe questions lol. When looking at pacer, what exactly do i need to look at to deteremine these creditors? i have looked over it and cant find "allowed" unsecured creditors, can you guide me thru it some, which topic to exacltly look under?

You access the "Claims Register" link once you pull up your case. Then run the report for all dates (take the default). This will list all the claims filed in your case.

Now, as to whether they are "allowed" or not... that would have been your attorney and you sitting down and reviewing them to make sure they were accurate and legitimate. If you found discrepancies, you and your attorney would work on an Objection to Claim and file that with the Court.

[joek]

what is cm/ecf on pacer

[justbroke]

what is cm/ecf on pacer

CM/ECF is PACER. PACER is CM/ECF. (The lawyers use the ECF -- electronic case file -- part of the system for uploading papers filed with the court.)

Just think of it as one system. We citizens use PACER... the lawyers and Court use CM/ECF. Its' the same system.

[joek]

ok i think you have clarified everything for me, the IRS will be paid off in january. Leaving 14 months on my 60 month plan. Originally it was going to take 60 months just to pay the IRS off. Since adjusted by the IRS, they will paid off early. I assume the remaining 16 will be used to pay unsecured creditors at the same rate of payment?

[justbroke]

ok i think you have clarified everything for me, the IRS will be paid off in january. Leaving 14 months on my 60 month plan. Originally it was going to take 60 months just to pay the IRS off. Since adjusted by the IRS, they will paid off early. I assume the remaining 16 will be used to pay unsecured creditors at the same rate of payment?

If there are other unsecured creditors... of which the IRS actually is one of those... they'll get paid a pro rata share of whatever you pay as your disposable monthly income... over the next 14 months.

[joek]

i pay $400 a month, IRS will be paid out in january. Trustee will divide the other 16 months of payments up between unsecured creditors? As of last month only payments were sent to the IRS from the trustee