Christianity and Bankruptcy

[Shaoline]

Being a christian myself about to file bankruptcy I was curious to see if there was any forums or support, so I did a google search and read some comments on other sites. For the most part other christians seem extremely uncaring and harsh. I don't think that is a true picture of Christ.

There is this stereotype by those who have not faced extreme financial hard times, that the people who file for bankruptcy are dead beats!! In my case and I'm sure in a majority of cases this is not true!

Mine started with my husband's illness that put him in the hospital for an extended amount of time, I quit my job to care for him (an early retirement). I had $200,000 in the bank and rental income from the properties that I owned, so I wasn't worried, but through a string of unforseen and unfortunate circumstances, my income started becoming less then my out go. Tenants not paying rent, abandoning properties, and trashed one property so bad it took $15,000 to repair. Nasty ice storm created severe damages to my home as well as some of my other properties that required thousands of dollars worth of repairs. At the same time 2 of my California mortgages went up $1000 a piece!!! Market went down couldn't sell the homes to cover the payout. I used my credit cards to make my mortgage payments to do all i could to save my properties. I have been struggling to keep my properties afloat for over a year and half to avoid bankruptcy. I used up all my savings and 401K hoping that all this misfortune would turn around.

yes, I was talking to the mortgage lenders constantly try to work out a deal to get my payments down. They wouldn't budge they wanted my properties. Several suspended my accounts and wouldn't take my payments (I was making particle payments). One lender went as far as telling me that if they accepted my payments they couldn't foreclose on me, I was stunned. All the talk in the media about how lender don't want your home, not true, most would rather take your home. An attorney in an unguarded moment admitted to me that the lenders would rather have my properties then work with me.


I have always lived below my means, I don't own a big screen TV or anything like that, I put my investment into my properties so I would have an income when I retired. I was financially supporting and caring for my husband and paying his bills as well as my own for over 3 1/2 years -we have been married for 4.

I've definately have been having my JOB(Job of the bible) year this past 12 months or so. Now at 49 years old I am having to start all over again, when I should be drinking pina coladas on a beach in Fuji.

I'm not embarrassed, sometimes sad yes, but I've lived enough to know life happens. So, for people to be publicly unkind and uncaring and try to write legistration to prevent decent people from having a chance at not being a prisoner of debt is to me immoral. I'm very grateful to have good health and knowledge and experience. I'm confidence that I will be richer then before. Each down cycle I've gone through in my life I have learned from and climbed out of the situation wiser, stronger and more prosperous then before. This time is not exception.

For most people bankruptcy is the last hope. I'm grateful to God and our christian based government for a way out. It is the self rightous that can make life so hard for others. Jesus said he came to set the captives free. I accept that freedom.

I want anyone reading this to know not all christians are cold hearted and mean, there are many of us who have great compassion because we have been through hard times and can empathize with your pain. I think if I were an attorney I would be a bankruptcy attorney and I would fight against those creditors that are lobbying very hard to take rights away from the common US citizen. Creditors are not the innocent victims that some would have you believe. The amount of interest that they can legally charge is criminal. For those that feel quilty - STOP. Don't feel quilty, that is just the social stigma talking, you have to do what is in your best interest and what is best for your family. I should have filed 6 months ago when I saw the writing on the wall.

To all who suffer, be well and be strong, learn and grow. Cry as much, and as often as you have to, but when your done saddle up and keep riding.

[Flamingo]

Bankruptcy does not discriminate. You can be any religion, any profession, any race and be faced with bankruptcy. I was born and raised a Roman Catholic and when faced with my husband's job loss from which we could not recover, I contacted our parish priest advising him we were having financial difficulties and could not contribute weekly to the church for a while. He was completely understanding and told us not to worry and when times were better we could contribute again. In the paper a few weeks later, it was found that the Diocese was embezzled out of more than a million dollars in the course of a year by one of their accountants and he tried to get away with it by destroying evidence. The only thing that caught it was an audit - my husband said if they could miss a million dollars out of their budget in less than a year's time, our Diocese has one hell of a lot of money. One person filing bankruptcy does not hurt your religion at all. We were always taught that God helps those who help themselves. You do what you gotta do and not worry about anyone else because believe me, they take care of themselves.

[HHM]

Bankruptcy is actually rooted in the old testament. In the Torah (sp?), there is a law for forgiving debt every 6 years.

[AngelinaCatHub]

Welcome Shaoline: You will not see people here criticizing you. We are all here for the same reasons. If not help then to help. I am sure there are many other Faiths here, but that does not matter. It rains on the just as well as unjust. From my short experience, I see very little 'hanky-panky' about abusing the system to unfairly harm creditors for gain. Most everyone here has their own story, but it boils down to the same; circumstances beyond our control have given us a challenge we have to overcome. It is an Ill wind that blows no good. If nothing else, we have learned as well as aided others. Thank you for your nice introduction and history. It shows others there are worse situations or better situation but to each individual, their situation is still very painful. What we do now, we are compelled by circumstance to do. It is strictly business, and no one should look down on another for handling business. The Christian saying about not judging a person until you walk a mile in their shoes (forgive accuracy) is very true. 'Hub

[Bandit]

Being a christian myself about to file bankruptcy I was curious to see if there was any forums or support, so I did a google search and read some comments on other sites. For the most part other christians seem extremely uncaring and harsh. I don't think that is a true picture of Christ.

There is this stereotype by those who have not faced extreme financial hard times, that the people who file for bankruptcy are dead beats!! In my case and I'm sure in a majority of cases this is not true!

I am not a Christian & as an outsider looking in, I would agree that most of them are mean, judgmental & have obviously not read their own bible concerning BK.
Of the Christians (or any religion for that matter) the people here are not critical or judgmental to the individual concerning bankruptcy & they will get banned real fast if they are. Except for the occasional gambler who throws 200 thousand dollars of borrowed money on the craps table in one night then, asking for what went wrong & wants to file BK the next day (they can get beat up here but in a nice way). They are also allowed a second chance.

I want anyone reading this to know not all christians are cold hearted and mean,

We know.
The reason for being here seems to be overrided by something greater than religion, experience, family, politics,.. Whatever went wrong in each persons shipwreck was not a choice & is completely out of their hands.

Welcome to Gilligans Island!

Each down cycle I've gone through in my life I have learned from and climbed out of the situation wiser, stronger and more prosperous then before. This time is not exception.

Sounds like you are already salvaging the wreckage.

[AngelinaCatHub]

Good post Bandit

[MomIcantFindmy]

The forgiveness of debt is rooted in the old testament. The cancellation of debt in the Old Testament was accomplished at legislated intervals. Deuteronomy 15:1 clearly provides for such legislative release with the following language: “At the end of every seven years you shall grant a release. And this is the manner of the release: every creditor shall release what he has lent to his neighbor, his brother, because the Lord’s release has been proclaimed”. The debtor's payment or non-payment of debts was not in question, and liability didn't matter at all—it was a strict statement without any wiggle room, much like the clear statement in Deuteronomy 5:17 that "Thou shall not kill.."

More reading of the Old Testament includes harsh words towards creditors and high interest rates. As well as creditors who lend money to the poor with high interest (predatory lending). The Biblical use of the term “usury” corresponds to our modern word "interest" rather than to the notion of “excessive interest” to which we generally apply the term usury today. Both Ezekiel 22:12 and Nehemiah 5:0-11 condemn lending money with interest, especially to the poor. And Ezekiel 18:13 list the taking of interest among sins worthy of death.

I have a friend who, while not critical, was concerned about Christianity and bankruptcy. Once I pointed it out to her she understood and has not made a peep. Best wishes to you Shaoline and may you find comfort around friends on this forum.

[AngelinaCatHub]

I think also in the New Testiment, Jesus went into the Temple and tore up the "money changers". I believe "money changers" were about like our "payday loan" companies. Or currency converters with a profit in the conversion. Correct me if I'm wrong. 'Hub

[Cali]

I was taught that as well and I agree with you.

We were always taught that God helps those who help themselves. You do what you gotta do and not worry about anyone else because believe me, they take care of themselves.

[stressin]

There is this stereotype by those who have not faced extreme financial hard times, that the people who file for bankruptcy are dead beats!! In my case and I'm sure in a majority of cases this is not true!

I am Christian, as well, and I did google to see what the Christian perspective was--on bankruptcy--before I decided to file. It does seem that there is a negative bias towards Christians who opt for bankruptcy.

For myself, I know that after God, my next priorities are my husband and my children. I believe, after examining all of the options--and there aren't many--that filing for an individual bankruptcy following the failure of my small business is the best thing for me to do for my family as well as myself.

I look at what the financial stress and pressures does to my marriage and family, and I know that God doesn't want me to stay stuck in this rut--letting it affect my health, my marriage and my family.

People who judge need to remember that each of us has to make this decision for ourselves. I applaud those who are able to chip away at their debt and eventually pay it off--but when faced with lawsuits, etc.--I feel that the best course of action, for myself--is to file.

I just try to remember who my loyalty is to--and who I answer to for the decisions that I make in my life. Those meanies--the ones who judge--aren't who I answer to.

[justplaintired]

I love that you quoted scripture. I am a Christian and although I know some "so called" Christians who would judge us for our BK, I didn't let them stop us from doing what we had to do. Also I know judging people is not our job but Gods.

I find it very interesting in the scriptures it says basically high interest rates is a sin punishable by death. Would that mean that those that run the cc companies will be punished on judgement day, the way some judge us for filing BK?

Either way, we are Christians who have been victimized by cc companies, we are way below median income, we fell into their trap and we are climbing out now and I firmly believe God loves us and understands. Those "Christians" who would judge us, they are the sinners in my opinion and not doing what God would ask and that is not to judge people and to love each other.

Welcome to this forum and you will find good people here who will not judge you for ending up in financial hardships, and if predictions are true, then some of these Christians who are judging us will end up here someday soon. And I personally will welcome them, because then they too will understand how good Christians end up with money troubles.

[Greenie]

My accountant is a devout Christian and I was nervous about telling him that I'd filed, but I had to so he'd know the whole story when he did my taxes. He was incredibly kind and understanding. It sparked a whole discussion about saving money and cutting costs and left me feeling very positive about the future. Instead of the guilt-trip I was expecting, I got support and constructive advice when I needed it most.

[BigJohn]

The foregiveness of debts was rooted in the the Old Testament by the name of Jubilee. Every 7 years the land would be laid barren and certain property rights were restored. After 7 jubilees (7 X 7years = 49years), there was a golden jubilee (50th year). During the Golden Jubilee, all property rights were restored. This included land and if a person had sold himself into slavery, he became a freeman.

[Help!]

I think BK can be one of those life-shaping experiences that makes a person a better Christian than they ever would have been without having gone through it. I will never judge another person the way I did before, assuming that the reason they are homeless is because of choices they made (like abusing alcohol and drugs). Seeing how quickly life can change because of the inability to find a job, health problems, circumstances beyond a person's control, I have a real sense of compassion that I didn't have before.

I also feel like our priorities are finally straight... having a nice car and a nice home - DEAD LAST! And finally, I witnessed unmistakable divine intervention when our case was not dismissed! I felt that truly was a miracle, and discharge would be another.

[Tom_Mi]

My accountant is a devout Christian and I was nervous about telling him that I'd filed, but I had to so he'd know the whole story when he did my taxes. He was incredibly kind and understanding. It sparked a whole discussion about saving money and cutting costs and left me feeling very positive about the future. Instead of the guilt-trip I was expecting, I got support and constructive advice when I needed it most.

I'm in the same boat as you.

My wife and I have to pick a chapter (7 or 13) this week and we're meeting with a similar accountant tomorrow from our church. Even though I've not had any real ability to stop our real estate business failure, I'm afraid this accountant is going to browbeat me. It's disappointing to have to think this way, but I've already got a non-christian accountant picked out if this guy won't give me pragmatic financial advice.