Gambling debts, little income, no assets

[scaredgambler54]

I don't know what to do. I've hit rock bottom, have no access to credit, but continue to make my min. payments.

quick stats:
approx ~120,000 in cc debt (personal)
approx ~10,000 cc debt (biz - sole prop)
owe approx ~30,000 to casinos (NJ - which are checks), to be cashed in 30 days.
last balance transfer was a week ago, to get some cash, which i havve, in attempt to pay off the casinos (worried most about them).

Now, I don't want to file for bk. Why? Jail. All of my cc apps I have used household income meaning I considered my parents part of my household even if i applied for cc's at a diff address in a diff state. I don't know their true income, but had a ball park figure.

On apps that asked for my income i stated hhi as well, even for just me. I have also had phone calls with various creditors when attempting to get higher credit lines and was not truthful about my occupation and income.

I have a serious gambling problem, and want to quit. I have not been to a casino in a few weeks, but I have to go to pay back the markers soon because I don't know what will happen.

Lastly, I am a college student, aged 23, with a part time internship, but I dont make nearly enough to pay just the min. amount, although I have enough cash right now to pay the mins, maybe for a few more months.

This is blanant fraud. I didn't purposely do this, it just went really downhill this summer and fall. In fact a year ago I had 6 figures (all from gambling winnings) and now im 6 figures in debt.

Jail is all but certain if I file for Bk, right? Do I have any options?

[rrockinggramma]

make an appointment with an attorney and lay all of your cards out on the table and then go from there. But if you file BK and are honest about it all, I don't think jail is in your future (IMO). Many people lie on those credit applications. I am not sure what the casino's will do however. You need to get to an attorney quick. And then to gambler's AA

[ssdsco]

When did you complete the credit apps and have you made at least minimum payments since then ?

My quess is you'll be advised to wait several years to file BK. If so you'll need to understand how the collection process including legal action and garnishment will impact you. Probably not a big deal if you have no assets.

In the mean time focus on the gambling problem. There's other folks on the forum that got into trouble via gambling and I'm sure they’ll jump in.

[woeisme]

I don't think the credit cards are going to get you sent to jail, but those 30K worth of checks coming due next month might. Writing a check when you don't have the money in your account to cover it is a crime, and the bank might prosecute. (I know of 2 different people who did jail time for kiting checks.) That seems like your bigger worry at the moment. Try to make good on those before worrying about minimums on your credit cards. (Unless they are credit card checks, not checks from your bank account?)

You can't be sent to jail just for being bankrupt. And I've never heard of anyone getting sent to jail for fraud for lying on a credit application. I suppose your creditors could try to get someone to prosecute you for that, but I really doubt it, and they really should have been verifying your income anyhow, isn't that why they ask for employer's name and number and such? So it really seems to me that the checks are the thing to try to set right, if at all possible.

I wouldn't even worry about filing for BK at this point. Until you get your gambling addiction under control, getting free of this debt is just going to provide you with the opportunity to run up more gambling debts, which you won't be able to discharge since you can't file BK more than 1 time every 10 years. If you make virtually no money from an internship, you can get sued and at worst they will garnish a little bit of your wages, but they can only take 25% max, and if your income is very low, even less than that in most cases. Probably less than the minimum payments you are making now.

I know this may be hard to do, but focus on the disease (gambling) for a while, as opposed to the symptoms (debts). You have to deal with the disease first, or anything you do about the symptoms won't matter, because the symptoms will just come back. Good luck!

[stljohn]

hey woe you had my back on the other thread but i have to gently disagree that you cant go to jail for lying on a credit app. I don't mean to alarm our friend but it has happened.

i'm not saying authorities are looking for every schmuck that fudges a credit app or 2 but if there was some sort of pattern of ripping off creditors they make take a look.

i agree with the advice to find a good lawyer pronto and don't hold back. no more major purchases on the cards just minimal stuff.

and scared: woe gave good advice. relax my friend quit beating yourself up, forget about the debts you got bigger problems but there is a way out just get some help, get in a 12 step today.

good luck

[CindyLou]

It is VERY common that people lie on their income portion. Doesnt make it right, but its a fact. The fact is, many credit card companies do not even base their decision on you income, instead your credit score.

Plus when you file BK, I am not aware that any credit card company ever even checks your income to know the difference unless they were to go on pacer and look...and STILL then they can only look at the last 6 months which is totally irrelevant to the time frame in which you applied I have NEVER heard of a credit card company asking to verify the income of a debtor during the time of application after the fact. Not saying it hasn't happened...just saying I haven't heard.

Most of the times flat out fraud is considered using someone else's ss#, or identity at which point they would investigate.

You mentioned that your income was 6 figures at one time from gambling. Wouldn't that suffice for the info that you put down?

Filing for BK would usuaully produce a worse case scenario of certain debts being objected to by the creditor and not being dischargeable IF the creditor wins.

Now about the casino checks. Depends on your state. An attorney could help you with this also, but if you are proactive in dealing with it the better it will be.

Regardless of it all....I highly doubt you will end up in jail if you deal with it responsibly AND GET TREATMENT. I am a true believer that a gamling problem that has gotten you in this much trouble will not just be cured from a few GA meetings per week. You need to check into some more intenstive treatment options. GA is a great start and would be a wonderful resource to see where you need to go.

Don't just assume that because you aren't gambling that you are ok. you aren't gambling because you don't have money.

I am so happy you have joined the forum and look forward to seeing you here. Take a deep breath! It does get better.

My brother is an addict...drugs alchohol, and gambling. Got 4 DUI'd and a negelgent injury over the last 2 years. Has managed to get his life back in order. Just paid his 12th payment into his chpt. 13. Looking to purchase a house this coming summer.

You can do this!! Being scare out your brain won't get you anywhere. You are going to fine. You haven't killed anyone. You lied on a credit app. Wrong thing to do, but in the whole scheme of things, not that big of a deal. You wrote some bad checks....hmmm could be a big deal, but an attorney could work something out with the casino. In my brother's case in LA he had about 5000 worth of markers and the casino didn't do anything.

They are tyring to keep "political peace" in the community and don't want to bring light to the problems they are helping potentiate. They choose to not prosecute so as to bring "bad things" related to the casino to light. So I would guess they would be willing to work out some type of payment. Now, depending on your state, a counter check may be considered the same as a payday loan and be discargeable. That would be something to ask an attonrey.

Get out there and see three attorney's ASAP!!!! It think you will feel much better. One bit of advice. Go in matter of fact, honest, upfront, and your held held high. Do not go in scared or desperate. come back and let us know how it goes.

Cindy

[HHM]

1. You can't be sent to jail for lieing on your credit apps...the worst case scenario is that the debts you owe those creditors would not be discharged in your BK.

Also, Casino Markers cannot be discharged in BK (at least not in Nevada, I think some other districts do allow markers to be discharged).

[Flamingo]

I don't know what to do. I've hit rock bottom, have no access to credit, but continue to make my min. payments.

(Big snip of rest of posting)

After seeing the mother of a good friend of ours almost lose everything (house, life savings) at the casino and have to be taken in by her family and she STILL cries to go to the casino even though she has no money to play now, it's time to get your life in order and get priorities straight so you can get yourself out of this position or you could possibly end up like the aged mother of our friend. Most gamblers have an addiction; realize it now and get the help you need. If you cannot stop gambling on your own, you have an addiction. That said, may I add that on the Discovery Channel the other evening during the "How It's Made" program, they showed how slot machines are made. Briefly, when programmed, they are programmed to hit randomly during a certain timeframe but always to take in more than it gives out. The odds are against anyone who gambles as the house is always in favor. Look at the size and glitz of the casinos. Does the street where you live look like that? Keeping things like that in mind may help you as you get things in order. We (I) have never gambled but have seen what it can do to individuals and families and it is not pretty. Best of luck to you.

[woeisme]

Sorry, not being a gambler, I didn't know what a casino check was, thought you had written a check to the casino, don't know anything about "markers" or that kind of thing, so not sure how they are looked at.

I also didn't mean to imply that it was impossible to get prosecuted for lying on a credit application stjohn, just that I'd never heard of anyone who had been before, so it seemed like a fairly unlikely scenerio. I think credit card companies are much more likely to pursue debtors through civil litigations than criminal because they'd much rather have their $ than worry about dealing with prosecutors and sending you to jail (my husband's a corrections officer and of all the inmates he's seen over the years, the only ones that are there simply for racking up debt are those that owe child support.) Inmates in Ohio get a whopping $18 a month of "state pay" for working in the kitchen or laundry or whatever they're assigned while they're on the inside, so while in a few really egregious cases the cc companies might pursue criminal charges, they'd probably much rather garnish your wages.

Like I said, I don't know what to tell you to do about the casino markers, I would just let the credit card payments go until you have put enought time between the debts that you can try to file BK. They might call and harass you (change your number or turn off the ringer and let it go to voicemail) or even sue you, but if you have little wages to garnish, so what? The most they can get is 25% of your net pay, which is probably much less than what your minimum payments on that big of a debt would be. Time is your friend, as it will be harder and harder for them to verify that you fudged your numbers on the credit applications the more time that passes. Don't expect that you can dig yourself out of this problem quickly or painlessly, but don't dispair either, if you wait it out long enough then you will probably be able to file BK, just don't run up any more new debts in the meantime.

[NAL123]

All I have to think when I read this thread was Holy Shit. How does someone who a few years over legal age accumulate that much debt.

No one here has mentioned the credit card debt of 120K. I thought having $71,000 was bad but I have my own problems with Bipolar, Anxiety, ADHD but six figures plus adding a gambling problem to it.

But it isn't about addiction, will power, saying no etc.. Both gambling & shopping problems are compulsive behavior that is as much a disease as depression or cancer. Meds can really help especially mood stabilizer types like Abilify, Neurontin or Lamictal.

The OP also should know that this is going to damage his future for 10 years. It is very hard to get a job or even rent an apartment with 'imperfect credit'. Everyone expects that 700+ FICO score.

[Flamingo]

All I have to think when I read this thread was Holy Shit. How does someone who a few years over legal age accumulate that much debt.

No one here has mentioned the credit card debt of 120K. I thought having $71,000 was bad but I have my own problems with Bipolar, Anxiety, ADHD but six figures plus adding a gambling problem to it.

But it isn't about addiction, will power, saying no etc.. Both gambling & shopping problems are compulsive behavior that is as much a disease as depression or cancer. Meds can really help especially mood stabilizer types like Abilify, Neurontin or Lamictal.

The OP also should know that this is going to damage his future for 10 years. It is very hard to get a job or even rent an apartment with 'imperfect credit'. Everyone expects that 700+ FICO score.

The OP needs to also realize that addictive personalities and the disorders you mention above are genetic and may have to be dealt with over a lifetime. The only person that can help oneself is that oneself and get the appropriate help and treatment that is available. Unfortunately, sometimes it takes hitting rock bottom to do it.

[mesa777]

Dude... I have a major gambling problem myself.. owe $40K on cc's, $5K on a car and over $200K on my home... I am going to be filing BK here soon myself.. I would not worry about the money you owe first... you need to get MAJOR gambling addiction treatment!! CALL GA NOW!!!

[scaredgambler54]

Thank you, everyone, for the advice given. I have been so busy at work that I am exhausted. 10 and 11 hour days.

I'll post more about my situation this weekend.

Regards,

[NAL123]

I am sorry but I don't see how anyone can support the OP filing for Bankruptcy. If he or she is 'working 11-12' hours a day then he DOES have income and should try to work out payment arrangements with the creditors. Even making minimum payments and working more hours or getting a higher paying job now or in the future is better than trashing ones financial future for 7-10 years.

It is much different if you are unemployed, and you find that you can't get a job due to a myriad of factors that keep people in the USA long term unemployed -- Too Old, Too Ugly, Imperfect Credit, Bad at Interviewing, Spotty job history with less than favorable references.

And again, how does one who is college age get in six figures of credit card debt and even getting access to that much available credit.

And the gambling addiction must be brought under control. It is a sickness no different than Bipolar disorder and requires equivalent type psyc meds.

[HAP]

NAL123 - you keep saying a persons future is trashed for 7-10 years after filing bankruptcy. I've seen a lot of people on here say not always so.

What do you say to this link?

http://www.bkforum.com/showthread.php?t=62

I'm not saying this guy should or shouldn't but quit making it sound like your life is doomed for the next 10 years if this is a decision someone has to make.

But I do agree, this kid needs help as far as the gambling goes.