Questions reg: CC Balance Transfers BEFORE filing

[mesa777]

I need some MORE information here... I have obtained lots of good info from this site... I am GOING to file some sort of a CH 7 or 13 in the next several months.. I have made some LARGE balance transfers... one was at the end of Sept. 07 for $22,000 and one for on Dec. 17 for $5100.00.. I have a major gambling problem.. I never win, just lose.. I have all reciepts incase my attorney or BK Judge wants to review them... I have been making payments every month on the $22K balance and will do the same for awhile on the $5100 balance.

My intentions were to try and win money to help pay off some of the balances here... I am so lost with this nonsense. I have been going to therapy as well as GA meetings, guess they have not helped much here.... ):

If I try to avoid BK for another 6 months do you think I will be in store for a BK fight here with the CC companies? I understand that I took the cash advances however the CC companies were the ones that made it possible!

The recent $5100 balance transfer/cash advance was from a check that Discover Bank sent to me. I took them up on it and tried to win some money.. Of couse I lost, I always seem to lose!

I know that I will get better, I hope.. Dont know whats worse, gambling or crack cocaine... If someone can give me some advice please do so!!!!! Once I file for bankruptcy it will MAKE IT VERY HARD for me to gamble as I really dont make much money once my bills are paid every month... Credit cards have really ruined my life here, I will be MUCH MUCH better without them!!

Please help!

[krielly]

I understand that I took the cash advances however the CC companies were the ones that made it possible!

Sorry to be so frank, but two of the most important points in recovery are recognizing your powerlessness over your addiction, as well as "accountability". You seem to have a grasp of the former, but need a bit of help with the latter. The CC companies may have "made it possible", but no one forced you to take advantage of the offer, that was a choice you made.

That being said, it is what is is..........you can't "undo" what's been done. You can only move forward, so cut yourself a little slack. I hope that if you aren't feeling that your therapy or GA is helping you, you might consider why that is...........maybe think about finding another therapist? Sometimes it takes a bit to find the right one.

I know there are other gambling addicts who can chime in here and I'm sure offer some advice. In the meantime, have you consulted an attorney yet? He would be a good one to ask about the timelines between your last cash advances and your filing date.

I wish you the best of luck in the world of BK. I hope it provides you with the fresh start you need, and that most importantly you find the resources you need to help you in your recovery!!!!!

L

[HHM]

Review this FAQ

http://www.bkforum.com/showthread.php?t=20075

[CindyLou]

Hi Mesa,
Good to see you back, but sorry to see that you are still having the same issues. I will again urge you to seek intensive treatment for your addiction. Unless you treat the addiction, the a BK will be no good for you!

Once a BK if discharged you will VERY SOON have access to borrowing money again, but unfortunately at terrible terrible terms. You could get yourself in very deep trouble post BK because you will have not protection and your "golden ticket" as some refer to it here will be gone for years.

I am in the healthcare profession as well as have close family member that is a drug and gambling addict. You know sometimes inpatient treatment is needed. I see it everyday....

As often as you keep coming back and asking us the same questions (which is fine, we are all happy to help anytime) I will continue to urge you to seek more intensive treatment BEFORE YOU FILE!!!! Taking away your "drug of choice" for a little while will not treat the underlying addiction and 2 years from now you'll be in the same boat again.

I wish you luck and please keep us posted.

Very sincerely,
Cindy

[AboutToBK13]

I need some MORE information here... I have obtained lots of good info from this site... I am GOING to file some sort of a CH 7 or 13 in the next several months.. I have made some LARGE balance transfers... one was at the end of Sept. 07 for $22,000 and one for on Dec. 17 for $5100.00.. I have a major gambling problem.. I never win, just lose.. I have all reciepts incase my attorney or BK Judge wants to review them... I have been making payments every month on the $22K balance and will do the same for awhile on the $5100 balance.

My intentions were to try and win money to help pay off some of the balances here... I am so lost with this nonsense. I have been going to therapy as well as GA meetings, guess they have not helped much here.... ):

If I try to avoid BK for another 6 months do you think I will be in store for a BK fight here with the CC companies? I understand that I took the cash advances however the CC companies were the ones that made it possible!

The recent $5100 balance transfer/cash advance was from a check that Discover Bank sent to me. I took them up on it and tried to win some money.. Of couse I lost, I always seem to lose!

I know that I will get better, I hope.. Dont know whats worse, gambling or crack cocaine... If someone can give me some advice please do so!!!!! Once I file for bankruptcy it will MAKE IT VERY HARD for me to gamble as I really dont make much money once my bills are paid every month... Credit cards have really ruined my life here, I will be MUCH MUCH better without them!!

Please help!

While I am not a psychologist, I happen to be married to one that deals primarily with addictions. She has repeatedly told me that an addiction is an addiction. It does not matter whether your "drug of choice" is gambling or crack cocaine. The damage that is done to your life and those around you is the same.

Until you can get yourself "clean" and stay that way, your life is going to be out of control. Declaring BK at this point, I fear will only hurt you later when you start gambling again. Your $5100 loss on Dec. 17th only furthers my point.

If you are serious about staying "clean" and not gambling, set yourself a goal. No BK until you are 6 months/1 year "clean". What is the longest you have gone without gambling? Go past that before delcaring BK.

One more thing, DW also tells me that life especially for addicts is about the choices that are made. It is time for you to make some choices. Nobody can or will do it for you. I hope you get the treatment that you need.

Good luck.

P.S. This is just my 2 cents. Get treatment. Ask your GA group what they think. Did I mention get treatment?

[mesa777]

Thanks for all the input... To tell everyone the truth here, since I turned 18 yrs old I have only had about a one month max time away from gambling. I have gambled every single day since I was 18 y/o with the exception of the one month lapse. I tried very hard not to gamble again however went back to it and got myself in a much worse position. I have made lots of money gambling, thats probably why I starting doing it again, however I went on a horrible loosing streak and lost everything.

I am currently attending GA and bi-weekly meetings with a phsycologist...

I just need to stop, I have gotten so bad that I had to turn over all of my checks and ATM card to one of my parents. Also in the mail yesterday Discover sent me another set of checks for me to deposit!! SHAME on them, I will keep these for my attorney, I have asked them in the past to not mail these checks to me and their answer to me is always the same... "we cannot stop the mailing of these checks"...

[FreshLikeADaisy]

Yes they CAN stop the mailing of those checks; I've done it. Granted it was a few years ago (I lived in a crack house neighborhood and didn't want convenience checks sitting in my mailbox) but they CAN do it.

You have two choices that I can see: change the mailing address on the account to your attorney's office (if he will allow this) so that he gets the bills and the convenience checks, OR write them a cease and desist letter, sent certified return receipt requested, saying that if they send you any more convenience checks even though you have requested multiple times that they not do so, you will not be held responsible for their misuse. You could even have your attorney send them such a letter. And yes, the checks will stop.

[mesa777]

I was told by more than one bank, Discover and B of A that they cannot stop the mailing of these checks!! It is a joke and a hastle to have them STOP mailing this stuff to me. And they wonder why so many people in this county will be filing for bankruptcy protection in 2008!!!! Its misuse by everyone involved!

[FreshLikeADaisy]

See, Mesa, that's the difference between you and me. I don't easily settle for what I am told on the phone. I want it all in writing.

Because the way it works with banks and credit card companies is that "it's in the system that way." The "system" is god. If it's not readily changed by a call center employee or front line manager, then the answer by phone is always going to be no. They can't do it, so it's no across the board. Except that's not true, and I've been in IT enough years (including some banking stints) to know that *anything* in the system can be changed.

It's kinda like when your CC interest rate gets jacked up because you were late with the light bill and you call: "No, we can't change it even though you've paid perfectly for the last ten years, it's in the system that way." But ask to speak to their manager, and make it clear you will close the account immediately if that rate isn't dropped -- why should you keep that account when you can get a better rate elsewhere and transfer the balance? -- and oh! miraculous wonder! suddenly that rate changes immediately.

Mesa, I know your credit's in the can or you wouldn't be considering bankruptcy, but until you've gone past the first line representative, AND written a sturdy cease and desist letter, you really don't know that they can't stop mailing those checks. Trust me. They can. And if you want help writing that letter, let me know. Better yet, have your attorney do it: that's what you're paying him for.

And yes, it's a hassle. But getting the check, using it, and then not being able to pay it back is exponentially far more of a hassle than making a few calls and writing a letter or two. Even if you wrote the letter with a pencil between your toes and had to have someone else hold the phone for you, the longest it would all take is a day. But you've spent way more than a day in collections and worry, from what you've said. I guess it's just a choice you have to make, and taking the default (what you hear on the phone) is still making a choice. Good luck!

[mesa777]

UNREAL!!!! Went to the mail box this afternoon.. 12/27, guess what... more Discover Card Easy Checks in the mail!!!! Have gotten three sets of these in the last 4-7 days! UNREAL!!

[CATCHMEIFYOUCAN]

Mesa777

I need some MORE information here... I have obtained lots of good info from this site... I am GOING to file some sort of a CH 7 or 13 in the next several months.. I have made some LARGE balance transfers... one was at the end of Sept. 07 for $22,000 and one for on Dec. 17 for $5100.00.. I have a major gambling problem.. I never win, just lose.. I have all reciepts incase my attorney or BK Judge wants to review them... I have been making payments every month on the $22K balance and will do the same for awhile on the $5100 balance.

Catchmeifyoucan here, just wanted to add my experience as I am a gambler myself. Most of my debt is due to gambling ($65,000), cash transfers, cash withdrawals etc. Holding 2 full time jobs just to keep my addiction. When I decided to file (Eastern District: State of Virginia) my lawyer said I could quit one job and go for a Ch7. I told him, I didn't want the risk of objections due to all the cash advances etc on most of my debt. If I go for a Ch13 whats the risk of objections? He replied, "there aren't any, your paying them back, there are no laws in Va about gambling," even if the creditor(s) were to file and objection, it wouldn't do them any good since you would be in a repayment plan. So I went for a 13. At the 341 meeting the only issue was an objection from the Trustee about the plan. Being negative with the Means Test, my lawyer proposed $250 a month. But my schedules I and J proved I could pay back $800. No mention about gambling whatsoever. No mention about the $10,000 I transferred in the month of March 06 to a pay off a cc. And blowing it back at the casino in the Month of April 06 on the recently paid off cc. I filed July 06. Do keep in mind I did keep up the minimum payments when I filed. But with the new credit card I had acquired and owing $10,000 I had only made one payment than nothing more the day I filed - not a peep from the credit union I got the card from. Come judgement day - because we had to let the BK Judge decide on the plan, my choice was to payback $800 for 5 years, or quit one job and convert to Ch7 and pay nothing! Well, you do the math. Again, I had another 341 meeting for Ch7. SMOOOOTH sailing, got all my paperwork back - stubs, tax forms etc. I couldn't tell you what will happen when you file, but it sounds like you've been keeping up the payments.
Doing just that could be the saving grace. Its not like you racked it all and just stopped paying them. Anyways GOOD LUCK when you do decide to file. And like they say on the forum, the longer you can distance yourself from using the cards and actual filing your chances increase of a succesful BK.

Catchmeifyoucan

[mesa777]

I just want this behind me and to tell you the truth I am getting really worn out by the gambling... yes it is fun to do however has really taken a toll on me here... I feel like I have aged 10 years by watching THOUSANDS of sporting events over the years.. It is WORSE than anything that I have ever done before.. I am just sick of it all and the ruin that I am now facing... I mean how many people go from 750+ FICO to a BK and lose it all???

Catchmeifyoucan.. you need to stop as well or you will be back on here in a few years talking about your NEXT case... This is sick and would LOVE to speak to an attorney about finding out how a law suit can be filed to STOP/BLOCK these god damn casinos from advertising to our kids, tv adds, billboards, ect... I know that it takes a chain of events to actually get to the casino and lose ones money however without the adds and such people would not be thinking about it all the time.. DOES ANYONE here know what sort of an attorney I could speak with regarding this sort of case? I mean they banned the cig companys and hard liquor companies from running tv adds... ITS ABOUT TIME THIS HAPPENS WITH ALL OF THESE STUPID ASS INDIAN AND NON INDIAN CASINOS!!!!

SICK AS HELL!!

[CindyLou]

UNREAL!!!! Went to the mail box this afternoon.. 12/27, guess what... more Discover Card Easy Checks in the mail!!!! Have gotten three sets of these in the last 4-7 days! UNREAL!!

Tear them up immediately so they can't be used in a moment of weakness!

[mesa777]

cindylynnsmith... I will probably take this with me to my bankruptcy trial, if there is one, so that I can pull these checks out and show the court how many items were sent to my home... I HAVE ASKED THESE COMPANIES to STOP mailing these checks and they DONT STOP!!! Well I guess when I FILE MY BANKRUPTCY CASE that will probably get them to stop!!!! I HATE CREDIT CARD COMPANIES and their TACTICS!!!!

[Hollyhomemaker]

I need some MORE information here... I have obtained lots of good info from this site... I am GOING to file some sort of a CH 7 or 13 in the next several months.. I have made some LARGE balance transfers... one was at the end of Sept. 07 for $22,000 and one for on Dec. 17 for $5100.00.. I have a major gambling problem.. I never win, just lose.. I have all reciepts incase my attorney or BK Judge wants to review them... I have been making payments every month on the $22K balance and will do the same for awhile on the $5100 balance.

Catchmeifyoucan here, just wanted to add my experience as I am a gambler myself. Most of my debt is due to gambling ($65,000), cash transfers, cash withdrawals etc. Holding 2 full time jobs just to keep my addiction. When I decided to file (Eastern District: State of Virginia) my lawyer said I could quit one job and go for a Ch7. I told him, I didn't want the risk of objections due to all the cash advances etc on most of my debt. If I go for a Ch13 whats the risk of objections? He replied, "there aren't any, your paying them back, there are no laws in Va about gambling," even if the creditor(s) were to file and objection, it wouldn't do them any good since you would be in a repayment plan. So I went for a 13. At the 341 meeting the only issue was an objection from the Trustee about the plan. Being negative with the Means Test, my lawyer proposed $250 a month. But my schedules I and J proved I could pay back $800. No mention about gambling whatsoever. No mention about the $10,000 I transferred in the month of March 06 to a pay off a cc. And blowing it back at the casino in the Month of April 06 on the recently paid off cc. I filed July 06. Do keep in mind I did keep up the minimum payments when I filed. But with the new credit card I had acquired and owing $10,000 I had only made one payment than nothing more the day I filed - not a peep from the credit union I got the card from. Come judgement day - because we had to let the BK Judge decide on the plan, my choice was to payback $800 for 5 years, or quit one job and convert to Ch7 and pay nothing! Well, you do the math. Again, I had another 341 meeting for Ch7. SMOOOOTH sailing, got all my paperwork back - stubs, tax forms etc. I couldn't tell you what will happen when you file, but it sounds like you've been keeping up the payments.
Doing just that could be the saving grace. Its not like you racked it all and just stopped paying them. Anyways GOOD LUCK when you do decide to file. And like they say on the forum, the longer you can distance yourself from using the cards and actual filing your chances increase of a succesful BK.

Catchmeifyoucan

CMIYC, would you please use a disclaimer as you post this same story over and over and over and over and over, that the reason you didn't get an objection to that creditor of your last cash advance was because your BK case fell thru the cracks of the system because you started as a CH13 and then slid into a 7 so it was likely the creditor missed the change of BK.

I think posting this story incessantly as you do to other people whether they be fellow addicts or just had recent cash advances is very misleading and does way more harm than good because it leaves the reader with a sense that hey, if this dude got away with doing a large cash advance right before filing, maybe I can too or I will be safe, and that is not true. It's truly offensive.