Proof Of Claim

[CATCHMEIFYOUCAN]

I have a quick dumb question, if a creditor doesn't file a Proof of Claim, does it mean that something else might be in the works vs. a creditor filing a proof of claim?

I also got carried away on pacer and ended printing out all the proof of claims filed by a handful of creditors and scanned through each one carefully, and noticed one of the creditors did not have a date of any cash advances I know I made (hmmm ... ).

Just one last little question, if an objection was filed (and still has a chance to be ..) by a creditor, would it be in plain site. Maybe I'm searching too hard, because I don't see any as of yet since I converted from Ch13 to Ch7 (thats a good thing - so far - I'm assuming ).

And the only objection I saw while I was in Ch13 was from the Trustee disputing my plan , maybe the creditors weren't given enough time for objecting since I was only in an "unconfirmed," plan for less than 3 months before I converted and at the same time I hear there really aren't any objections in one is in Ch13 since creditors are getting their money back (whether it would be a percentage or 100% ! )

I'm sorry and another curious inquiry: I have 2 unsecured cc's and an overdraft from the same creditor (chevy chase), they only filed a proof of claim on the overdraft, does that strike you odd?

Okay, this ended up being a long post, I'm sorry

Any input from similiar situations always helpful

Thanks in advance, Catchmeifyoucan

[HHM]

First, were the Proof of Claims filed for your chapter 13 or for your chapter 7.

Second, yes, any creditor objection would be in plain site. It would be quite obvious in the History section of Pacer.

[CATCHMEIFYOUCAN]

Proof of Claims

First, were the Proof of Claims filed for your chapter 13 or for your chapter 7

I believe for Chapter 13 as forms were stamped/signed in October, and I had Ch7 341 meeting Nov 9th

Catchmeifyoucan

[HHM]

First, were the Proof of Claims filed for your chapter 13 or for your chapter 7

I believe for Chapter 13 as forms were stamped/signed in October, and I had Ch7 341 meeting Nov 9th

Catchmeifyoucan

Ok, you're still a little early in the chapter 7 process for creditors to be filing objections. Most creditors will first try to offer a reaffirmation agreement to your attorney in lieu of filing an objection. So, one way or the other, you will typically know about any possible objections before they happen. Most creditors, if they file, tend to file in the second half of the 60 day period for objections, you are still in the first half of that time frame. Also, if you were totally upfront with your attorney and brought your suspected charges to his/her attention, he would be able to tell you how likely an objection would be.

I believe, Chapter 13 proof of claims are largely irrelevant to a chapter 7. I believe, once the Chapter 7 trustee designates your case an asset case, the creditors will have to refile their proof of claim (or at least up date it). A creditor is only allowed to file a proof of claim in a chapter 7 if the trustee asks for a proof of claim (i.e. by designating your case an asset case).

[CATCHMEIFYOUCAN]

Hhm

Ok, you're still a little early in the chapter 7 process for creditors to be filing objections. Most creditors will first try to offer a reaffirmation agreement to your attorney in lieu of filing an objection. So, one way or the other, you will typically know about any possible objections before they happen. Most creditors, if they file, tend to file in the second half of the 60 day period for objections, you are still in the first half of that time frame. Also, if you were totally upfront with your attorney and brought your suspected charges to his/her attention, he would be able to tell you how likely an objection would be.

DARN IT ! ! ! Let me ask you this, If there were no objections while I was under the Ch13, whats the chance there would be under the 7 now. Maybe the creditors didn't have enough time since I refiled for the 7 within 3 months of being in a Ch13 (actually 2 months even though I ended up paying the Trustee 3 months into of the plan).

I believe, Chapter 13 proof of claims are largely irrelevant to a chapter 7. I believe, once the Chapter 7 trustee designates your case an asset case, the creditors will have to refile their proof of claim (or at least up date it). A creditor is only allowed to file a proof of claim in a chapter 7 if the trustee asks for a proof of claim (i.e. by designating your case an asset case).

No Asset Case. I don't think it would make sense to ask for the creditors to file a proof of claim since it would be the same amount(s) (I guess from the Ch13).

But this is something I'm wondering about:

July 26th: I filed Ch13
August 29th: Ch13 341 meeting
Objection to confirmation (only from the Trustee)./
Oct 10th: Court w/judge to dispute Objection and confirm a plan.
Refiled for Ch7 before confirmation to plan late October.
Nov 9th: Another 341 meeting for Ch7, now 60 days to Discharge.

My last cash advance with one Creditor was May 20th, I know one should wait to file Bk (what, 90days???). When I add my original File Date from July 26th to be exact up to this date Nov 24th (it will have been close to 180 days since my last cash advance) Can they still try and "Get me," for that? Try to hold me liable still?

THANKS AGAIN ! Catchmeifyoucan

[lrprn]

My last cash advance with one Creditor was May 20th, I know one should wait to file Bk (what, 90days???). When I add my original File Date from July 26th to be exact up to this date Nov 24th (it will have been close to 180 days since my last cash advance) Can they still try and "Get me," for that? Try to hold me liable still?

If there's any suspicion of fraud, the local trustee can go back 1-2 years looking at your financial records and the US Trustee can go back even longer than that. Of course, if there's no suspicion of fraud, then you should be fine.

What did you use the cash advance for?

[CATCHMEIFYOUCAN]

Irpn

If there's any suspicion of fraud, the local trustee can go back 1-2 years looking at your financial records and the US Trustee can go back even longer than that. Of course, if there's no suspicion of fraud, then you should be fine.

Hmmm, I was thinking its been since end of July up until now, and I figured if they didn't find anything while I was in Ch13 and even had my previous (2 years worth) of tax returns (which were fully paid off - since I owed), what in the world would they find now? I even had high tax returns due to gambling and it was clearly stated on my Bk forms. So it's no surprise where my money goes to (cash advances - that is), I guess, just my two bit thoughts.

Whats the difference between a "local Trustee," and a "US Trustee," ???

What did you use the cash advance for?

Nothing to be proud of but since you asked: GAMBLING !

Catchmeifyoucan

[lrprn]

Whats the difference between a "local Trustee," and a "US Trustee," ???

States with higher numbers of filers are divided into two or more bankruptcy districts. States with lower numbers of filers have one state-wide district. There can be a few or many trustees in each district or state depending on the case volume. Most district-based or state-wide trustees specialize in either 7 or 13 cases.

The district/state trustees report to the US Trustee who is in the US Department of Justice. He's/She's the bankruptcy "buck stops here" person in the US. The US Trustee hires (and very infrequently disciplines or fires) the district/state trustees.

Check out the US Trustee Program's website at http://www.usdoj.gov/ust/ for the details of how all of this fits together. Hope this helps!

[HHM]

Whats the difference between a "local Trustee," and a "US Trustee," ???

To clarify the proper terminology you have the "Bankruptcy Trustee" and you have the "U.S. Trustee"

The Bankruptcy Trustee is the person who is assigned to administer your bankruptcy estate that is created when you file Bankruptcy. This is the person whom you meet with at the 341 meeting. There sole job is to determine if there are any non-exempt assets available which can be liquidated to pay something to the creditors. Within the bankruptcy system, the Bankruptcy trustee is the agent for your creditors.

The U.S. trustee has the responsibility of overseeing the BK system as a whole and because they are part of the Department of Justice, they prosecute bankruptcy fraud and abuse. However, they are neutral from the creditors and have no interest one way or the other regarding the creditors' interests.