In a 13...Just missed our 2nd pmt on house

[alorth]

OK...so we are trying to prepare for the possibility of being ordered to move to a house/residence with a lower payment as ours is $2410/month.....and our 13 TT is making noise about not confirming our plan unless we move to a cheaper place and pay the balance into the 13 Plan to unsecured creditors. They want us in a place at about $1500/month or less.

So we converted from a 7 to a 13 on Feb. 29th. At that time, we were up to date on our house pmt.....the next one was due on 3/7.

So we missed the 3/7 pmt and banked the money so that we could catch up in a second if we are allowed to stay in the house. Now we are approaching missing the 2nd pmt in a row. That money has also gone into the account where we are saving the house pmt money.

We are getting phone calls....which should be a violation of the BK Stay, but apparently Chase Mortgage does NOT know we are in BK, even though they have been notified several times. They just keep calling.

1. I'm wondering if we could get in trouble with the 13 TT for not paying our pmts. the last 2 months and stashing the funds.

2. We are doing this because IF we are ordered out, we would need the money to move, and for a security deposit and 1st month's rent on a new place....we would not have the money to do any of that if we were not currently stashing the mortgage pmt instead of paying on it. I am wondering if the 13 TT or Judge would listen to this reason, or if they just won't care, and possibly might dismiss our 13!

3. We have already applied and been turned down at one rental townhome property already because of being in BK. I am fearing that finding a place to live will not be easy at all. There isn't a lot to choose from here anyway. Its just another reason I feel we should be allowed to stay in our home.

4. It almost feels like I am playing a "game" of sorts....like the beat the clock. I am wondering which will come first....the foreclosure, OR trouble with the TT or Judge for not making the payments, OR us being told we can stay but it being too late and the bank won't let us catch up on payments and stay.

5. I hate not paying on the house, but I don't know how else we can prepare for th unknown of what we will be told to do to get our plan confirmed. I'm afraid that the TT or Judge will just order us out, EVEN IF THEY WERE GOING TO LET US STAY, because we haven't been staying up to date and on time, and have been stashing the money instead.

This all seems like a tricky situation. Any thoughts?

[DeadManCrawling]

I cannot answer most of this, but wanted to point out:

Each call from Chase is a violation. To the tune of $1,000. Your trustee will be interested in this, and likely pursue it. It benefits you, in many districts, by being applied to your overall plan. Document and if you can, in your state, record the call. Then hand it over to the trustee. Let them deal with it and you may receive some benefit down the road.

[shark66]

OK...so we are trying to prepare for the possibility of being ordered to move to a house/residence with a lower payment as ours is $2410/month.....and our 13 TT is making noise about not confirming our plan unless we move to a cheaper place and pay the balance into the 13 Plan to unsecured creditors. They want us in a place at about $1500/month or less.


This all seems like a tricky situation. Any thoughts?

Well, first of all, I'm still absolutely amazed by your story. I know what I'd be saying to trustee or judge that would make such a request to me...but to each his/hers own.

You do understand that no one can "order you out" short of having completed foreclosure proceedings, right?

One should pay whatever is owed on the mortgage, failure to do that could get you in trouble with trustee who doesn't seem to like you anyway...

As for Chase...you have an attorney representing you, correct? Have him/her perform the proper actions, up to and including filing a suit against these lowlifes...

Good luck to us all.

[spidge]

Will the mortgage company modify the loan.
At minimum will they modify for five years to get you through the BK then return to full payments that will likely be much higher than what you currently are supposed to pay?
If you are filling a 13 the arrears will be included in your 13 plan, but you are still over the mark, $1500, that they want you at and will have to pay the difference, $910 per month, in the plan to keep the house. This is where some 13 filers get into trouble. That is attempting to keep an asset that is to expensive.
I would think the trustee would look back and ask where the money for the mortgage payments went and likely demand you forfeit it. So give it to the trustee or the mortgage company? Your choice.
Have you asked your attorney for any reference to BK friendly rentals?

I know it goes without saying but focus on where you want to be after the 13. House poor, again? Use the 13 as a tool like all these major corporations do and fight through it to come out stellar. Nobody likes moving, but it is only a short part of your life and after your BK is over you can look more clearly at your financial future.

[keepsmiling]

[FONT="Comic Sans MS"]
Well, first of all, I'm still absolutely amazed by your story. I know what I'd be saying to trustee or judge that would make such a request to me...but to each his/hers own.

Aww c'mon shark, tell us!
This whole thing is as bizarre as the WA carve outs. Seems tt's are trying to make up lost wages any way they can.

[alorth]

Will the mortgage company modify the loan.
At minimum will they modify for five years to get you through the BK then return to full payments that will likely be much higher than what you currently are supposed to pay?
If you are filling a 13 the arrears will be included in your 13 plan, but you are still over the mark, $1500, that they want you at and will have to pay the difference, $910 per month, in the plan to keep the house. This is where some 13 filers get into trouble. That is attempting to keep an asset that is to expensive.
I would think the trustee would look back and ask where the money for the mortgage payments went and likely demand you forfeit it. So give it to the trustee or the mortgage company? Your choice.
Have you asked your attorney for any reference to BK friendly rentals?

I know it goes without saying but focus on where you want to be after the 13. House poor, again? Use the 13 as a tool like all these major corporations do and fight through it to come out stellar. Nobody likes moving, but it is only a short part of your life and after your BK is over you can look more clearly at your financial future.

Not house poor. Our housing is far less than 30% of our income. You should probably read some of my many other posts about my troubles, mostly in the 7 section, but also recently in the 13 section, to get filled in our total story.

The arrears did NOT occur until AFTER we had filed the 13, which is actually a conversion from a 7 in response to the UST's Motion to Dismiss. We have chosen not to pay on the house ONLY in prep for being told we either need to leave OR our plan won't be confirmed. We have the money to catch up immediately stashed in an acct, it didn't "GO" anywhere!! If we are told we can stay - or if the issue is "dropped" by the TT, then we will pay the money back to Chase immediately to catch us up to date.

On the other hand, IF they refuse to drop it and demand we leave, the money will be used to secure new housing, and for moving costs, etc.

The ONLY reason they want us to leave the house is NOT because we cannot afford it, BUT because they want to take SOME of the money going into the house payment and use it to pay unsecured creditors (and I would imagine also increase the percentage that the 13TT will get), and they might consider it vital to confirm the plan. They think our payment is too high for this county, and that we live in some kind of lap of luxury, which we do not, and I challenge them to visit and tell me it is.

We have NO 2nd or 3rd on our home, and never have.

And NO, Chase has no interest in talking to us about modification. We have already discussed this with them.

[keepsmiling]

Perhaps Chase will be more interested in modifying once you have withheld a few more payments. No bank mods/settles/whatever while you are a diligent payer. Do you have a high interest rate or did you just purchase at the height of the market?

Good luck as always and keep updating us on your trying situation.