Cease and Desist Letter To Creditors (Telephone Calls)

[CCM620]

Was wondering if it was a good idea to send letters to all my creditors requesting they stop calling me and family members about my debt under the Fair Debt Collections Act. The first card (of 7) has now filed for a judgement and I sent the law firm a letter telling them no more calls. I was thinking if I send it to the ones who haven't sued yet, whether this will make them more likely to get a judgement or if it has no effect. Also once the cc company sells the debt to someone else do you have to notify the new person too.

[GoingDown]

There is a lot of confusion about what causes a creditor or a junk debt buyer to sue someone. Some people think that a cease and desist letter causes them to sue faster. I really don't think it does.

The people who end up getting sued, were probably going to be sued no matter what.

The truth of the matter is no one really knows for sure what protocol each debt collector is going to use when they make a decision about whether or not to sue someone.

Look up "collection triggers" on Google and you will see some of the things they look for when they make a decision about what collection methods to use. Some accounts will sit on their back burner with them doing nothing until a collection trigger gets them interested in the account again.

If they can find your employer, and you live in a state which allows wage garnishment, I think you become a very likely target for a lawsuit, regardless of whether you send them a cease and desist letter. The same goes for assets, if they can easily find them, such as checking accounts appearing on your credit report and of course, if you own real estate they can find that through public records searches. Or if you have a mortgage they can see it on your credit report.

Personally speaking, I like the peace and quiet that I received from sending all of them cease and desist communications letters.

In most cases, I merely sent them by first class mail, sometimes by fax, and sometimes even by email, and in most cases, the phone calls ended after they received my letters. Sending by certified mail can get expensive, and I reserve that for ones which continue to call after I sent them one by some other method.

Keep in mind that the Fair Debt Collection Practices Act does not apply to Original Creditors, but I have found that it generally works on them as well because most of them will voluntarily follow the FDCPA and will honor your written request for them to stop calling you on the telephone. So, it is worth a try anyways.

Debt collection attorneys are subject to the FDCPA. They are seen as third party debt collectors, so definitely send one to them.

Yes, you do have to send each new collection agency a cease and desist letter. It is not unusual for creditors and junk debt buyers to bounce the account around to several different collection agencies, but eventually they seem to give up. Some sue at that point. But for me, most of them seemed to just give up and fall silent for years without suing me.

If you are judgment proof (now called "collection proof"), then I think it is good to add that to your cease and desist letter, to let them know that even if they do sue you, they won't get anything from you. I personally think it has helped to keep most of my creditors from suing me.


Here is a link to a letter you might find useful:

http://www.bkforum.com/showthread.php?74236-Cease-and-Desist-Communications-Letter-Judgment-Proof-Letter

And of course, read the stickies above for information about lawsuits, wage garnishment, and what may happen to your checking account after they get a judgment.

[bcohen]

Although I understand GoingDown's point, why risk it by sending a C & D letter on a debt that's still in SOL? If telephone calls are a problem, then either change your number to an unlisted number, use an answering machine to screen your calls, or send a letter stating that any telephone calls at any number are "inconvenient" and that all contact should be by postal mail. This verbiage is part of the FDCPA, so most collection agencies will honor such a request.

And telling the creditor that you are "collection proof" doesn't faze them. Most collection law firms and JDB's use a computer program which constantly monitors the credit reports of their debtors for "signs of life" that would suggest an improvement in circumstances and ability to pay, and when the program finds anything, then they sue. Therefore, as long as you avoid buying or titling any vehicles or real estate in your name, don't apply for any new credit, and don't apply for any jobs which run credit checks, the JDB may very well let you slip through the cracks. If you do get sued, then that's what bankruptcy is for.

[tobee43]

i also understand goingdown's point, and it is well taken. however, i must point one of thing here. the Fair Debt Collection Practices Act applies to anyone that breaks or violates their guidelines, whether it's the actual creditor or a third party.

in as much as the C & D letters, i thought i was so smart, sent them all out certified mail, it's costs us close to $70 dollars and didn't do a darn thing, as these people are allowed to attempt to collect their debt. so that was a big waste of time and money.

bcohen's idea sounds great to me LOL!! what we did, was left the state completely after over 30 years, got an unlisted number, never left a forwarding address and sat low for 2 years to be allowed to get this states wildcard exemption when we filed bk. i felt like we were underground and criminals....i am aware many can't do what we did.

here's the irony, this unlisted number we got....that person owed everyone and their mother and their mother's mother. so we got called day and night and they didn't believe we were not those people. i finally had to file complaints with the FTC and only then did the calls finally stop.

[treehugger1]

I always sent/send C&D letters. Out of 15+ national CC accounts only two creditors sued me. It has been over 4 years.

Here is the definition of debt collector from the FDCPA and the reference to debt collectors not calling you. Unless your state has separate laws that refer to original creditors, then the FDCPA only refers to debt collectors who are not (or operating under) original creditors. The FDCPA clearly defines creditor and debt collector as separate legal entities in the Act.

(4) The term "creditor" means any person who offers or extends credit creating a debt or to whom a debt is owed, but such term does not include any person to the extent that he receives an assignment or transfer of a debt in default solely for the purpose of facilitating collection of such debt for another.



(6) The term "debt collector" means any person who uses any instrumentality of interstate commerce or the mails in any business the principal purpose of which is the collection of any debts, or who regularly collects or attempts to collect, directly or indirectly, debts owed or due or asserted to be owed or due another. Notwithstanding the exclusion provided by clause (F) of the last sentence of this paragraph, the term includes any creditor who, in the process of collecting his own debts, uses any name other than his own which would indicate that a third person is collecting or attempting to collect such debts. For the purpose of section 808(6), such term also includes any person who uses any instrumentality of interstate commerce or the mails in any business the principal purpose of which is the enforcement of security interests. The term does not include --

(A) any officer or employee of a creditor while, in the name of the creditor, collecting debts for such creditor;

(B) any person while acting as a debt collector for another person, both of whom are related by common ownership or affiliated by corporate control, if the person acting as a debt collector does so only for persons to whom it is so related or affiliated and if the principal business of such person is not the collection of debts;

(C) any officer or employee of the United States or any State to the extent that collecting or attempting to collect any debt is in the performance of his official duties;

(D) any person while serving or attempting to serve legal process on any other person in connection with the judicial enforcement of any debt;

(E) any nonprofit organization which, at the request of consumers, performs bona fide consumer credit counseling and assists consumers in the liquidation of their debts by receiving payments from such consumers and distributing such amounts to creditors; and

(F) any person collecting or attempting to collect any debt owed or due or asserted to be owed or due another to the extent such activity (i) is incidental to a bona fide fiduciary obligation or a bona fide escrow arrangement; (ii) concerns a debt which was originated by such person; (iii) concerns a debt which was not in default at the time it was obtained by such person; or (iv) concerns a debt obtained by such person as a secured party in a commercial credit transaction involving the creditor.

(c) CEASING COMMUNICATION. If a consumer notifies a debt collector in writing that the consumer refuses to pay a debt or that the consumer wishes the debt collector to cease further communication with the consumer, the debt collector shall not communicate further with the consumer with respect to such debt, except --

(1) to advise the consumer that the debt collector's further efforts are being terminated;

(2) to notify the consumer that the debt collector or creditor may invoke specified remedies which are ordinarily invoked by such debt collector or creditor; or

(3) where applicable, to notify the consumer that the debt collector or creditor intends to invoke a specified remedy.

If such notice from the consumer is made by mail, notification shall be complete upon receipt.

[treehugger1]

Collection triggers are very real. Experian and others sell a product to JDB's creditor's, CA's etc that updates your "credit status" in the same manner they all sell "credit alerts" to consumers. I'm trying to determine how to see what one of these creditor/JDB/CA trigger updates looks like.

[tobee43]

the ftc is the enforcer for the act and it does cover many types of situations...here's just a bit but it's worth going to the site and reading up. also i have listed a site to a form where you can file a complaint, against anyone in violation. i know it worked for the creditors such as b of a, chase, discover card, citi bank etc.


"How the Credit Practices Rule Affects Consumer Contracts

What the Rule Requires

The Credit Practices Trade Regulation Rule has three major provisions. First, it prohibits creditors from using certain contract provisions that the Federal Trade Commission found to be unfair to consumers. The prohibited contract provisions are confessions of judgment, waivers of exemption, wage assignments, and security interests in household goods. Second, the Rule requires creditors to advise consumers who cosign obligations about their potential liability if the other person fails to pay. Third, the Rule prohibits late charges in some situations.

Who Must Comply

This Rule applies to all creditors subject to the jurisdiction of the Federal Trade Commission. It includes all finance companies, retailers (such as auto dealers and furniture and department stores), and credit unions that offer consumer credit contracts. Similar rules have been passed by the Federal Reserve Board and the Federal Home Loan Bank Board for banks, savings and loan associations, and other institutions under their jurisdiction.



The FTC works for the consumer to prevent fraudulent, deceptive, and unfair business practices in the marketplace and to provide information to help consumers spot, stop, and avoid them. To file a complaint or to get free information on consumer issues, visit ftc.gov or call toll-free, 1-877-FTC-HELP (1-877-382-4357); TTY: 1-866-653-4261. The FTC enters consumer complaints into the Consumer Sentinel Network, a secure online database and investigative tool used by hundreds of civil and criminal law enforcement agencies in the U.S. and abroad.






the act which is enforced by the FTC can be better understood here:

http://ftcsearch.ftc.gov/search?q=collection+calls&btnG=Search&output=xml_no_dtd&ie=UTF-8&client=ftc_consumer&proxystylesheet=ftc_consumer&filter=0

https://www.ftccomplaintassistant.gov/FTC_Wizard.aspx?lang=en

[GoingDown]

I always sent/send C&D letters. Out of 15+ national CC accounts only two creditors sued me. It has been over 4 years.

.

Exactly. The ones who sued were probably going to sue anyways, whether or not they got a cease and desist letter.

That's the way it was with me, too.

I hear of people puting up with getting 16 phone calls a day from debt collectors, getting called at work, or their relatives and neighbors getting called about their debts and I cringe.

They could stop it by just sending them a cease and desist letter. They are very effective at getting the phone calls to stop.

Changing the phone number is a good idea, but without a cease and desist letter, the debt collectors will keep calling around to relatives, neighbors, and even employers (or in my case, former employers) trying to locate you and talk to you. Eventually, someone will end up giving your new phone number to them, and the harassment will start all over again.

Google Voice works well to screen the calls, but in my opinion, it is better to use it as a back up. It is far better to get them to stop calling you all together. And that's what the cease and desist letter accomplishes.

And now, many debt collectors have their email addresses posted on their websites. Sending them an email is free, and usually works to get them to stop calling you. And it's fast. They get it immediately. Another option is sending them a fax. There are several free faxing services on the web, even if you don't have a fax machine or telephone line at home, you can still send them a fax, and it is a lot faster than sending it by mail.

[GoingDown]

COLOR]

Although I understand GoingDown's point, why risk it by sending a C & D letter on a debt that's still in SOL? If telephone calls are a problem, then either change your number to an unlisted number, use an answering machine to screen your calls,

This will get them to call relatives, neighbors, and employers looking for you.



or send a letter stating that any telephone calls at any number are "inconvenient" and that all contact should be by postal mail. This verbiage is part of the FDCPA, so most collection agencies will honor such a request.

From what I have read from monitoring debt collector oriented forums, this essentially has the same effect of a cease and desist letter. Most third party debt collectors will only send one letter. If you take away their ability to call you on the phone, you have essentially stopped all communication with them. Therefore, the result will be the same, either way. If they sue based upon ceasing communication with them, then they will sue based upon this as well.

And telling the creditor that you are "collection proof" doesn't faze them.



Telling them on the phone doesn't faze them. The people who talk to you on the phone couldn't care less and are in no position of authority to make any decision about whether to sue or not. Sending a letter with this information might make a difference because it reaches a completely different audience, who may or may not want to throw good money after bad on a lawsuit against someone who cannot pay them back. And the letter also lets them know a few key things that might make them lose interest in pursuing you... you know about your rights under the FDCPA, so you are not going to be easily scared into paying them like most debtors. It also tells them that getting too agressive with you may end up coming back to bite them in the a$$ because it could cost them money if they violate the FDCPA. And they know that you have just taken the most important weapon they have to use against you out of their arsenal-- phone calls. They collect most of their money through phone calls. They also know that even if they get a judgment against you, if you follow the right judgment proofing steps, they will probably never get a penny from you. So anyways, I think contrary to what most people think, the cease and desist letter and the judgment proof information may even make you less likely to get sued than people who do nothing.



Most collection law firms and JDB's use a computer program which constantly monitors the credit reports of their debtors for "signs of life" that would suggest an improvement in circumstances and ability to pay, and when the program finds anything, then they sue. Therefore, If you do get sued, then that's what bankruptcy is for.

Yes, the collection triggers are what most of the large debt collectors use to determine whether you are suit-worthy or not.

This pretty much sums up the judgment proof lifestyle: "as long as you avoid buying or titling any vehicles or real estate in your name, don't apply for any new credit [or checking accounts], and don't apply for any jobs [or apartments] which run credit checks, the JDB may very well let you slip through the cracks."