Sued by CITI - Right On Schedule

[GoingDown]

why would the credit card company pay tens times more than the consumer to arbitrate?
If it is true that Citi would pay more than $10k to recover $2k then what is the point of keep fighting? My balance according to Citi is $20k. The law firm they hired offered to settle at $10k which I don't have. I already paid $500 to retain a BK atty. So he is ready to file BK for me anytime but I just want avoid BK if it is possible because Citi is the only one suing me so far. My only income is workers comp payment which I understand in California is exempt from garnishment. My house is way underwater and I have a $175k homestead limit because I am disabled. I wonder if I can convince them to settle less like 20% of the balance instead of 50% they are offering now.

I would let the attorney suing you know this information-- that even if they do get a judgment against you, there is nothing to collect from, and that you will just file BK and make their judgment worthless. It might convince the lawyer to put you on the back burner. I would look up your county's property tax records and find out where the lawyer lives and send the letter directly to his house to get his attention. I have done similar things with a well known debt collection attorney that was threatening to sue me, and when he got my letter at his house, the phone calls stopped, and suddenly the account was transferred back to the creditor who then just sent out one letter and then sat silently on the account for about 3 years, and then sent me a 1099-C for the entire debt plus interest.

[danpan]

I agree with some of the other posters, what you can do is file a "dispositive motion", such as a motion to dismiss or a motion to stay pending private contractual arbitration. Unless the debt is over $10,000 most attorneys when they get your motion will offer to drop for mutual dismissal as it cost a ton to arbitrate. Any local court cannot disregard the arbitration provision in 99% of credit card contracts, it is governed by Title 9 Federal Arbitration Act, and is federal law. It essentially ties the hands of your opponent, have done it numerous times on debts greater than 10k and avoided BK alltogether.

Also, stay AWAY from COURT arbitration no better than kangaroo court what you want is "PRIVATE" arb. IE, JAMS, AAA, etc.

Regardless is LOCAL court disregards the provisions of the credit card contract , and most of them say (if you or we elect to arbitrate you or we give up the right to have a court trial...), you can appeal, and even get an injunction from a federal judge at no cost by filing an In forma pauperus (IFP) application with the appropriate federal court.

Why does it cost a ton to arbitrate? Also one of the posts said that it would cost the creditor $2500 and me only $200, is it true? How about if Citi doesn't care about the cost. So every hour I got billed $400 for arbitration?

[flyinbroke]

Why does it cost a ton to arbitrate? Also one of the posts said that it would cost the creditor $2500 and me only $200, is it true? How about if Citi doesn't care about the cost. So every hour I got billed $400 for arbitration?

1. It costs a ton to arbitrate because, unlike court judges, the arbitrators are private employees of a private company. Rather than get paid by the court system they get paid by the hour.

2. Consumer cases are cheap for the consumer. To initiate a case in JAMS, it cost 800-1000 dollars. If you were a business, you would be liable for half of this. Consumers are only liable for the first 250. If you read the agreement for your card, you may request them to pay your share too. This means you pay nothing.

3. Citi won't care about the cost and will pay for it. They are more about revenge than collecting money; I read where they fought for 2000 bucks and paid over 20K to do it.

And it is rare, if ever, that an arbitrator rewards them with you paying for the arb charges. Most never make it to the hearing day.

[ryan]

3. Citi won't care about the cost and will pay for it. They are more about revenge than collecting money; I read where they fought for 2000 bucks and paid over 20K to do it.

WOW, that is amazing when you think about. I am dealing with them now, but in a few more weeks I may have small court victory, however it sounds like I shouldn't count my chickens!

[GoingDown]

You know what? That's interesting about Citi being more interested in revenge. They were the most agressive creditor that came after a dead relative's credit card debt. They called so much more than other creditors, and once they sent the account to a collection agency, they used a very mean and nasty one that called even after they got a certified Cease and Desist letter. The only thing that stopped them was filing a complaint against them with the A.G.'s office and them getting a letter from the A.G.'s office. They were really horrible.

[flyinbroke]

Ironic when you realize that one of the only banks to NOT pay back a dime of their TARP was Citi.

Don't count your chickens with them at all. One more bullet about revenge: they still report my long since charged off account every month like clockwork to all three credit report agencies...as though it really affects the credit score. Only the original CO does.

[JEM]

I agree with Citi being the most aggressive. By far. They sued dh and I, for separate CC's. His Citi was not his biggest, nor was mine. They called the most, they sent the most correspondence. None of our other creditors came close to being as aggressive.

[danpan]

1. It costs a ton to arbitrate because, unlike court judges, the arbitrators are private employees of a private company. Rather than get paid by the court system they get paid by the hour.

2. Consumer cases are cheap for the consumer. To initiate a case in JAMS, it cost 800-1000 dollars. If you were a business, you would be liable for half of this. Consumers are only liable for the first 250. If you read the agreement for your card, you may request them to pay your share too. This means you pay nothing.

3. Citi won't care about the cost and will pay for it. They are more about revenge than collecting money; I read where they fought for 2000 bucks and paid over 20K to do it.

And it is rare, if ever, that an arbitrator rewards them with you paying for the arb charges. Most never make it to the hearing day.

So do I need to include a request in my answer to Citi's summon and complaints? How should I word it? Do I need to file a motion besides the answer to move the case to arbitration? Would this work in California or each state does it differently? Some posts said before that some state courts just ignore it and proceed with the case on hand....

[DYLAN150]

I filed for Bankruptcy back in the 80's and a few years back tried to get a Citi Bank visa card. My fico was 785 and they said NO. I was told that they blacklist you once you claim Bankruptcy on them.

[flyinbroke]

So do I need to include a request in my answer to Citi's summon and complaints? How should I word it? Do I need to file a motion besides the answer to move the case to arbitration? Would this work in California or each state does it differently? Some posts said before that some state courts just ignore it and proceed with the case on hand....

YOu would need a motion to compel private, contractual arbitration...at least I did in my state. I filed it with my answer for their suit. I don't know CA law though, so not sure...but I know they have pretty strong consumer laws.

[danpan]

YOu would need a motion to compel private, contractual arbitration...at least I did in my state. I filed it with my answer for their suit. I don't know CA law though, so not sure...but I know they have pretty strong consumer laws.

So the motion to compel contractual arbitration is not part of the answer? Did the judge hold a hearing to approve the motion or just approve it without hearing?

[danpan]

YOu would need a motion to compel private, contractual arbitration...at least I did in my state. I filed it with my answer for their suit. I don't know CA law though, so not sure...but I know they have pretty strong consumer laws.

I don't have a lawyer(can't afford one) so I am doing the answering of the summon and complaint myself. Could you share with me what I should put down in the motion to compel private contractual arbitration? Do I need to provide the court a copy of the contract? I can't find my copy the sample I found so far online says the loosing party pays for the fee. So I am worried I would be forced to pay more fees. Here is what I read on arbitration terms by Citi

Dispute Resolution. The Parties will endeavor in good faith to promptly settle any disputes relating to this Agreement (each a "Dispute"). If the appropriate members of each Party's management team cannot promptly settle a Dispute, senior executives from each Party will try to resolve the dispute. If no resolution is reached then either Party may submit the Dispute to the American Arbitration Association for binding arbitration. The Party prevailing in such arbitration shall be entitled to a recovery of its costs and attorneys fees from the non-prevailing Party. Subject to Section IV.F, the procedures included in this Section VII.L will be the exclusive procedures for resolution of any and all Disputes

[danpan]

YOu would need a motion to compel private, contractual arbitration...at least I did in my state. I filed it with my answer for their suit. I don't know CA law though, so not sure...but I know they have pretty strong consumer laws.

Forgot to ask one important question, did the credit card company settle with you before the arbitration hearing? I am afraid they will go all the way and I will loose and a judgement will attach to my house...

[flyinbroke]

Forgot to ask one important question, did the credit card company settle with you before the arbitration hearing? I am afraid they will go all the way and I will loose and a judgement will attach to my house...

They have not settled. The hearing is this summer, but they want to try to mediate first. So settlement is a possibility.

And even if you lose in arbitration, you can appeal. And they have to confirm the arbitration award in court, so judgment is not a quick given like in regular court.

[danpan]

They have not settled. The hearing is this summer, but they want to try to mediate first. So settlement is a possibility.

And even if you lose in arbitration, you can appeal. And they have to confirm the arbitration award in court, so judgment is not a quick given like in regular court.

So how much do you have to pay initially? Is this with Citi? Can you settle before the hearing date?