Can your checking account be found?

[frogger]

We've all cussed and discussed checking accounts and how they can and will be confiscated.

Advice has been given to open new checking accounts and to not share the information with anyone. I am just as guilty about giving that information as any of the others.

Let's now update our checking account discussion:

Checking accounts can and will be found. New checking accounts, old checking accounts, it doesn't matter. These accounts can be found for a few dollars and few minutes of time. Now, let's look at what is available about you and your checking accounts:

Accounts closed for cause
Account opening inquiries
Deposit account collections
Negative retail check-writing histories
Check order histories

Other information that is available on you:

Drivers license numbers
Place of employment
Credit bureau score
Summary of unfilled items (unfilled items is a bad check)
Explanation of unfilled items
Recent account closed
Explanation of accounts closed
Explanation of previous account inquires (This gives the information on checking accounts that have been opened, including bank, branch, and account number)
Summary of most recent check orders. (This tells how many and how often checks have been ordered.

All of this can be had for $2.95 or less per consumer

This is something that is not available to the general public, however for a business that qualifies, it is readily available.

So...... my previous advice about checking accounts should be ignored. If someone wants your information, it will be found.

[ApresMoi]

Good to know. Thank you for the info.

[JEM]

Yikes. Wow.

Once you file though--accounts are safe, correct?

[jdcat]

This information goes back how far?

[frogger]

This information goes back how far?

As old as your credit report. This is nothing more than the same old thing with the credit bureau gathering up and packaging your information for sale.

This is especially used in the subprime market (ie - buy here / pay here car dealers, pawn shops, title pawns, etc.)

You can run, but you can't hide. The amount of data and information for sale by these companies is growing by the day. To be totally private, you have to complete fall off the landscape.

That ain't easy........

[catleg]

Data collection is one thing, scrubbing it for current/accurate information is quite another.

[WhatMoney]

We've all cussed and discussed checking accounts and how they can and will be confiscated.

Advice has been given to open new checking accounts and to not share the information with anyone. I am just as guilty about giving that information as any of the others.

Let's now update our checking account discussion:

Checking accounts can and will be found. New checking accounts, old checking accounts, it doesn't matter. These accounts can be found for a few dollars and few minutes of time. Now, let's look at what is available about you and your checking accounts:

Accounts closed for cause
Account opening inquiries
Deposit account collections
Negative retail check-writing histories
Check order histories

Other information that is available on you:

Drivers license numbers
Place of employment
Credit bureau score
Summary of unfilled items (unfilled items is a bad check)
Explanation of unfilled items
Recent account closed
Explanation of accounts closed
Explanation of previous account inquires (This gives the information on checking accounts that have been opened, including bank, branch, and account number)
Summary of most recent check orders. (This tells how many and how often checks have been ordered.

All of this can be had for $2.95 or less per consumer

This is something that is not available to the general public, however for a business that qualifies, it is readily available.

So...... my previous advice about checking accounts should be ignored. If someone wants your information, it will be found.

How about providing some sources for the above information? And $2.95 sounds low to me for obtaining illegal private information on checking accounts. Generally it is from $100-$200 per search.

Here is the specific items I would like to know the sources:
-Check order histories
-Summary of most recent check orders.
-Recent account closed
-Explanation of accounts closed
-Explanation of previous account inquires (This gives the information on checking accounts that have been opened, including bank, branch, and account number)

Since checking accounts do not appear on credit reports unless they have had a credit problem or hard pull for credit, who/where is this information coming from? Banks, Deluxe Corp, and ChexSystems do not provide specific private checking information without a court ordered subpoena, for example.

There are some banks who now do a hard pull without your permission when applying for a simple online free checking account with no credit card or overdraft credit attached - Bank of America for example.

[OweTooMuch]

Wells Fargo always does a hard pull even if you have an existing account with them. The banker tried to tell me they only do soft pulls. I then asked her why my husband had three hard pulls on his credit when I added him to my checking account and he already had his own account there. She couldn't seem to answer that question.

Navy Federal Credit Union does not do any pulls UNLESS you apply for a credit card or line of credit with them.

[frogger]

How about providing some sources for the above information? And $2.95 sounds low to me for obtaining illegal private information on checking accounts. Generally it is from $100-$200 per search.

Nothing illegal about it at all. Note in the op where I stated:

This is something that is not available to the general public, however for a business that qualifies, it is readily available.

A business that qualifies would be a bank, credit union, used car dealer, collection agency, etc. There is a set monthly fee to be on the program, and then a per search charge.

[treehugger1]

I disagree that it is 'easy' to find everything about you, including your bank accounts. Clearly, these can be possibly uncovered by a pull of yoru credit report or a ChexSystem file, but (and this is big) they must have permission from the consumer or another permissible reason to access these. A permissible purpose to pull your chexsystem might be a court order, etc. Companies that side-step this can and do get in deep sh*t.

I'll wait for an answer to Whatmoney's question. I want the site or address, as I have $2.95 I can throw away. I know about Lexis. In fact, I pulled my own account detail. Then, I wrote a letter opting out of their privacy policy that states they can share information with their "affiliates." They have to follow the same federal laws as credit reporting and check reporting entities. The crappy thing about the privacy laws is that it is up to the consumer to invoke their rights. Most consumers are clueless.

[Dst1]

Nothing illegal about it at all. Note in the op where I stated:

This is something that is not available to the general public, however for a business that qualifies, it is readily available.

A business that qualifies would be a bank, credit union, used car dealer, collection agency, etc. There is a set monthly fee to be on the program, and then a per search charge.

That is not my understanding of the law. There has to be a legitimate business need in each specific case. The mere fact that a business is a "collection agency" is not a legitimate business need. The mere fact that someone did not pay your debt is not a legitimate business need. Normally the business can only access this information with your written approval.

It's completely true that this information is legally available. But there are stiff penalties for violating the law if a business swears it has a legitimate business need and does not.

Now I don't know if there are any cases in court using the "fruits of the poisonous tree" theory but I suspect an attempt to seize accounts when those accounts were located illegally would not be accepted.

The impression you are leaving frogger is that business can go on fishing expeditions to learn everything about you and then take you to the cleaners. I just don't believe that to be correct. That's not what the law authorizes.

[WhatMoney]

Nothing illegal about it at all. Note in the op where I stated:
This is something that is not available to the general public, however for a business that qualifies, it is readily available.
A business that qualifies would be a bank, credit union, used car dealer, collection agency, etc. There is a set monthly fee to be on the program, and then a per search charge.

Yes, I am not questioning these points - I thought that was well known.

What I am asking is what databases supply check printing information, or specific checking account numbers and bank branch, for example?

While you may expose your checking account bank corporate location when a bank does a hard pull or reports your delinquent account to ChexSystems for example, these are known methods for accounts that have been compromised. If you want an account that is difficult to locate you need to take some precautions - it needs to be new and clean with no credit problems, no obvious traceability, and at an institution in a non-obvious location.

For example, how does a legitimate business obtain my checking account information if hypothetically, the account is some financial institution in another state, far far away. And the institution only has one location in one town - no other branches. And the institution does not check credit reports. To open and maintain an account they check your DMV information which you supply to confirm your identity. Then they look for your name in ChexSystems. This does not leave a footprint in Chexsystems anymore than my searching for my name in a local court computer adds my name to their files. Since the account does not generate interest, it is not reported to the IRS.

So how would they locate this account out the the tens of thousands of similar small institutions throughout the country? It would be impracticable to pay for and deliver court approved writ of garnishments to 25,000 institutions in hopes of finding the needle in the haystack - not to mention the $1,250,000 in court and summons fees that would require.

The biggest leak could be Deluxe Corp who prints the checks, assuming Deluxe keeps the account information on each order they receive. But Deluxe has privacy laws that prevent them from giving out this private information to anyone - UNLESS it is court ordered. Identity thieves would have a field day if they could simply obtain check information from a Deluxe Corp database, assuming they keep one. So again, what is the source for your information?

(I realize there are illegal methods to obtain this information - bribes to employees and officials - false subpoenas - trash reconstruction, etc. But not for $2.95?)

[ApresMoi]

This is heartening. I had read that a legal action has to be taken in order to get such info. Companies don't (can't, legally) just dole out to whomever asks.

That is not my understanding of the law. There has to be a legitimate business need in each specific case. The mere fact that a business is a "collection agency" is not a legitimate business need. The mere fact that someone did not pay your debt is not a legitimate business need. Normally the business can only access this information with your written approval.

It's completely true that this information is legally available. But there are stiff penalties for violating the law if a business swears it has a legitimate business need and does not.

Now I don't know if there are any cases in court using the "fruits of the poisonous tree" theory but I suspect an attempt to seize accounts when those accounts were located illegally would not be accepted.

The impression you are leaving frogger is that business can go on fishing expeditions to learn everything about you and then take you to the cleaners. I just don't believe that to be correct. That's not what the law authorizes.

[frogger]

I disagree that it is 'easy' to find everything about you, including your bank accounts. Clearly, these can be possibly uncovered by a pull of yoru credit report or a ChexSystem file, but (and this is big) they must have permission from the consumer or another permissible reason to access these. A permissible purpose to pull your chexsystem might be a court order, etc. Companies that side-step this can and do get in deep sh*t.

Not talking about pulling a credit report. There must be permission granted for credit reports to be pulled. We're talking information here, not credit reports.

I'll wait for an answer to Whatmoney's question. I want the site or address, as I have $2.95 I can throw away.

You, nor any other "person" can access it. The information (as I pointed out earlier) is available only to a business that qualifies. Qualifications include many things, from the need to know to site security. This is not available to the general public.

I know about Lexis. In fact, I pulled my own account detail. Then, I wrote a letter opting out of their privacy policy that states they can share information with their "affiliates." They have to follow the same federal laws as credit reporting and check reporting entities.

Once again, we're not talking credit reporting, we're talking about the reporting and sharing of information. You can opt out of all of their "affiliates", but all that does is get you off the mailing list. Information is freely shared between all the major credit bureaus and big business.

The crappy thing about the privacy laws is that it is up to the consumer to invoke their rights. Most consumers are clueless.

I totally agree. Most consumers are clueless.

If anyone thinks that the collection agencies and others are going on google and clicking the "find anything out about anyone" ads for $200.00, they are sadly mistaken. These companies subscribe to services from companies that are one and the same as credit bureaus, just operating under different names. These companies are not selling your credit, they are selling your information.

Other companies that are owned and operated by the credit bureaus are the companies that "protect" your credit information.

This is one big shell game with the credit bureau companies wearing many different hats. As always, follow the money......

[frogger]

That is not my understanding of the law. There has to be a legitimate business need in each specific case. The mere fact that a business is a "collection agency" is not a legitimate business need. The mere fact that someone did not pay your debt is not a legitimate business need. Normally the business can only access this information with your written approval.

That is true for your credit report.

But, we're not talking a credit report. We're talking information.

And the wording that you must check off on when accessing is:


For use by persons holding a legal or beneficial interest relating to the consumer


We're not talking scare tactics. We're not talking about your credit report.

We're talking about information. Nothing more, nothing less. It's out there, and you do not have to authorize anyone to access it. If you're a debtor, then anyone that owns or works the debt has a beneficial interest relating to you.