Crap 1 debtor exam

[catleg]

Jacko,

you are mistaking a very serious, and fundamental, underlying issue.

This particular judgment, because you aren't going to answer, will survive BK and ANY FOLLOWING BK's for the rest of your life. If you ever, EVER, make enough money to merit doing so, they can and will collect.

This will haunt you.

Huh? What makes it so special because he doesn't answer it. Judgments are vacated by BK all the time.

[DeadManCrawling]

cat,

not answering this one is different, because he will be "Admitting that this debt is not dischargeable in BK". Ever. I am not sure how it all works, but we have the same issue with Cap One, a request for admissions, and debtor exam, scheduled in Dec. Our attorney was extremely firm on this. We MUST answer or get filed before that date. Otherwise the underlying debt can not be discharged. Ever.

Maybe it varies by district, or even judge, but it's not a chance we are going to take.

The gist is this: Somewhere on that form, if it is the same we received from Cap One, is this sentence:

"I admit that this debt is not and will not be dischargeable in bankruptcy."

Or something similar. Our attorney says this is the worst possible outcome for these types of things.

[DeadManCrawling]

Additionally, it is at this point that Cap One can, and often does, request a warrant for arrest of the debtor. The warrant is not for being in debt, but for refusing to answer the judge in a court proceeding.

Read back a page or two, and you will see posts from people who had warrants issued because of not answering this particular document.

Not a chance I would take.

[WhatMoney]

The gist is this: Somewhere on that form, if it is the same we received from Cap One, is this sentence:

"I admit that this debt is not and will not be dischargeable in bankruptcy."

Well so far the OP say these words are not in the letter. But even if they were, how in hell can you admit to something that is false? The debt is and will be discharged in bankruptcy. If the OP wants to be safe he should send them a response stating "this debt is and will be dischargeable in bankruptcy". If Cap 1 wants to attend the 341 meeting and object to the debt being included, let them try.

The judgment does of course always survive bankruptcy, only the underlying debt is discharged. You would need to vacate the judgment after the bankruptcy as a new action, a routine procedure that will cost you extra legal fees unless you handle it yourself.

[DeadManCrawling]

Correct, WM,

Ny biggest fear in our case, is the possibility of an arrest warrant, a real risk in the event that the thing goes unanswered. County judges can put you in jail for ignoring them. Something we plan to avoid.

[speedbump69]

In my area all local banks provide a notary free even without an account..

[GoingDown]

So, I should answer their questions? Currently collection proof and in foreclosure.

Are you kidding?

I wouldn't make it easy for them.

I wouldn't answer anything.

If you're judgment proof there is nothing they can do but huff and puff and bluff you into paying them.

[GoingDown]

cat,

not answering this one is different, because he will be "Admitting that this debt is not dischargeable in BK". Ever. I am not sure how it all works, but we have the same issue with Cap One, a request for admissions, and debtor exam, scheduled in Dec. Our attorney was extremely firm on this. We MUST answer or get filed before that date. Otherwise the underlying debt can not be discharged. Ever.

Maybe it varies by district, or even judge, but it's not a chance we are going to take.

The gist is this: Somewhere on that form, if it is the same we received from Cap One, is this sentence:

"I admit that this debt is not and will not be dischargeable in bankruptcy."

Or something similar. Our attorney says this is the worst possible outcome for these types of things.

I sincerely doubt that simply ignoring something will be the same thing as saying the debt is yours forever and ever and never bankruptable. Besides, they can make you give up your right to file bankruptcy against this debt. Bankruptcy is a right. They don't have the power to take that right away from you.

[pcn]

Are you kidding?

I wouldn't make it easy for them.

I wouldn't answer anything.

If you're judgment proof there is nothing they can do but huff and puff and bluff you into paying them.

Judgement proof and collection proof are different terms. I'd expect a "mentor" to know that before throwing them around too loosley.

[catleg]

An admission relates to a "fact" which may be in dispute between the parties of the case.

What you are talking about is not a relevant "fact" upon which a state court can apply "law" to reach a conclusion ("judgment").

The admissions are only made for the case in question, you can't be summoned with "I admit to killing Jimmy Hoffa" and subsequently be arrested for murder whether or not you answer.

The worst that can happen is "imprisonment" (I put in quotes because it is normally a special kind of arrest and imprisonment, at least here in NJ) for not answering. So answer and do your best to give them nothing.

Federal supremacy and the automatic stay are powerful tools that override state court actions.

I have many lawsuits pending against me/my wife and literally *not a peep* from them since filing for BK.

[DeadManCrawling]

Yes,

BK, which is federal, stops them in their tracks. When things have progressed far enough that you are faacing a debtor exam, it is probably time to get the BK filed.

We filed ours today, ahead of our exam, which was scheduled for Dec 14. We will watch to see if they dismiss, and will appear to tell them we filed BK if it is still on the schedule.

Good luck with yours, whatever route you take.

[catleg]

There is some pretty clear case law which states that opposing attorneys, once notified of the bankruptcy case being filed by you, cannot claim "we didn't know" and must take positive action to avoid violating the stay. I put all of the creditors attorneys on my BK matrix so that would be covered. The automatic stay is extremely powerful.

[jacko]

I should answer them. What are the chances they will seize my vehicle? My state auto exemption is $4200. I looked at KBB for the value of my auto. Fair condition is $4375 and good condition is $5100. If I were to sell it privately, I would use the Fair condition value. After I mail my response out, I will be out of state for 6-8 weeks with my car.

Also, I will be keeping my checking regardless. I like my bank and I would have to provide another debtor exam in the future. I only deposit at up to $300 at a time and drain with bill pay to pay the utilities etc. I don't write out checks anymore since it takes a week to clear.

My deposits are exempt I believe since they fall under the poverty guidelines.

An admission relates to a "fact" which may be in dispute between the parties of the case.

What you are talking about is not a relevant "fact" upon which a state court can apply "law" to reach a conclusion ("judgment").

The admissions are only made for the case in question, you can't be summoned with "I admit to killing Jimmy Hoffa" and subsequently be arrested for murder whether or not you answer.

The worst that can happen is "imprisonment" (I put in quotes because it is normally a special kind of arrest and imprisonment, at least here in NJ) for not answering. So answer and do your best to give them nothing.

Federal supremacy and the automatic stay are powerful tools that override state court actions.

I have many lawsuits pending against me/my wife and literally *not a peep* from them since filing for BK.

[catleg]

Really just as long as you send it back, the ball is back in their court.
If you just scribble nonsense in crayon all that will happen is they'll try to compel you to answer, possibly by threatening arrest. But they're already threatening arrest if you don't answer.

So the trick is to put something down that looks like a sincere effort to comply but without giving them anything.

You know, my handwriting is really poor, I doubt they can even read the VIN number I put down, is that a '4' or a 'Y'. Get it?

[treehugger1]