Pay Day Loans

[Estabinki]

Hello,

Does anyone know anything about pay day loans? How do they work?
Hypothetically, lets say I were to get one, and I know you have to have a bank account which I do, and I get the loan. When it comes time for them to take that money out of my bank account, and the money is not in there, because I am negative in my account, and plan to include that in my BK, would that be considered fraud? Or would the payday loan just be another debt inccured, and I could include that in my BK?
I have stopped paying on my CC since December, and have stopped using them in December/January. I am trying to hold off as long as I can to file, as I do not have the money for an attorney.
Would the court see this pay day loan as a bad thing, knowing I had knowledge I was going to file BK?
I hope this all makes sense.

Thanks for any advice......

[keepmine]

If you filed bk withn 70 days of taking out the loan, the lender would likely claim it as a cash advance and file an objection to the discharge of that debt.

[CindyLou]

The thing is......fraud has all to do with the "intent" sometimes and not the actual act. So what you are saying is possible to do without much of a red flag, BUT you have to live with what you intent was when you took the payday loan.

Payday loan places are a pain, and purposely overdrawing an acct is just not worth it. Having a valid bank acct and staying out of chexsystems is important during this time in your life.

I say its not worth it...

[Estabinki]

So basically wait 70 days to file BK after taking the payday loan?
With payday loans, do the collectors come after you quickly, and try to sue you, etc. Or does it take some time before they do that...meaning by waiting the 70 days to file, is the collection agency going to take action before then?
I know its a case by case thing, but just hoping someone has had some experience.

Thanks

[keepmine]

So basically wait 70 days to file BK after taking the payday loan?
With payday loans, do the collectors come after you quickly, and try to sue you, etc. Or does it take some time before they do that...meaning by waiting the 70 days to file, is the collection agency going to take action before then?
I know its a case by case thing, but just hoping someone has had some experience.

Thanks

Bottom line-don't do it. PD lenders are very aggressive early in the process. They'll call you and every reference you list numerous times. Plus, you don't want to be without a bank account post bk.
If you file within 70 days, that means the creditor has the presumption of abuse. If you file after 70 days, they can object-they just have more work to do and a closed bank account with no repayments will really bloster their case.
I gotta say, if you're not paying cc debt or any other debt you wish to discharge and still can't come up with money for a lawyer you got problems bk can't fix. You nrrd raise your income. I'd look for a pt job and dedicate the earnings for legal fees. What about your tax refund plus, the rebate coming thi summer? A loan/gift from family members?

[bkdone]

Hello,

I am trying to hold off as long as I can to file, as I do not have the money for an attorney.

Are you planning to file ch.13 or ch.7? If you are going to file Ch.13 then stop paying everything, and use the money to get the lawyer. All of your arrearages can be dealt with under Ch. 13. The sooner you file, the sooner all of the other actions stop.

[duciwish]

Wow! To me that's fraud. The only person making that decision is the trustee. No lawyer can gaurantee you anything. One, there is a reason why the petition states when the debt was opened. It could be a "red flag" to the trustee. Yes, a creditor could meet you at the "meeting of the creditors" to dispute it. I usually tell clients make partial payments and wait 90 days before filing.

[Estabinki]

One other question....I guess in AZ you are only allowed one payday loan at a time.
What happens if you have more than 1, say 5, and you include them in your BK? Could some not be discharged, cause you had more than what the states law is?
Thanks