Debt Validation............

[magyar123]

What information exactly do collection agencies have to send you when you ask them to validate a debt?

[CPO]

What information exactly do collection agencies have to send you when you ask them to validate a debt?

magyar123, this is what I have used, and my attorney tells me it's perfect (?)...but I'm no lawyer:

Debt Validation Law: The Fair Debt Collection Practices Act (FDCPA) 1996 amendment included Consumer Credit Protection Act to prohibit abusive practices by debt collectors. Title VIII, sec. 809 of this act gives legal recognition to Debt validation. The law states that debt Collectors are bound to issue a written notice within the first 5 days of initial communication with a consumer for debt collection, specifying the following:

Specific amount of debt along with the name of the Creditor.
A statement that unless the consumer dispute the validity of the debt within 30 days of receiving the notice, the collector will assume the debt to be valid.
A statement that the debt collector will obtain verification of the debt or a copy of judgment against the consumer in case of debt dispute.
A statement that consumer will be provided with the name and address of the original creditor, if different from the current creditor, on written request by the consumer within 30 days.
A statement that the communication is from a debt collector attempting to collect debt and that information obtained will not be used for any other purpose than this.
A proof that they are assigned to collect the debt by a creditor.
Detailed payment history, starting with the original creditor.
Copy of the original signed debt agreement or credit card application.
Agreement with any of your clients that grants you the authority to collect on this alleged debt.

Also, good info:

Restrictions on Debt Collectors: Debt Collectors are not allowed to do the following before providing with Debt Validation:
Collect debt
Contact the consumer about debt
Report under FCRA (Fair Credit Reporting Act). Violation of this can however take away $1,000 as penalty from the collector. So go ahead and exercise your rights. And pay debts only when it's yours.

Here's a good validation letter you can cut 'n paste:


Your name)
(Your address

Collection company name
Company address

(Date)

Re: Acct# 00000000

To whom it may concern:


This letter is being sent to you in response to a notice sent to me on March 8th, 2050. Please be advised that this is not a refusal to pay, but a notice sent pursuant to the Fair Debt Collection Practices Act, 15 USC 1692g Sec. 809 (b) that your claim is disputed and validation is requested.

This is NOT a request for "verification" or proof of my mailing address, but a request for VALIDATION made pursuant to the above Title and Section. I respectfully request that your offices provide me with competent evidence that I have any legal obligation to pay you.

Please provide me with the following:

1. What the money you say I owe is for
2. Explain and show me how you calculated what you say I owe
3. Provide me with copies of any papers that show I agreed to pay what you say I owe
4. Provide a verification or copy of any judgment if applicable
5. Identify the original creditor
6. Prove the Statute of Limitations has not expired on this account
7. Show me that you are licensed to collect in my state
8. Provide me with your license numbers and Registered Agent

At this time I will also inform you that if your offices have reported invalidated information to any of the 3 major credit Bureaus (Equifax, Experion or TransUnion) this action might constitute fraud under both federal and State Laws. Due to this fact, if any negative mark is found on any of my credit reports by your company or the company that you represent, I will not hesitate in bringing legal action against you for the following:

1. Violation of the Fair Credit Reporting Act-reporting inaccurate information
2. Violation of the Fair Debt Collection Practices Act-continuing collection activity on a debt which has not been validated

Also during this validation period, if any action is taken which could be considered detrimental to any of my credit reports, I will consult with my legal counsel for suit. This includes listing of any information to credit reporting repository that could be inaccurate or invalidated or verifying an account as accurate when in fact there is no provided proof that it is.

REQUEST FOR CEASE AND DESIST OF CONTACT BY YOUR OFFICE: I would also like to request, in writing, no further contact, either in writing or telephone be made by your office to my home or to my place of employment, unless it is to provide validation or release of liability of the debt. If your offices attempt telephone communication with me, including but not limited to computer generated calls and calls or correspondence sent to or with third parties, it will be considered harassment and I will have no choice but to file suit.

It would be advisable that you assure that your records are in order before I am forced to take legal action. This is an attempt to correct your records; any information obtained shall be used for that purpose.

Thank you,

Signature
Printed name


Good luck to you, and be prepared to have collectors insist that they don't have to give you this info. They are just ignorant, and many have been successfully sued for actions counter to above mentioned laws.

Regards,

CPO

[magyar123]

Thanks for your answer. The only item that I really wanted "validated", is the original dates that the bills became delinquent and when the original delinquency hit the credit reports. On one the bills which I remember dates back to 2000, their re-aging entry is 2006. I figure that if I get a "validated" date of 2000 - I can then dispute the credit reporting agency entry, and it will fall off my credit report.

[CPO]

Thanks for your answer. The only item that I really wanted "validated", is the original dates that the bills became delinquent and when the original delinquency hit the credit reports. On one the bills which I remember dates back to 2000, their re-aging entry is 2006. I figure that if I get a "validated" date of 2000 - I can then dispute the credit reporting agency entry, and it will fall off my credit report.

I understand and see what your looking for.

But, I HATE third party debt collectors (thats why I'm suing two of them).

If it was me, I'd make 'em work for it.

That data is what the law requires to be a "validation."

I would not let them off the hook with something easy.

I say stick it to 'em.

But, suit yourself.

CPO

[treehugger1]

It sounds as if you are trying to deal with a collection agency reporting to a consumer reporting agency. If so, and the debt was originally obtained several years ago and the collector sent contacted you a while back, you may have missed your opportunity to ask the collection agency for validation.

If you are going for a validation letter, it is also a good idea to research your state laws regarding licensing or registering of CA's in your state. I debated including this in my letter a while back, but included a line stating all collection agencies must be registered in Oregon, especially if the debt was obtained while I was a resident of this state.

Be sure to include that they are not to call you, or any third party, with respect to the debt. However, I leave the door open for them to send all information via US mail at my mailing address. So far, out of five letters I've sent to various parties there has been no response. CA's are very careful about sending written information to you other than possible validation items as mentioned by CPO.

I am in the process of writing followup letters to two collection agencies who have not responded with validation within the 30 day time frame. 40 days will actually have passed since they received my request for validation. In the event I am taken to small claims court, I believe I now have a legitimate counter-claim and can request an amount equal to that established by Federal and State statutes. Does this seem correct, CPO?

[CPO]

It sounds as if you are trying to deal with a collection agency reporting to a consumer reporting agency. If so, and the debt was originally obtained several years ago and the collector sent contacted you a while back, you may have missed your opportunity to ask the collection agency for validation.

If you are going for a validation letter, it is also a good idea to research your state laws regarding licensing or registering of CA's in your state. I debated including this in my letter a while back, but included a line stating all collection agencies must be registered in Oregon, especially if the debt was obtained while I was a resident of this state.

Be sure to include that they are not to call you, or any third party, with respect to the debt. However, I leave the door open for them to send all information via US mail at my mailing address. So far, out of five letters I've sent to various parties there has been no response. CA's are very careful about sending written information to you other than possible validation items as mentioned by CPO.

I am in the process of writing followup letters to two collection agencies who have not responded with validation within the 30 day time frame. 40 days will actually have passed since they received my request for validation. In the event I am taken to small claims court, I believe I now have a legitimate counter-claim and can request an amount equal to that established by Federal and State statutes. Does this seem correct, CPO?

Thats great info. The idea about allowing communication with you via USPS is a great one. It can keep them from sneaking up on you...like a court summons out of the blue...

Which may or may not be a legit claim, but you still have to respond which can be a hassle when you have little notice.

You can also sue them for any negative info/inquiries they left on your CR's when they fail to validate...instead of just a counter-claim when and if they sue. You don't have to wait for them to contact you again, which they probably won't do but they may try to leave something behind on your CR's.

Also, if they don't validate, any further collection activity is grounds for lawsuit via the FDCPA.

Best of luck to you. I hope you sue the crap out of them...or at least the relief of them going away.

CPO

[FreshLikeADaisy]

I know this is kind of an old thread, but I wanted to thank CPO for his excellent suggestions. I have to file pro se, and in the event I get stung with an adversarial action from a creditor, I plan to use a variation on these points to create an interrogatory and the request for documents I plan to file with it. I started to get worried because I have not kept CC statements (didn't know I was going to file until just recently) and now I know I can either force them to produce or shut the hell up.

I know that enforcement of the FDCPA and dealing with an adversarial action in court are two different things, but specifically the list of what you are making them provide is *exactly* what I would want in order to start: even one item they couldn't provide, or untruthfully denied, would be to my benefit in front of a judge. (Even if I didn't get anywhere, it would -- like you -- give them impression that I actually had some clue and am not entirely defenseless. The truth may be vastly different, but that's my story and I'm sticking to it.) Awesome work! Thanks dude!