Filing for sure probably next week

[Resigned2BK]

Finally.

We really wanted to get this done before the end of the year so we wouldn't have to do the tax return for 2011, but our Atty's paralegal was out sick part of last week and she told DH a couple days ago that it's going to take more than a week for her to fill in all the blanks to get it ready for us to meet with the Atty again, sign, and file. Huh? I guess they are busy with other work I suppose. We have everything meticulously organized for them but it'll still take potentially weeks? Ugh.

And we finally did that required pre-BK counseling course. What a joke that was. DH and I got into a fight over what they meant by the goals during a quiz -- which by the way the postcard given to us by the atty said no tests or quizzes. And laughably, the email counselor sent us this prefabricated blurb at the end saying good job on goals but we need to have specific dollar amounts and deadlines.

So we will probably lose all the refund for the 2011 tax return? We always roll in some estimated biz taxes into that and could be very screwed if we can't.

I'm also getting anxious seeing all the horror stories related to the trustee interactions. We really should be a no asset case as we're so poor we've been on food stamps and WIC for years now, but WA state really sucks for the exemptions related to cash and securities and for vehicles. We've known the whole time we'll probably be technically an asset case because of a stray investment I partially own, but like only for about $1K or so depending on how much exemption is left over. Atty says the trustee tends to only care about things that are $5K or more. Hmm, we'll see about that I guess.

I'm also curious about people in WA state doing BK while defaulted on their mortgages -- how long before any foreclosing stuff happens. A lot of people post here from California, NY/NJ, and Florida. It would be nice if we can stay here rent free for quite awhile after discharge.

[Drazil65]

Hi, what does the attorney say about getting the paperwork ready today and signing then filing electronically? I am not sure this should be the paralegals call, maybe the attorney can pitch in to get it done faster if he only has one paralegal and no other office help. I think if it were that important to me and I have made it clear all along that this was important then i would contact the attorney asap to see what he could do. Good luck.

[ValleYum]

Are you trying to hold on to your house / keep any equity you have in it? Don't forget you are allowed to choose between state and Federal exemptions.

If you use the Federal exemptions, they allow you to use $10,825 of your unused portion of your homestead exemption for you (and if you are married and both are filing that amount doubles) which can then be used to cover tax refunds, stocks, cash in the bank, jewelry, portions of cars you otherwise can't cover with regular exemptions, etc. Most Washington folks use the Federal exemptions when they aren't trying to save a home.

Link is here: http://www.legalconsumer.com/bankruptcy/laws/#US

Good luck!!!

[btbeme]

Why the rush to file? Do you have a pressing lawsuit or something that you are trying to dodge by filing quickly?

You can always file your income tax based on estimated numbers, receive the refund, and spend it on exempt purchases or make sure it is exempt before filing. A 1040est is fine; at your 341 you would likely be asked for the updated 1040 return, which you would likely have by that time. As long as it isn't terribly different, you'll be fine.

As far as the house, your BK will stop all foreclosure proceedings until you are discharged or the bank gets the stay lifted. At that time, I'd recommend working with your bank on a HAMP refi...even if you don't take it or don't get one, it will take 2-3 months to work through the process.

FYI - starting in about September, you would likely have to hand over your refund anyway, so filing before the end of the year would have hurt, not helped, you.

Best bet is to get your return, spend it on exempt, then file BK. All of that can be accomplished within 30 days.

[Resigned2BK]

Are you trying to hold on to your house / keep any equity you have in it? Don't forget you are allowed to choose between state and Federal exemptions.

If you use the Federal exemptions, they allow you to use $10,825 of your unused portion of your homestead exemption for you (and if you are married and both are filing that amount doubles) which can then be used to cover tax refunds, stocks, cash in the bank, jewelry, portions of cars you otherwise can't cover with regular exemptions, etc. Most Washington folks use the Federal exemptions when they aren't trying to save a home.

Link is here: http://www.legalconsumer.com/bankruptcy/laws/#US

Good luck!!!

Federal does sound better for keeping more cash, but state is much better for tools of trade which we need for covering DH's stuff as he's a professional musician. Did you go with federal or state, Valle? I remembered reading a post of yours some time back where you said you were able to exempt a lot more cash/securities than the June 2011 $1500 limit and wondered how that was possible.

We're not trying to hold on to the house permanently. We had to officially go 90 days late and default back in March (we just kept it rolling at 60 days late from September thru February).

As for Btb's question about why the rush, I brought up that very thing to DH the other day because we don't seem to have a threat of an actual filed lawsuit in the next month and a half, but he just wants to get it all done. I want it all done too. If that means forfeiting the tax refund, so be it. Plus I do self employment stuff in the summer, I don't want my purchases hamstringed by a trustee.

[ValleYum]

We used the federal exemptions, Resigned. The unused portion of the Fed homestead allowed each of us a $10825 wildcard as well as the regular $1150 wildcard.

So together we had $21650 and $2300 worth of wildcards we were able to use.

So I guess, it would come down to how much of your personal goods like: Animals, crops, clothing, appliances, books, furnishings, household goods, tool, musical instruments you could fit into the parameters of the federal exemptions - no item can be worth more than $550 and the total of all items is capped at $11525 (but you can double that to $23050 since you guys are filing jointly.) If an item is over $550, you can use some of your wildcard since you can split them into pieces and stack them to help where an exemption isn't big enough or there is no exemption specifically listed - like how we exempted our potential tax refund and the cash we had in the bank when we filed.

Vehicle exemption is about $200 better using federal exemptions.

So maybe that helps you with a different perspective from the same state! Make sure you ask your attorney what he thinks!

[Resigned2BK]

Here's an update...

We finally heard back from our atty today (Fri). More like at least 20 different questions through email scattered throughout the day. Well, I don't know what kind of voodoo he's doing, but he thinks he can exempt everything -- personal belongings were expected to be very easily exempted -- but also the entire expected 2011 tax refund AND all our bank accounts, cash, securities type stuff. I'm very surprised and want to ask how that's possible under the WA exemptions (we need the higher per item amount to cover some of DH's tools of his trade, that's part of why federal was out in our minds). I'll just have to ask when we see him to sign off on everything so he can file it for us as I've noticed he gets really cranky when we try to ask him questions about some of these finer details.

I reckon between the cash, securities, and refund, we're looking at saving around $6-7K. Paying him $1600 to do that seems to be pretty worthwhile in my book. Just hoping we won't get a trustee that takes a cue from CA and FL trustees and swipes the house to turn us into an asset case (referencing the article posted last month about a CA trustee selling a property back to the servicing bank for $5-10K to effectively do an end run around foreclosure all together and force the homeowner out on the street). We aren't trying to save our house at all, we just don't want to be scrambling before we can even have a discharge and chance to comfortably save up the assorted deposits and 1st and last month for a house rental. If I were a fingernail biter, there'd be no nails left on my hands lately.