Emergency Post Filing

[texasex1981]

Help. Late last week I had a close family member fall seriously ill and had to get there ASAP. Had to charge an airline ticket on a CC that wasnt included in the filing because there was no bal on it. The fare was rather exorbitant given that it was last minute. Is there a problem with doing this? Am waiting on discharge. Thanks.

[sunshinepa]

Although I understand the reasoning and feel for you, it could be a big problem. I believe using credit before discharge is considered a big NO NO! If brought to light, it could possibly result in dismissal. Wether it is actual cause for dismissal under BK, one of the more experienced will have to answer that one. Still learning but I know some folks were warned against using credit, some were asked if they destroyed their cards.

Again, I understand where you were coming from and I sure hope it doesn't become a problem. Hopefully someone else will chime in who has more specific knowledge.

And I sure hope the family member is doing well......good luck!

[debee]

I don't think it matters that you used the card because you're a chapter 7. There's a prohibition from acquiring new credit while in an open chapter 13 without the trustee's consent, but I'm not aware of anything in the books about acquiring new credit while a chapter 7 is open. I wouldn't worry about it. People acquire debt after filing chapter 7 all the time - doctor visits, hospital bills, car breaks down, etc - and it doesn't have any effect on their cases. The only negative is that you can't discharge it.

[texasex1981]

What if I pay that card off this week?

[AngelinaCatHub]

What if I pay that card off this week?

Ms. or Mr. I have read all your previous posts and the answers clearly given. It seems to me that you were greatly desiring to purchase something or other on a zero balance CC. Every person has given you sound advice.

I am known to have a sense of humor but above that, I am known as saying it as I see it. You wished to purchase something and if true that you had some emergency trip to make, you best have real paperwork backing this assumption. Frankly, I don't believe you. I think you are working the system.

I pray I am incorrect, but do you think the Federal Court system is so unaware, as to not check out every one of us who are in or have been in BK? Do you realize we are in the computer age and that your history can easily be looked at?

Sorry 'Tex', this does not wash. Your lawyer has valid reason to vacate your case unless you have real proof. BTW in family occasions of emergency, flights have always been at a less than average price. Particularly in a death in the family.

I state again, I don't believe you. 'Hub


EDIT ADD ON: And, you can pay it off this week? Does not wash!

[texasex1981]

Angelina, dont really give a damn whether you believe me or not regarding the family emergency. It happened and I would have been disowned from my family if I didnt go. Sorry if this gets your panties in a wad.

[texasex1981]

And how exactly is the court going to find out if I charged something on a card. They dont have access to my card info. Just exactly how are they going to find out unless the CC company tells them. You say they can see electronically. What, they sit around and try to look up everyone that filed a BK. Doesnt make sense in the least bit to me.

[Pandora]

And how exactly is the court going to find out if I charged something on a card. They dont have access to my card info. Just exactly how are they going to find out unless the CC company tells them. You say they can see electronically. What, they sit around and try to look up everyone that filed a BK. Doesnt make sense in the least bit to me.

your post says it all... you knew you shouldnt use the card(s) yet you did anyway, against the advice of your lawyer (see previous postings of yours). ETA: Especially since just earlier in the week you stated fraudulent charges on one of your credit cards...... Hmmm

Good luck with trying to "get one over" on the system....

[texasex1981]

Per a previous reply on this thread:



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I don't think it matters that you used the card because you're a chapter 7. There's a prohibition from acquiring new credit while in an open chapter 13 without the trustee's consent, but I'm not aware of anything in the books about acquiring new credit while a chapter 7 is open. I wouldn't worry about it. People acquire debt after filing chapter 7 all the time - doctor visits, hospital bills, car breaks down, etc - and it doesn't have any effect on their cases. The only negative is that you can't discharge it.

[DesdemonaB]

Now OP – you posted the following:

“Hello. My CH 7 BK went to court in late June so I'm just waiting on the discharge. I have several CC that had a -0- bal on them when I filed so they weren't included in the filing. My lawyer said I cant use any credit off these cards until my case is discharged. What are the chances that the court will find out if I actually use one of them? Thanks for any help.”

I am with Hub on this one – the key word here is “several”- what you are trying/did doesn’t add up.

1. What lawyer is going to allow you NOT to list “several” CC on your petition? “Several” = fraud. Your lawyer should have advise you in order to keep these “several” CC you would/should enter in to a reaffirmation agreement – clearly you did not and by your admission your lawyer advised you not to use them prior to discharge.

2. Correct me if I am wrong (wouldn’t be the first time ) but wouldn’t paying off the card in a week constitute preferred payment?

3. Beside if you have/had the cash – why didn’t you use it to pay for the plane ticket in the first place?

4. A simple Google search clearly gives the exact same answer several posters and your lawyer already gave you – you shouldn’t have done it. You just don’t like that answer and are trying to spin it to get to answer you want.

Bottom line, it’s your BK if you choose to loophole your way through it then you clearly haven’t learn anything and you will wind back in court in about another 7 years. Best of luck.

[Pandora]

best read up and get acquainted with the laws in your area.... here are some areas you can start with:

http://www.moranlaw.net/plastic.htm

http://codes.lp.findlaw.com/uscode/11/7/II/727

The issue becomes that you consulted with a BK attorney prior...and were advised NOT to use your cards. Therein lies the problem.

[texasex1981]

Again for the second or third time it was a family emergency. I HAD to go!!! Second, you DO NOT have to reaffirm a CC if it has a -0- bal on it. You just dont include it in the filing. I didnt use cash because I didnt have it at the time and if I waited till I had it my family member would have been DEAD. I will have the funds later in the week and intend to pay off the card in full. That's it. End of story.

Again from a post further up:

"I don't think it matters that you used the card because you're a chapter 7. There's a prohibition from acquiring new credit while in an open chapter 13 without the trustee's consent, but I'm not aware of anything in the books about acquiring new credit while a chapter 7 is open. I wouldn't worry about it. People acquire debt after filing chapter 7 all the time - doctor visits, hospital bills, car breaks down, etc - and it doesn't have any effect on their cases. The only negative is that you can't discharge it."

Some address this please.

[jemma]

TEX- perhaps you are a little too angry at some of the posters here. However, they are giving you sound advice. I too, was told to destroy all cards. Even the ones with a zero balance and I was not allowed to use any credit cards during an active chapter 7. Doesn’t look to good to the trustee or the courts, if they catch wind of this. You filed for a chapter 7 to get out of the debt mess, now you are using a credit card to rack up new debt.

How can they find out? The trustee has every right to continue to investigate you, until they decide they have thoroughly checked you out. Never assume the trustee is finished with you, just because your 341 meeting is over. Even after my 341 meeting, my attorney told me, I must continue to cooperate with the trustee until my case is closed. I must provide any information to the trustee that is requested of me.

Now here is an assumption, when you file for bankruptcy, your credit report is usually pulled and supplied to the trustee, mine was. Now, what if by chance the trustee decides to pull your credit report again, just to double check everything for verification reasons. Then, there it is, a new balance on a card that had a zero balance before. Put yourself out of your own shoes and try to look at it from another persons view. Would it look suspicious to you?

I feel for you because of a family situation. However, I have been right where you are before. Both of my grandparents were hospitalized at the same time. I was desperate to get back there but I knew I had no money to do so, the only way would be to charge up a card. Trust me, I thought long and hard about it. I decided it wasn't worth the risk, I could not and would not put myself in a position to potentially kick up a ruckus in my filling. They understood completely and I just had to be with them in prayer. They did pass away shortly after being hospitalized, my grandmother first and my grandfather a week later. I felt that pain and still do to this very day, if I had only been smarter with everything in my life. I would not have had to say good bye from a distance.

Now back to your original question, here is two things I found when googling.
Can I still use my credit cards if I file a Chapter 7 Bankruptcy?
 You should stop using your credit cards immediately and not incur any additional debt once you know you are going to file for Chapter 7 Bankruptcy. Immediately after filing you cannot use the credit cards or incur any such debt. After the Chapter 7 discharge if you have elected to keep a particular credit card through a reaffirmation agreement and that particular credit card company has also agreed in writing via the reaffirmation agreement to allow you to do so then you may be able to use that particular card.


QUESTION #47:*Will I be able to use credit after my bankruptcy is finished? 
ANSWER:* Yes. *A common misconception about bankruptcy is that you cannot use credit after a case is over.*On the contrary, you are free to use credit just as you were before you filed the case as soon as the case is completed.* You must simply (1) do so responsibly, and (2) accept the fact that some lenders (not all) may treat you differently because of the bankruptcy.

[texasex1981]

I understand what you are saying about the court pulling my credit report to check on me only to find that I've used a card that had a -0- bal. My question is I used the card last Fri and am planning on paying it off this Fri, which means a -0- bal again. The court would have to pull my credit sometime over that 1 week period in order to see that I've used the card. And that's assuming the charge shows up immediately on my report. Couldnt that take several days? By which time I've paid the card off. Does this make sense?

[debee]

It doesn't matter if the trustee or the judge or The Pope himself pulls OP's credit report. The debt was acquired after filing from a creditor not included in the bankruptcy petition. It's not a part of the bankruptcy filing and doesn't matter.

The lawyer probably advised OP not to use any cards included in the bk (which would be fraud) but using credit (whether it's a loan from Granny or Bank of America or Vinny "The Juice") after filing is not against the bk code in a chapter 7. It's not a part of bankruptcy law. There is no prohibition. (The only possible exception would be a secured loan that uses "property of the estate" as collateral. That would be a bad idea.)

As for being a victim of fraud and having a family emergency and filing bankruptcy all within such a short time period, it does seem kinda suspicious, but I believe it's possible to have that much bad luck.

@ OP - the forum members are here to help and their warnings are meant to keep you (& others who read the threads) out of trouble. Don't take it personally if you've been misjudged on this issue. Hang in there. Don't worry.