2 yrs post discharge, getting sued over tall grass

[sh9730]

Justpoor,

You might have A LOT to lose! This debt will be a NEW debt and will go on your credit report etc. and foreclosure is only ONE option the HOA may take. They might just sue you personally etc...then you have another judgement etc....not what you want after a BK.

[Justpoor]

sh9730, I'm not worried about my credit report anymore. I don't plan on ever using credit again. Prior to the recession my credit score was 750. Look where it got me. If they sue and win then I will pay them. But I'd rather see them foreclose.

[tobee43]

This is absolutely legitimate. A discharge does not take away your ownership. You are still the owner of record and the City/County/Municipality has the absolute right to fine you. Additionally, the municipality can pursue all other means of collection such as filing a lawsuit against you. You will be financially responsible for these fines, fees and costs.

This is the ugly downside of surrendering a property in bankruptcy. The bank usually doesn't want anything to do with the property. Think about it; had the bank foreclosed, they would be maintaining the landscaping (lawn), paying for heat in the winter (or winterizing), and a host of other things including, but not limited to, property taxes!

What you should do is contact your attorney and have your attorney explain this to you. Unfortunately, it's the reality of the situation.

jb i so know this is, and has been such a controversial issue. i understand with the respect to the HOA fees still being owed after a bk. however, the other liabilities with respect to other expenses has been a point of contention for many. if someone falls and hurt themselves on a vacated premises/property, they are trespassing, now that's illegal.

on a personal level, our home is still not foreclosed on after...it's now approx 3 years and maybe 8 months??/ (i have stopped counting now)...or more. the bank, Chase, has indeed been maintaining the property, from what we understand. lawn care, they winterized the pipes etc. however, where we had the property, there is no HOA and actually no town or city or county ordinances in reference to any one's property needing to be maintained in any fashion. interesting enough, but the property is in a rural area with farmlands and hidden properties deep in the woods. many may even go unnoticed for a very long time! ( we really didn't even live in a "town" per se, it was a township that was vast and filled up countryside with mountains, trees, field and streams!).

i have posted previously on the subject matter of what is the actual responsibility of one after one surrendered a house in a bk prior to a foreclosure, on many if not numerous occasions. only, because it appears there are more questions than actual answers on the subject??? our atty stated that the action itself, of surrendering the property is clear to the court. he claims we are no longer responsible for anything...go figure. also please note in nj where our old property is, the bank has statue of limitation for deed tranfers...and that is 20 years!!!! so, if they so chose the bank can NEVER transfer that deed. one would hope and believe and this is what our atty made clear. the actual ACT of surrendering shows intent of release of ownership. how legal that is, i have absolutely NO clue.

i don't know anymore?? i see down here in florida, and i'm on the HOA board and we are just adding liens to the property for the bank to handle NOT the bk previous owners...it's like beating a dead horse. or, maybe it's because i'm on that actual board itself and made sure the way the HOA handled past due dues and late fees were and, are placed directly into the laps of the bank holding the paper. so far, two of those foreclosures have sold and the bank paid the lien off to clear title. now, whether the bank rolled those costs over to the new owner i don't know, all i know, is what's the point of kicking a person when they are as down as they can. i also believe each HOA can deal with the situation the way they chose???? i think???? those are questions certainly not answers to the way any other HOA handles the situation.

by the way, just an editorial note here: our old property was underwater over 200k...however,within the past month it regained that loss???????? on zillow.com. we think maybe, just MAYBE, the bank may be beginning to get finally ready to foreclose, as we know for certain it hasn't regained it's actual value.

actually i'm thinking i should do another thesis on this subject matter!!! LOL!!!

[Bell30656]

I have a neighbor that, after talking to an attorney decided to stay in the house, "...until the someone came to throw them out." They haven't made a payment in three years, four months. Their bankruptcy was discharged in Mar 2010, they had opted to surrender the house. The attorney advised them that if they moved out, the county could force them to maintain the property or fine them heavily for an unkept appearance. In addition, we had HOA fees here until Dec 2010. They were advised they would have to pay those as well. The property has been advertised numerous times in the county newspaper to be foreclosed upon but as of yet, they are still in it.

About once a month, someone has come to the house, taken photos and left. The person has a Realtor license plate but has never spoken to the neighbors, sort of a drive by shooting but with a camera. Since their bankruptcy, they have been able to rebuild a lot especially because they aren't making house payments.

[murphsmom]

All of these responses lead me to a really dumb question, but I'm going to ask it anyhow.

If the mortgage debt was discharged, but the bank has NOT foreclosed and the owners name is still on the deed, what's from keep the owner from selling the house for cash, like $20,000, transferring the deed, and getting rid of the house? What about renting the house to someone until it forecloses and making money off of the situation, even if it's just a small amount, and the tenant would agree to the upkeep?

He still owns the home, but owes nothing on it, correct?

[tobee43]

I have a neighbor that, after talking to an attorney decided to stay in the house, "...until the someone came to throw them out." They haven't made a payment in three years, four months. Their bankruptcy was discharged in Mar 2010, they had opted to surrender the house. The attorney advised them that if they moved out, the county could force them to maintain the property or fine them heavily for an unkept appearance. In addition, we had HOA fees here until Dec 2010. They were advised they would have to pay those as well. The property has been advertised numerous times in the county newspaper to be foreclosed upon but as of yet, they are still in it.

About once a month, someone has come to the house, taken photos and left. The person has a Realtor license plate but has never spoken to the neighbors, sort of a drive by shooting but with a camera. Since their bankruptcy, they have been able to rebuild a lot especially because they aren't making house payments.

HOA laws are something personally "new" to us. this is our fist time living in an HOA situation. i see both the good and bad to them. in the respect that you want your neighborhood to stay nice ...actually until we got this new president, the old one, instead of a welcoming letter, would send the police out to the new owners, for a greeting, of a warning about their weeds!!!!! is that sick or WHAT????? (although we purchased this house this past feb., we had been renting it for a some while prior to our purchasing.

what we all do now is this. when THIS HOA gets notice from the bank of the foreclosures, the first thing we do, collectively as a board, is to go to the homeowner to see if there is anything we can do to help them out...in any way possible. (so far we have had three success stories on that front). if not, then when the house becomes vacate we gather together to keep up the property since many of the banks aren't taking the responsibility over. we have charged back no one. but, that's only this small little NICE HOA!

[sh9730]

I suppose in theory one could. BUT, the BUYER will need to understand that there is an outstanding LIEN on the house, and the bank can still foreclose at any time...thats why as a buyer you have a title search done to make sure all liens are disclosed.

[murphsmom]

Ah, yes, that makes perfect sense. I knew that would be way too easy.

I would, however, rent it to someone until it forecloses. Earn a little bit of income off of it, and not have to worry about the upkeep or getting sued.

[tobee43]

All of these responses lead me to a really dumb question, but I'm going to ask it anyhow.

If the mortgage debt was discharged, but the bank has NOT foreclosed and the owners name is still on the deed, what's from keep the owner from selling the house for cash, like $20,000, transferring the deed, and getting rid of the house? What about renting the house to someone until it forecloses and making money off of the situation, even if it's just a small amount, and the tenant would agree to the upkeep?

He still owns the home, but owes nothing on it, correct?

LOL!! right murphsmom!! someone once suggested that i write a certified letter to chase and let them know if they don't foreclose then i'm going to change the locks back since the house is still in our names, and rent it out!!

but that's where one would think, where an liability issue may indeed arise. if one knowingly rents out the property and is NOT maintaining proper insurance...( as our present property is now under an umbrella policy..for fire, and limited liaibilty). and, once again, by doing that, chase is telling everyone on the books it's now THEIR house, one would at least think..right?

[helpmeout]

Yes, they can come after you for tall grass. What I have been doing is only mowing the front lawn since I moved out a month ago. The town doesn't really care about the back lawn as it isn't an eye sore on the street. I only plan on mowing once a month until summer is over. The grass will get tall, but won't go over the height limit that would trigger a ticket. I would still be living there except that the bank did start the foreclosure process, which usually takes 90 days. By next summer, I won't have to worry about it. And if I do, I'm moving back in. By then my lease will be up.

[helpmeout]

Ah, yes, that makes perfect sense. I knew that would be way too easy.

I would, however, rent it to someone until it forecloses. Earn a little bit of income off of it, and not have to worry about the upkeep or getting sued.

That's tricky since you aren't paying the mortgage. The bank can probably come after you for the rent money. I would definitely run that one by an attorney first.

[murphsmom]

That's tricky since you aren't paying the mortgage. The bank can probably come after you for the rent money. I would definitely run that one by an attorney first.

I'd definitely ask an attorney, but how can the bank come after you if the mortgage is discharged and you aren't liable for it any more? Our home is not foreclosing, we modified the mortgage and are staying.

[tobee43]

Yes, they can come after you for tall grass. What I have been doing is only mowing the front lawn since I moved out a month ago. The town doesn't really care about the back lawn as it isn't an eye sore on the street. I only plan on mowing once a month until summer is over. The grass will get tall, but won't go over the height limit that would trigger a ticket. I would still be living there except that the bank did start the foreclosure process, which usually takes 90 days. By next summer, I won't have to worry about it. And if I do, I'm moving back in. By then my lease will be up.

i don't know where exactly you are in nj, however, i know it does in fact depend. now, in my daughters town, they go after the homeowners for every thing!! every single little thing. and, when they were moving to north carolina they got called almost daily by the town just for having a few doors off to get out their furniture!!!! they were threaten with fines and fees and on and on. even AFTER they left, they did a rent option to buy land contract on that home, and the town STILL was calling her about everything. it finally stopped since the broker handling the land contract intervened.

however, in our township, a neighbor called when we piled our wood in a corner of our property, they called the town, (township muni), and the county and actually the police about the fact the wood was located on his property line. well, it was made very clear to my old neighbor, both the town and the country and, in fact, the police we could do anything we wanted in and or on our property...even DUMP garbage!!!! (can you believe this!!) i'm really NOT wanting to let you know which county it was in, but you can get an idea re: it was in the woods and mountains..

[discouraged]

I live in a city and they are very particular about mowing/shoveling snow, etc. Can you get an old neighbor or neighborhood kid to do it for you and then you won't have to worry. Yes, they can certainly sue you if the property does not live up to the specifications of the county the house is in.

[tobee43]

I live in a city and they are very particular about mowing/shoveling snow, etc. Can you get an old neighbor or neighborhood kid to do it for you and then you won't have to worry. Yes, they can certainly sue you if the property does not live up to the specifications of the county the house is in.

that's a GREAT idea!! actually, if it were me, i would even check out the local paper to see about getting someone if a neighbor couldn't do it! that's a heck of a lot cheaper in the long run than being sued!