Well… it’s done!
I have much to say concerning the legendary 341 meeting of creditors, so this post may be somewhat lengthy. If you rather not bother to read the entire thing, I will make a very short version: it went great, and I was quite literally out in approximately 60 seconds (no joke).
However, if you enjoy hearing about how a 341 can go horribly wrong or if you are going to be attending your 341 in the future, you may wish to continue reading because some of what I saw before I was called was jaw dropping.
While I am sure 341s are the ‘same’ in most areas, I would like to say that mine was in Orlando, Florida, at the Fairwinds building downtown.
Brief background: my case is less than the median income with no assets. Every bit of my debt was credit card debt, and it was at the point where it would never, ever be gone and out of my life unless I took this route. I retained my attorney in October, filed early February, and I had the 341 today.
I arrived around 8:00am, and it was just me and two others in the ‘holding area,’ so to speak. There were two attorneys milling about who made small talk with us. Both were older gentleman. One came off as someone who knew his stuff, and the other… not so much. Come to find out, it appeared that neither of them was all that great once the cases began.
Around 8:20am, the two trustees arrived. The guy went into one room, and the lady, my trustee, went into the other. We were told we could come in if we wished. All of us went in, and within five minutes the room I was in had about 10 people in it. The room itself held a total of 24 (yes, I actually counted) with a row of five chairs across the wall for lawyers. In front was a large desk with the trustee and another lady who handed her paperwork and tapped away on her laptop. There were three chairs in front of them for the debtors and attorneys.
The cases began at exactly 8:30am. The trustee was exceptionally strict. She was not at all tolerating ANY type of paperwork that was not complete, etc. My case was scheduled for 9:30am, but I did not get to go until 10:00am. I counted 15 people before me, and out of those 15, at least 12 had ‘issues.’ She was tearing them apart. I cannot say she was rude so much as just thorough, and I understand that, it’s her job. A brief run down on some of the ones that made me sit there with my jaw on the floor, and I’d ask ANYONE who has not gone through this yet to avoid all of this if possible:
-at least six people were questioned as to why they did not list any electronics and/or clothing on their forms. Each and every one had an attorney, and in each and every case the attorney sat there and said and did nothing. She reminded them that everyone of any value needs to be on their paperwork, and I feel she was more speaking down to the attorneys than anything.
-one guy went up with his attorney and it was the first case I saw going well. I was actually happy for him until the trustee asked about “all of these” debits on his checking account for car rentals. He explained that that was his business to rent cars, and people would give him checks, and he would pay for the car out of his bank account. The look on her face was one of confusion and shock. She further asked about a trip he took to California in December. He said he took no such trip. She said he has multiple charges in California, and he said it was identity theft. She said she understood and would like to see documentation about it, and he said he never reported it and it ‘didn’t matter.’ She now looked ticked off. His attorney looked like he wanted to hide under the desk. She excused him but then whispered something to the other lady at the computer.
-this is an odd one. Guy was called up and had his attorney present. The attorney could not have been any older than 25 or so. In fact, if someone told me he was 25, I would have said that was too old. VERY young looking. Nevertheless, up until this point he was the best dressed and the most well spoken. The trustee asked why she failed to receive his last three months worth of bank statements. The attorney advised the bank statements were sent. The trustee advised that she did not get them. He then told her they were sent via certified mail. She said she wants them send via e-mail. He said her message said it should be e-mail OR certified mail. The lady at the computer spoke up and said the message was changed to reflect e-mail only. He said, “Well, that must be brand new because it wasn’t last week.” Anger set in among all of them. Silence in the room. The trustee advised again she did not get them, and then the attorney pulled out the certified receipt saying she did. Ouch. I have no idea what the proper procedure is in a situation like this, but the ‘feeling’ I got was that she would not have minded being corrected, but he went about it all wrong. Nevertheless, the debtor went up and minus those bank statements things were in order, so she excused him fairly quickly after a debate that, to me, got rather heated.
-married couple went up with their attorney. I did not see a single attorney that looked ‘worse’ than he did. This guy was literally wearing a t-shirt and some dirty Dockers. He had a notepad out and was scribbling stuff on it that looked like nothing more than doodles. The husband and wife did very well, and then the trustee told them she’d need a copy of their 2010 tax return, but everything looked good. The attorney kept doodling, and the trustee looked at him and stated, “Did you get that? 2010 tax return?” He looked up, “What?” At this point I wanted to hide. Pretty much nothing had gone smoothly in anything since it all began.
-next guy came up and fumbled for her D/L and social security card. The trustee raised her voice and pretty much yelled at everyone and AGAIN reminded us all to have our IDs out and ready. She had 78 cases today and had no time for this. I had had mine in my hands since I walked in. Still, she was not done with this guy. He said down, his attorney sat down, and it began. I was amazed. This was the best one yet (minus the ID thing), and she seemed happy. Then disaster. She asked, “Have you made any payments to family or friends in the past year?” His response was yes. She said, “Who?” He gave a name. She asked how much. He said “$1,300.” She asked about it, and it got complicated, but it was about 401ks and loans and this-or-that, and it got even better. She asked about any other payments, and he again said yes. In the end, he gave her SIX names of friends he gave over $1,000 (or more) to, and she asked how many more there were, and he said “Six or seven.” His attorney looked furious. The trustee was clearly outraged and told the attorney she wanted a list of everyone’s name and address as soon as possible of everyone he has given money to. She said she needed to look into this and it was to be continued. Ouch.
As it is, everyone had some type of issue. She did ask the typical questions we all know and love, but then she quizzed them on cars, homes, property, clothing, electronics, firearms, etc.
All of this happened before 9:20am when my attorney showed up. He walked in with another client, and came straight to me. Shook my hand, asked if I had any questions at all. I said no, and he went and talked to four others who were his clients, too.
This is where the delay came in. The next guy needed a Vietnamese interpreter, and she spoke to the attorney and said next time make sure she knows in advance. Still, she seemed understanding and called a number on speaker phone. Went through an entire thing of codes and names and got an interpreter on the phone. This did not go well at all. Seemed no one could understand anyone, and this guy was up there for well over 20 minutes. The trustee began to laugh due to her frustration, and I honestly don’t blame her. It really was that bad.
Next guy needed a Spanish interpreter and he filed pro se. This one went much better and lasted about 10 minutes.
Finally there was one more case going up, and my attorney came back over to me and said I’d be next. Asked again if I had any questions. I said no, just ready to get this over with. By this time I was defeated and ‘knew’ something, somewhere would be wrong. Did my attorney do everything correctly? Did *I* do everything correctly? I knew it would be troublesome. My mind was swimming, and I was waiting to get torn apart.
I go up, immediately give her my drivers license and social security card. She swears me in, and unlike anyone else, after every “yes” or “no” I also say “ma’am.” I kid you not, she seemed to appreciate this. She asked for my name and address.
She asked if I read everything (yes). She asked if I had any changes before we continue (no). She asked if I had any real estate (no). She asked if I listed everything of value (yes). She asked if anyone owed me money (no). She asked if I owed anyone money aside from who was listed (no). Her final question was if I was able to sue anyone for money (no). She then smiled at me and said, “Do you want me to conclude this now?” I had NO CLUE how to respond, so I said, “If you’d like, ma’am.” She laughed and said, “Perfect, no issues. Case closed. I’ll get out of your hair now.” I thanked her for her time, my attorney shook my hand and said if I had any further questions before the discharge to call or e-mail him, and I was out of there. Everything I just said took EXACTLY 60 seconds. I went up there (according to my watch) at 10:02am and walked out the door at 10:03am. As I was standing up, the trustee said to the girl at the computer, “That’s how it’s done, paperwork in order, client ready to go.” As I opened the door one of the people watching whispered to his wife/girlfriend, “Damn, that was quick.”
I guess I am in the 60 day club? What should I now be looking for on PACER? To say a weight has been lifted is an understatement, and I cannot wait for each and everyone here that has yet to go through it to get it done and over with and with no issues. If you have yet to go, please make sure all your paperwork is in order, make sure you have a good attorney (if you are not filing pro se), and do NOT lie or try to hide anything, no matter how large or small.
What made it even more amazing for me was how easy it was AFTER I had witnessed what came before me. I was completely resigned to the fact that she was going to go after me for some reason over something that I couldn’t even think of. None of that happened, of course. I was honest from day one with my attorney, I disclosed everything, and I figure nothing worse can happen to me than what I was going through now.
I want to thank everyone here who has given me advice and encouragement. 341 is over!
I have much to say concerning the legendary 341 meeting of creditors, so this post may be somewhat lengthy. If you rather not bother to read the entire thing, I will make a very short version: it went great, and I was quite literally out in approximately 60 seconds (no joke).
However, if you enjoy hearing about how a 341 can go horribly wrong or if you are going to be attending your 341 in the future, you may wish to continue reading because some of what I saw before I was called was jaw dropping.
While I am sure 341s are the ‘same’ in most areas, I would like to say that mine was in Orlando, Florida, at the Fairwinds building downtown.
Brief background: my case is less than the median income with no assets. Every bit of my debt was credit card debt, and it was at the point where it would never, ever be gone and out of my life unless I took this route. I retained my attorney in October, filed early February, and I had the 341 today.
I arrived around 8:00am, and it was just me and two others in the ‘holding area,’ so to speak. There were two attorneys milling about who made small talk with us. Both were older gentleman. One came off as someone who knew his stuff, and the other… not so much. Come to find out, it appeared that neither of them was all that great once the cases began.
Around 8:20am, the two trustees arrived. The guy went into one room, and the lady, my trustee, went into the other. We were told we could come in if we wished. All of us went in, and within five minutes the room I was in had about 10 people in it. The room itself held a total of 24 (yes, I actually counted) with a row of five chairs across the wall for lawyers. In front was a large desk with the trustee and another lady who handed her paperwork and tapped away on her laptop. There were three chairs in front of them for the debtors and attorneys.
The cases began at exactly 8:30am. The trustee was exceptionally strict. She was not at all tolerating ANY type of paperwork that was not complete, etc. My case was scheduled for 9:30am, but I did not get to go until 10:00am. I counted 15 people before me, and out of those 15, at least 12 had ‘issues.’ She was tearing them apart. I cannot say she was rude so much as just thorough, and I understand that, it’s her job. A brief run down on some of the ones that made me sit there with my jaw on the floor, and I’d ask ANYONE who has not gone through this yet to avoid all of this if possible:
-at least six people were questioned as to why they did not list any electronics and/or clothing on their forms. Each and every one had an attorney, and in each and every case the attorney sat there and said and did nothing. She reminded them that everyone of any value needs to be on their paperwork, and I feel she was more speaking down to the attorneys than anything.
-one guy went up with his attorney and it was the first case I saw going well. I was actually happy for him until the trustee asked about “all of these” debits on his checking account for car rentals. He explained that that was his business to rent cars, and people would give him checks, and he would pay for the car out of his bank account. The look on her face was one of confusion and shock. She further asked about a trip he took to California in December. He said he took no such trip. She said he has multiple charges in California, and he said it was identity theft. She said she understood and would like to see documentation about it, and he said he never reported it and it ‘didn’t matter.’ She now looked ticked off. His attorney looked like he wanted to hide under the desk. She excused him but then whispered something to the other lady at the computer.
-this is an odd one. Guy was called up and had his attorney present. The attorney could not have been any older than 25 or so. In fact, if someone told me he was 25, I would have said that was too old. VERY young looking. Nevertheless, up until this point he was the best dressed and the most well spoken. The trustee asked why she failed to receive his last three months worth of bank statements. The attorney advised the bank statements were sent. The trustee advised that she did not get them. He then told her they were sent via certified mail. She said she wants them send via e-mail. He said her message said it should be e-mail OR certified mail. The lady at the computer spoke up and said the message was changed to reflect e-mail only. He said, “Well, that must be brand new because it wasn’t last week.” Anger set in among all of them. Silence in the room. The trustee advised again she did not get them, and then the attorney pulled out the certified receipt saying she did. Ouch. I have no idea what the proper procedure is in a situation like this, but the ‘feeling’ I got was that she would not have minded being corrected, but he went about it all wrong. Nevertheless, the debtor went up and minus those bank statements things were in order, so she excused him fairly quickly after a debate that, to me, got rather heated.
-married couple went up with their attorney. I did not see a single attorney that looked ‘worse’ than he did. This guy was literally wearing a t-shirt and some dirty Dockers. He had a notepad out and was scribbling stuff on it that looked like nothing more than doodles. The husband and wife did very well, and then the trustee told them she’d need a copy of their 2010 tax return, but everything looked good. The attorney kept doodling, and the trustee looked at him and stated, “Did you get that? 2010 tax return?” He looked up, “What?” At this point I wanted to hide. Pretty much nothing had gone smoothly in anything since it all began.
-next guy came up and fumbled for her D/L and social security card. The trustee raised her voice and pretty much yelled at everyone and AGAIN reminded us all to have our IDs out and ready. She had 78 cases today and had no time for this. I had had mine in my hands since I walked in. Still, she was not done with this guy. He said down, his attorney sat down, and it began. I was amazed. This was the best one yet (minus the ID thing), and she seemed happy. Then disaster. She asked, “Have you made any payments to family or friends in the past year?” His response was yes. She said, “Who?” He gave a name. She asked how much. He said “$1,300.” She asked about it, and it got complicated, but it was about 401ks and loans and this-or-that, and it got even better. She asked about any other payments, and he again said yes. In the end, he gave her SIX names of friends he gave over $1,000 (or more) to, and she asked how many more there were, and he said “Six or seven.” His attorney looked furious. The trustee was clearly outraged and told the attorney she wanted a list of everyone’s name and address as soon as possible of everyone he has given money to. She said she needed to look into this and it was to be continued. Ouch.
As it is, everyone had some type of issue. She did ask the typical questions we all know and love, but then she quizzed them on cars, homes, property, clothing, electronics, firearms, etc.
All of this happened before 9:20am when my attorney showed up. He walked in with another client, and came straight to me. Shook my hand, asked if I had any questions at all. I said no, and he went and talked to four others who were his clients, too.
This is where the delay came in. The next guy needed a Vietnamese interpreter, and she spoke to the attorney and said next time make sure she knows in advance. Still, she seemed understanding and called a number on speaker phone. Went through an entire thing of codes and names and got an interpreter on the phone. This did not go well at all. Seemed no one could understand anyone, and this guy was up there for well over 20 minutes. The trustee began to laugh due to her frustration, and I honestly don’t blame her. It really was that bad.
Next guy needed a Spanish interpreter and he filed pro se. This one went much better and lasted about 10 minutes.
Finally there was one more case going up, and my attorney came back over to me and said I’d be next. Asked again if I had any questions. I said no, just ready to get this over with. By this time I was defeated and ‘knew’ something, somewhere would be wrong. Did my attorney do everything correctly? Did *I* do everything correctly? I knew it would be troublesome. My mind was swimming, and I was waiting to get torn apart.
I go up, immediately give her my drivers license and social security card. She swears me in, and unlike anyone else, after every “yes” or “no” I also say “ma’am.” I kid you not, she seemed to appreciate this. She asked for my name and address.
She asked if I read everything (yes). She asked if I had any changes before we continue (no). She asked if I had any real estate (no). She asked if I listed everything of value (yes). She asked if anyone owed me money (no). She asked if I owed anyone money aside from who was listed (no). Her final question was if I was able to sue anyone for money (no). She then smiled at me and said, “Do you want me to conclude this now?” I had NO CLUE how to respond, so I said, “If you’d like, ma’am.” She laughed and said, “Perfect, no issues. Case closed. I’ll get out of your hair now.” I thanked her for her time, my attorney shook my hand and said if I had any further questions before the discharge to call or e-mail him, and I was out of there. Everything I just said took EXACTLY 60 seconds. I went up there (according to my watch) at 10:02am and walked out the door at 10:03am. As I was standing up, the trustee said to the girl at the computer, “That’s how it’s done, paperwork in order, client ready to go.” As I opened the door one of the people watching whispered to his wife/girlfriend, “Damn, that was quick.”
I guess I am in the 60 day club? What should I now be looking for on PACER? To say a weight has been lifted is an understatement, and I cannot wait for each and everyone here that has yet to go through it to get it done and over with and with no issues. If you have yet to go, please make sure all your paperwork is in order, make sure you have a good attorney (if you are not filing pro se), and do NOT lie or try to hide anything, no matter how large or small.
What made it even more amazing for me was how easy it was AFTER I had witnessed what came before me. I was completely resigned to the fact that she was going to go after me for some reason over something that I couldn’t even think of. None of that happened, of course. I was honest from day one with my attorney, I disclosed everything, and I figure nothing worse can happen to me than what I was going through now.
I want to thank everyone here who has given me advice and encouragement. 341 is over!
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