bar date???

[csonly]

Exactly what does this mean in BK?

[free2breathe]

The bar date is the last date creditors have to file claims.

[csonly]

If a creditor files a claim, do they do that through the court or my attorney? Would it show on pacer regardless?

[free2breathe]

It goes through the bk court. They receive the notice of bk first, then they receive a notice to file claims if you are deemed an asset case. They send their proof of claim in on the bk form and it gets entered in PACER. Our bar date is next week. We had four creditors file claims initially and then there was a gap of over 2 months. I just checked day before yesterday and a creditor holding one of our largest debts finally filed a claim. I found that I got a sick and twisted satisfaction in them filing the claim. I think bk tends to do a number on my consumer brain

[csonly]

Now, I'm totally confused. You mentioned being an asset case, so if no asset case, can they file a claim? I'm guessing not, why bother. I thought it was 30 days from 341 for them to file....is this different for an asset case? One more thing, we are awaiting a POA determination, and that is why I questioned the bar date. We are no asset, but if they push us into a 13, then I supposed the creditors may file a claim. Oh, and if you are discharged, how can they continue to file a claim after discharge? Sorry for all the questions, this has been a never ending story for us.

[free2breathe]

I think you might be confusing the creditors right to object to exemptions and filing a claim. They have 60 days from the 341 to file an objection to exemptions. They have 90 days to file a claim (roughly) from the 341 if the trustee finds that you are an asset case. If you are a no asset case, they don't get to file claims. This is why the notice of bankruptcy states on it that creditors are not to file claims unless they receive further instruction to do so.

The discharge and the close of a bk are completely separate. Therefore, our debts were discharged on the 61st day after our 341. However, since the trustee wanted our tax refund and bank balance on the date of filing and 25% of earned but unpaid wages, he changed our no-asset status to asset, filed the motion for the bk court to send out notices to file claims, and the creditors are now in that process. Once the bar date passes, the trustee will then distribute our assets among the acceptable claims that have been filed. It could take up to a year for our bk to actually close.

If they do determine that you have enough DMI to push you into a 13, they will then file the motion to have the notices sent out for claims to be filed. It gets so confusing, I know. I'm so anxious to have it all behind us. I sincerely hope that you end you end up on the Chapter 7 side, and not the 13, just so you can be over it sooner.

[justbroke]

Actually, a "bar date" is just a date set for parties in a case to file certain papers.

If you are asking about the "dischargeability complaint bar date", then that is specific to the last date that a party in interest (usually a creditor or the Trustee), to open an adversary proceeding (AP) by filing a complaint regarding the eligibility to discharge a certain debt. Noting that dischargeability complaints are less common in Chapter 13 cases.

There's also a "claim bar date", that is specific to the last date to file a claim without it being automatically considered as prima facie evidence of a claim. Only a Chapter 7 that is determined to be an "asset" case will have this, although one is sometimes set automatically. It is meaningless in a no asset Chapter 7 case. The "claim bar date" is always set in a Chapter 13, and is the date for unsecured creditors to have a claim filed if they want any potential distribution that may be paid over the life of the plan.

There are other bar dates as well, but those are the general ones.

justbroke's study guide: technically, secured creditors need not file a claim as they'll keep their (property perfected) security interest in the secured asset. I have had to file a secured claim for a creditor so that it was included in my plan. Another interesting fact is that any creditor that files a claim in a Bankruptcy case, subjects themselves to the jurisdiction of the Bankruptcy Court.

[csonly]

ok, I get it now, there are so many things coming into play that I had no clue about. Definitely a learning curve as we go. Do you think the bar date the UST mentioned in our case as 2/14, is the last day that they can file a motion to dismiss or convert? I'm guessing there may be different bar dates for different deadlines. I dunno, this is wearing me out.

justbroke - I just saw your response, so basically, if a creditor doesn't file a claim, they don't get any pay back?

Also, when a creditor files a claim and subjects themselves to the jurisdiction of the Bankruptcy Court, what does that mean?