Need advice

[Babybear]

If i just made one last purchase for 3200 on a store credit card how long do I have to make payments before filing? If I make those payments say for 4-6 months but dont pay the other cards the minimum as well, does it show favoritism and is that bad? I did and have made large payments on these other cards for the past year when they had large purchases but I cant afford to make all the minimum payments on all the cards anymore. Not sure if I should pay the others a small amount or nothing. Not sure when to stop paying and when to file. Has anyone ever had power of attorney and been an authorised user on an acount? Did that cause any problems during the BK and if so what might happen if I was the one to use the cards but with the primary cardholders permission?

[newbie2]

That was quite a large purchase on credit pre-filing, so you may find after filing that the credit card company objects to it being discharged. 6 months is usually the look back, but understand that it isn't the trustee that objects, it is the debt holder. They may flag it and object to it being discharged.

As for your last question (about Power of Attorney for a credit card?) if you are filing don't use credit at all, whether it's your own card or someone elses.

[Babybear]

Thanks for your reply. Yes the purchase was for furniture and not one item but it was on a line of credit given to me through wells fargo specifically to be used at that store. It was issued almost a year ago when we had much less debt. But what I was wondering was how much to pay and to whom until I file. Is it best to pay on this card at least minimum since its a recent purchase? If I stop paying macys who wants 500+ a month and amex who wants 300 a mth will they sue me or dispute the discharge even though I paid them alot for the past year( all the minimum payments). Or should my worry only be wells fargo since it is a new charge and I havent yet paid 6 months? Has anyone ever seen a statement that read"we have a security interest in the property"? The credit agreement with wells fargo for stores like mor furniture and plummers and other retail stores has this statement. Yet when I called wells fargo they assured me that they dont reposses furniture and that thier card is an unsecured credit card. One Lawyer I spoke to said it sounds like it is a secured card. Have most of you called the credit card banks and asked this question prior to filing or do you just see what happens?

The question about power of attorney pertains to 2 issues. One is that I wanted to know if I can represent my mother at the hearing since she is elderly and I handle her finances? also I wanted to know if be having power of attorney and being the one to have made most of the purchases if the credit companies will try to hold me liable even though the purchases were acceptable by her and the card was under only her credit not mine. One company(amex) said to me once on the phone that they would try to hold me responsible which is crazy since thats the purpose of a POA, to assist the person unable to drive or walk or who cant write due to shaking, etc etc. She is 81.

Mostly I am just concerned about protecting the house and not getting sued. What happens if wells fargo does object? How do I respond? How do they collect? What if her bank account had money prior to 6 months before filing and I took out 10k? Do they not look back that far? I took it out over several months for medical and bills but still needed to retain some for an unpaid tax issue and legal fees. Am I expected to show reciepts for all these expenses if it was prior to 6 months? And one last thing in reading through this forum and wondering about closing or transfering funds to a new bank since she has a chase mc/visa and a bank account. The only direct deposit is soc security benifits. I read somewhere they cant take that. Is that true or do they not care. I thought closing an account maybe showed some deception or is that not correct? confused and need a plan of action so as to be able to relax.

[backtoschool]

Buying $3,200 worth of furniture and then declaring bankruptcy can lead to an adversarial proceeding. I would pay on the furniture for at least six months to show intent to repay.

You have to show all bank statements for all accounts you are co signer on. If you took 10k out of your mother's account in the look back period for bank accounts (this varies by district but it will be 6 months to two years depending on trustee and district) you will have to account for how that money was spent. You will most likely have to account for a sum of money that large as income on your means test if you took it in the last ten months.

If you are not the a co-signer on the card, then the credit card company cannot hold you responsible for your mother's purchases.

Social security benefits are exempt in most districts.

[Babybear]

Thank you for your reply. If I hire an attorney now and not 6 months from now does it get revealed to the creditors and show an intent to file even if I dont file for 6 months? I have been trying to get advice but not hire the attorney but they are reluctant to answer my questions til I pay them. I know I will have to file in 6 months or so but can still make some payments til than if it means not getting sued later. What about the issue of the minimum payments being made til you file the bk or just stopping all together and seeing who if anyone sues and than filing? I am still confused with which way to handle that on most of the accounts which range from 2k to 4k to 7k to 12k in total. On these I have paid for about a year at anywhere from $20-$600 depending on the minimum payment due. So The only one I just ran up is the furniture purchase which I should have used sooner but I didn't.


Another issue for anyone who may read this is having lived in California for less than 2 years and having bought a house here 1 year ago, do the exemptions used pertain to the state where the person lived 2 years before filing? My attorney wasn't 100 percent sure. Many of them didn't even raise this issue til one guy I spoke to who told me about this. Do you use the states bk codes of where the person lived 2 yrs ago for the property in the state where the person now owns a house and lives?


One last question is if anyone has used their payment protection they paid for on their credit card to help in lowering or deferring payments. I am kinda pissed at american express in that I paid for this for a year and then they decided to close the account suddenly and than they said that since it is closed I no longer am entitled to the payment protection. Man these companies do whatever they want dont they.

[scorpion35]

If i just made one last purchase for 3200 on a store credit card how long do I have to make payments before filing? If I make those payments say for 4-6 months but dont pay the other cards the minimum as well, does it show favoritism and is that bad? I did and have made large payments on these other cards for the past year when they had large purchases but I cant afford to make all the minimum payments on all the cards anymore. Not sure if I should pay the others a small amount or nothing. Not sure when to stop paying and when to file. Has anyone ever had power of attorney and been an authorised user on an acount? Did that cause any problems during the BK and if so what might happen if I was the one to use the cards but with the primary cardholders permission?

i smell fraud

[Babybear]

I could choose to say........ if you dont have anything better to say than to put people down and be judgemental and critical, DONT SAY ANYTHING AT ALL. But of course you went bankrupt because you are perfect AND NEVER DID ANYTHING THE LEAST BIT WRONG, USED BAD JUDGEMENT OR MAYBE TOOK ADVANTAGE OF CREDIT THAT WAS EXTENDED TO YOU WHICH YOU WANT TO PAY BACK BUT MAYBE YOU WONT END UP PAYING IT ALL BACK DUE TO YOUR CIRCUMSTANCES.




I brought up a lot of very unique and important issues which people on here have discussed or can learn from and thought that I would get some helpful responses. So I will post my questions elsewhere on here so that people with intelligence who have legitimate concerns to these issues can discuss them in a helpful manner.

[jcj112562]

Throwing a hissy fit when you get an answer you do not like is not productive, here or anywhere. What you describe is a rather...shall we say..unusual situation, and if the folks on here who read it smell what looks like "fraudulent activity" with regard to a possible bankruptcy, then the people who do this FOR A LIVING, and who are tasked with finding every last dollar for the creditors (and themselves) will most assuredly smell it, and give the case more scrutiny than one might like to have. If you can prove where all of the money went, and there is actual documentation to back up what you say, then there is no problem. If not, you would be in a world of discomfort in the bankruptcy process. First on the list, go find a good bankruptcy attorney, and get a free consult or three...then proceed down whatever path is appropriate.

John

[biotechsolution]

i smell fraud

+1
So The only one I just ran up is the furniture purchase which I should have used sooner but I didn't.

To me that shows an intent to use all credit up before filing. I would be very surprised if they don't file an AP, they are entitled to the furniture because they
do have a security interest.

[Babybear]

So what you are saying is that if I make payments on these cards til I am broke , using all savings and am forced to declair bk in say 6-8 months or lose my house, thats fraud? I do plan to pay as long as possible.Also are you telling me that people dont max out their cards at some point before they feel the need to file? maybe out of desperation or fear? BS I dont believe it. I am just honest enough to say it. Maybe I shouldnt have bought the furniture but I figured it will be the last time I can buy anything on credit and we needed it.

Right now I am calling my credit card companies and finding out that some of the debt is covered by huge payments on credit protection I have been paying since day one. Because my mother is disabled. this will cancel or defer payments for up to 24 mths. See I didnt just plan to not pay. I have paid 10k on these cards thus far as I calculated. I am looking at the worse care sinario here. We have unforseen medical and legal bills that caused the use of some savings. Also my mother is now disabled. We live on a fixed income so maybe its the fault in part of the credit card companies who extend all this credit to people. Here is an article I read that shows what happens. She needed dental work and they pushed care credit on us. another 12k in charges. If it wasnt offered we wouldnt have had the work done.

people get in this kind of debt and compulsive spending in part because these companies give them the ability too. Look at the survey on the other page. Most people filled due to credit card debt.

Why would I be paying up to 200 a mth for payment protection on some cards if I didnt care?

Also the money I took out of the bank , 10k over several months was advised to me to do by an attorney who said to lower the savings and pay more bills so that if we file we will be below 1000 in the bank.
Its not like I am rich and just want to get stuff for free. I am on disability and my mother on soc sec. and she is 81. These are her cards. If they never extended the credit I wouldnt have used it. I depleated our savings from 35k to 25k to pay . plus we live off that savings for normal bills. Yes everyone wants more than they can afford and to live beyond thier means thats why everyone has tremendous credit card debt. I know many or most others here do so dont attack me for just being honest.

[heineman78]

Its not like I am rich and just want to get stuff for free.





Just furniture.



And if it is something needed, 3200 is on the very high end o what should be spent on furniture if you are thinking of going bankrupt.

Just statin what the trustee is going to see.

[BrokeinMD]

I agree with JC, you need to go over this with a free consult with 2 or 3 BK attorneys. Are you filing a household BK, you and your mom, or are you filing the BK, but paying for the furniture because you bought it with your mom's credit card? It's not quite clear what you're saying. Your attorney will ask you about any major purchases you have made, your monthly income, expenses, etc. and will advise you how to proceed about filing.

Payment protection plans by Credit card companies are just scams to get more money out of you. I had CC protection on my Citibank card since 1986, and was told last year when I inquired about using it that it only kicked in when I died. Why would I care then? LOL!!! Of course, when I went to cancel it, I got transferred all over the place and hung up on 5 times, but that's another story.

[backtoschool]

Once you hire an attorney, there is an intent to file. Once you go for a free consult, a case can be made that there is an intent to file.

If you have lived in a state for six months you can file bk in that state. The exemptions used will go back two years to your previous state unless Federal exemptions are allowed where you are filing, or your previous state does not allow non-residents to use their exemptions.

You cannot use payment protection on a card that is closed or that you intend to bk on.

You cannot pay some cards and not others. So you will need to make minimums on your cards, since you need to make a few payments on the card that you just charged up all the furniture on.

[hopeforus]

It's fraud because you knew you were filing yet decided to spend 3200 on furniture anyway. Becuase you wouldn't be able to use credit again for a while? As if you were entitled to it... is what it sounds like. Know what? We have old cracked leather furniture that we bought as a set from friends about 7 years ago for 100.00. It works. It isn't falling apart. It's not new but I don't think we deserve new either. You didn't *need* 3200 furniture. Craigslist and Freecycle are great options. It doesn't even matter what others do. Yes, they do... and they are committing fraud. Because others are committing fraud doesn't make it any less for you. You knew you were filing, but used your card anyway. Knowing you weren't going to end up paying for it. That's pretty much fraud.

[Babybear]

Thank you backtoschool for your help.


and NO brokeinmd payment protection plans are not scams. I used it once when I first went on disability and it paid off the full balance.

This BK would be for my mother. Not me . But I am an autherized user on her acount and have power of attorney. I spoke to several of her creditors today and they have plans that offer full payment of the card just with a doctors note stating disability. Some others offer one time payments of what ever the monthly payment is at the time. Others offer to defer and have no payments for 24 mths while disabled. So they are good and useful plans that will allow me more time to pay and or file bk in a yr or so if I cant pay than.

They vary from card to card and all have different terms.



The only card I cant use the protection on is amex since they closed the account.

also I have not hired an attorney yet. Just had a consult and that means I am researching options in my opinion I have not committed to or stated I will and do intend to file so I dont think a free consult can be held against me since its not documented anyway.