Means test girlfriend/roommate

[rhp]

I live with my girlfriend/ roommate in Arizona. She pays the bills. Based on the case below, I believe I should be including her contribution of my portion of the household expenses (half of the total monthly bills) on line 8. And listing the household size as two. Does this sound correct?

In re Epperson, 409 B.R. 503 (Bankr. D. Ariz. 2009). The UST moved to dismiss the debtor’s chapter 7 case because he included his roommate in his household size but did not include the roommate’s income except for $900 the roommate paid toward household expenses. The bankruptcy court held that the debtor was entitled to included the roommate in his household size,. The court further held that because the Bankruptcy Code explicitly limits a third party’s contribution to CMI to the amount the third party pays toward household expenses, the debtor
did not have to include all of the roommate’s income in the calculation of his CMI.

[tcreegan]

Hi rhp,

Good to see another case on this, I have only seen one other case: In re Bostwick, 2009 WL 1788046 (Bky.D.Minn. June 23, 2009),

And since you are in AZ and the case was from AZ, I think you have a good case.

You would include your girlfriend in the household size. You include whatever she pays toward household expenses in your income. Not just half the expenses, you include whatever she actually pays.

Good luck w/ your filing!

Tom in Colo

[AngelinaCatHub]

Hi rhp,

Good to see another case on this, I have only seen one other case: In re Bostwick, 2009 WL 1788046 (Bky.D.Minn. June 23, 2009),

And since you are in AZ and the case was from AZ, I think you have a good case.

You would include your girlfriend in the household size. You include whatever she pays toward household expenses in your income. Not just half the expenses, you include whatever she actually pays.

Good luck w/ your filing!

Tom in Colo

Geesh, between Tom and JB, I can't ever top em off. That was about what I was going to say. Whether it is a girlfriend, room-mate, or working wife, it falls into the same as a contribution to the financial support of the household. 'Tis the way it is. 'Hub

[rhp]

Thank you for the replies!

I'm starting to dig into this thing now. So, would I list that same amount on Schedule I, line 13(Other Monthly Income), too?

[Beeheery]

RHP, don't know if you saw my past thread but my attorney told me that I do NOT include my roommates income @ all. I am supported almost 100% by him. The difference between your case and mine though may be because I am not employed and do not currently have any stable/significant income. If I did have my own job and we split expenses, then I would have to include his.

[rhp]

I did see that thread.

So, you won't be including any of his contribution to expenses as "other income?" And filing as a household of 1?

I am also unemployed. Just when I thought it was making sense . . .

[Beeheery]

According to my lawyer, no. He isn't "contributing" anything. He is simply paying for the expenses he would have regardless of whether or not I lived here. He is not attached to my debts in any way, shape or form and has no legal obligations to these debts. If you are unemployed and have no income of your own, your gf's/roommates income has no bearing on your case whatsoever because they have no legal obligation to pay your debts. However if you had income (and no expenses because you gf paid them all), you would now have disposable income that would be enough to where you could pay off your creditors. This is how it was explained to me by my lawyer today. I emailed a few random lawyers in my area when I got back and they all (4 of them) wrote back and said the same thing "Your roommate has nothing to do with your case."

[rhp]

Interesting. I'm on the lease and have the electric in my name, too. I wonder if that changes something.

[Beeheery]

I would think it does change it but I am not sure. Basically the attorney said if someone can pack up and leave and it doesn't change the others financial situations, they don't need to include anyone else's income. I don't give/take any $$ from my roommate so it would be like I lived in a homeless shelter.

[MSbklawyer]

I live with my girlfriend/ roommate in Arizona. She pays the bills.

Where do I sign up for that?

[BrokeinMD]

MSBKLawyer, you crack me up! LOL!

[rhp]

Where do I sign up for that?

Help me figure this cr&p out and I'll share all the secrets.

[oregonpilot]

I would think it does change it but I am not sure. Basically the attorney said if someone can pack up and leave and it doesn't change the others financial situations, they don't need to include anyone else's income. I don't give/take any $$ from my roommate so it would be like I lived in a homeless shelter.

That exactly what my attorney told me. I was living with BF and i paid exactly half the utilities. So attorney claimed my half utilities as expenses for me. AND none of his income. He said i could walk away today and it wouldn't make any difference to the whole picture.
CEPT...i would have been living in my car then.

[justbroke]

You never include a roommate's "income" on any "income" line, since it's not your income. What you do is "offset" the expenses to the extent that the roommate contributes. For example, if the rent is $1,000/month and you each pay half, your actually rental expense is $500. You list $500.

For purposes of the first section of the means test, your family size would be 2. However, when calculating expenses, you would only use 1. For example, your Part III "household" size would be 2 for calculating the median income for your State. However, if you're over-the-median, then any expenses in Section V should be based on just you solely (1).

(Noting that there are still some Trustees that argue about what defines "household" size for purposes of Section III in the Means Test.)

[rhp]

You never include a roommate's "income" on any "income" line, since it's not your income. What you do is "offset" the expenses to the extent that the roommate contributes. For example, if the rent is $1,000/month and you each pay half, your actually rental expense is $500. You list $500.

For purposes of the first section of the means test, your family size would be 2. However, when calculating expenses, you would only use 1. For example, your Part III "household" size would be 2 for calculating the median income for your State. However, if you're over-the-median, then any expenses in Section V should be based on just you solely (1).

(Noting that there are still some Trustees that argue about what defines "household" size for purposes of Section III in the Means Test.)

So that contribution doesn't go on Schedule I, line 13(Other Monthly Income)? Will that bring into question where the moeny to pay those bills is coming from?