Bankruptcy Discharged And I Forgot An Account

[carlsbadmike]

Hello,
My BK was discharged on August 7 and I realized on January 3 that I forgot an account. I've contacted attorney but she hasn't responded yet. Has this happened to anyone else and if so...what did you do about it? I am freaking out.
Thanks.
Mike

[free2breathe]

General consensus - if you were a no-asset Chapter 7, most courts consider all of your pre-petition debt to be discharged. If the creditor contacts you to try to collect, state that you filed bankruptcy and get an address from them to send a copy of your discharge paper to.

[carlsbadmike]

Thank you free2breathe.

[tobee43]

nope...i'm not agreeing here....you MUST give proper notice to a creditor by LAW!!

call your atty and see if you can amend your petition some how...really...if it's NOT listed on the petition you ARE responsible for the debt.....sorry...

[debee]

I'm with freetobreathe on this one.

Pursuant to 11 U.S.C. § 523(a)(3), unlisted debts are discharged unless the debt falls into one of the following categories: (1) funds obtained by fraud; (2) funds obtained by fraud while the debtor is acting in a fiduciary capacity; or (3) debt caused by the debtor’s willful or malicious actions which cause injury to a creditor.

eta: In case you'd like to read it yourself, mike: http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/us...3----000-.html

[tcreegan]

Hi all,

Send a polite but firm letter informing them their debt was discharged in the BK case. Include a copy of the BK notice and your BK discharge papers. Then if they persist, inform them, politely but firmly, that they are violating the automatic stay and/or discharge injunction given by the Federal BK court and that "this call/letter will be recorded for evidence" From what has been posted around here success rates from this method are very good apparently, couple letters at most.

Like debee had in her post, Unless there was deliberate fraud, you are OK ...and she has the BK code that backs you up.

Good luck w/ your filing!!

Tom in Colo

[tobee43]

Hi all,

Send a polite but firm letter informing them their debt was discharged in the BK case. Include a copy of the BK notice and your BK discharge papers. Then if they persist, inform them, politely but firmly, that they are violating the automatic stay and/or discharge injunction given by the Federal BK court and that "this call/letter will be recorded for evidence" From what has been posted around here success rates from this method are very good apparently, couple letters at most.

Like debee had in her post, Unless there was deliberate fraud, you are OK ...and she has the BK code that backs you up.

Good luck w/ your filing!!

Tom in Colo

actually i'm going to have to disagree with you on this tom and debee...in accordance with FORM B18J..........that is the REAL form and or document filed and attached and signed by the United State Bankruptcy Judge it is ones actual legal "DISCHARGE" document of one's case discharging..........under title 727 of 11... AND, along with your discharge read the back of your discharge order...... take a careful look at what it says..........

Debts that are NOT Discharged
which i'm not going to quote the entire thing....but this one is clear....

g. debts which were NOT properly listed by the debtor


if a debt was excluded...then it was NOT properly listed, and the creditor was NOT property served notice nor given the rights as any other creditors to oppose the debt. the debt should be added or amended, if possible....to be included if it was not listed.

[tobee43]

I'm with freetobreathe on this one.

Pursuant to 11 U.S.C. § 523(a)(3), unlisted debts are discharged unless the debt falls into one of the following categories: (1) funds obtained by fraud; (2) funds obtained by fraud while the debtor is acting in a fiduciary capacity; or (3) debt caused by the debtor’s willful or malicious actions which cause injury to a creditor.

eta: In case you'd like to read it yourself, mike: http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/us...3----000-.html

additionally, the TRUE form reads as follows:

attached to those that have actual documents from the United State Bankruptcy Court.....I will not transpose the document in it's entirety, however on dealing with this subject matter....this is "proper" notification from the court ...today....

under: EXPLANATION OF BANKRUPTCY DISCHARGED IN A CHAPTER 7 CASE...AS PER THE ATTACHED ORDER:


general instruction on how collections are prohibited....it explains debts that ARE discharged and then Debts that are NOT...which are as follows:


(and one also must keep in mind that although the bk courts give one a "general summary of the bankruptcy discharge, there are, of course exceptions to these rules....basically because the law is far more complicated than a quote of a statue...really ONLY your atty can consult with you and really determine the exact effect of this situation and how it does or does not effect your case).

a. Debts for MOST taxes;

b. Debts incurred to pay nondischargeable taxes;

c. Debts that are domestic support obligations;

d. Debts for MOST student loans;

e. Debts for most fines, penalties, forfeitures, or criminal restitution obligations:

f. Debts for personal injuries or death caused by the debtor's operation of a motor vehicle, vessel, or aircraft while intoxicated;

g. Debts which were not properly listed by the debtor;;

h. Debts that the bankruptcy court specifically has decided or will decide in this bankruptcy case are not discharged;


there is more..........and so one and so forth........since that's my typing lesson for today....but the point here is clear as per what the law actually states....or at least at minimum the law the US BK courts want one to understand them..... once again OP...i would contact your atty and just run it by them....see if they feel you should amend the petition to include this debt...it may not be worth...or it may. but, it NEVER hurts to consult the atty that handled your case. you really don't want this to come back to bite you when you less expect it.

good luck and hope you resolve the situation in your favor!

[AngelinaCat]

Nevertheless, a forgotten creditor can be told the debt was discharged. But you may have to be persistent.

We were an Asset case. In the midst of our BK, our telephone (land-line) service was taken over by another company. We were not notified of that fact because of the Automatic Stay. Our original company had free long distance service; this new one charged. So after we were discharged, we got notices from the new telephone service that we owed $500+ ( I don't remember the exact figure, but it was a 500 dollar whopper.)

We sent a copy of our Discharge Order to them, with a polite letter telling them to C and D, and we sited the proper BK Code. Of course this letter was certified with return receipt. This debt was sold three different times, and each time we got a notice, we sent our letter. One time, our letter came back as 'undeliverable' because the address we had been instructed to sent payment to--which we used for our letter--was no longer valid because the Collection Agency had moved.

We didn't bother with trying to contact the useless attorney, as during our BK, she had been MIA whenever we had questions.

[AngelinaCatHub]

This has been an often asked question. It for the most cases is still ambiguous to most but the consensus is that if accidentally left off the Matrix, except for fraud it is discharged.


There is a simple way of dealing with small debts, after discharge, that were not listed in your bankruptcy.

The appellate case of In re Beezley (994 F.2d 1433 (9th Cir. 1993), states that if there is a no asset bankruptcy case and the debt is one which would have been discharged, if scheduled, then the debt is in fact discharged even though it was not listed. If you want to every possible thing available in the law to handle such a problem, you could hire a lawyer and make a motion in the bankruptcy court to reopen the case and file a lawsuit for declaratory relief to obtain a court judgment that the debt is discharged. This will probably cost you thousands of dollars. I have a simple way of dealing with small debts, after discharge, that were not listed in your bankruptcy. You can probably resolve the problem for the mere cost of a postage stamp.

http://www.avvo.com/legal-guides/ugc/how-to-handle-an-unlisted-debt-after-discharge

'Hub

[tobee43]

This has been an often asked question. It for the most cases is still ambiguous to most but the consensus is that if accidentally left off the Matrix, except for fraud it is discharged.


There is a simple way of dealing with small debts, after discharge, that were not listed in your bankruptcy.

The appellate case of In re Beezley (994 F.2d 1433 (9th Cir. 1993), states that if there is a no asset bankruptcy case and the debt is one which would have been discharged, if scheduled, then the debt is in fact discharged even though it was not listed. If you want to every possible thing available in the law to handle such a problem, you could hire a lawyer and make a motion in the bankruptcy court to reopen the case and file a lawsuit for declaratory relief to obtain a court judgment that the debt is discharged. This will probably cost you thousands of dollars. I have a simple way of dealing with small debts, after discharge, that were not listed in your bankruptcy. You can probably resolve the problem for the mere cost of a postage stamp.

http://www.avvo.com/legal-guides/ugc/how-to-handle-an-unlisted-debt-after-discharge

'Hub

yes, hub...i would agree that many would just let it slide....however, the law is clear in respect to allowing a creditor the right to oppose a bk....and if not properly notified as the law clearly states must happen...the creditor could be a jerk about it.

op does not say how much this debt left off is....i think it highly unlikely if we are speaking over 2k that a creditor would simply let it ride....on the other hand, if it were a couple of hundred dollars, i could see it would not we worth it for the creditor.

however, once again, the law is the law...and if the creditor was to be nasty...they most likely could.....i know you had an asset case with a terrible atty....and had a really hard time of things...but proper notification to a creditor is vital....

once again,....if it were me, i just would not want anything to come back to bite me later...i'd rather be out a few bucks now....and add the creditor or amend the petition........and then of course...we have the fact if it's small enough...it will drop off in 7 years anyway...but that's not the question here.

use the postage stamp is all i'm saying here....

[debee]

Nothing like a little case law to clear things up:

The 9th circuit BAP published this decision in April 2010 and in it they explicitly state that all pre-petition debt (except for those types outlined above and found in section 523) is discharged in a no asset case whether it was listed in the schedules or not.

The opinion can be read here: http://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&q=...I_eyKFvwh8TE3w

Other 9th circuit cases that reach the same conclusion: In re Neilsen 383 F.2d 922 and In re: Beezley 994 F.2d 1433

edit: LOL@Me! I thought since your name was carlsbad you were in CA, Mike. So the case law is not going to apply to you. lol. If I trip over something further for you, I'll come back. Having said that, I don't think you have anything to worry about. I would follow the advice in f2b and Tom's posts.

[debee]

These cases are all out of your circuit and all follow the "no harm no foul" rule (which incidentally began in your circuit as well) and which basically says that the debt is discharged as soon as the creditor is notified in a no-asset case even when this notice takes place after discharge.

The basic argument goes like this: Since there was no time limit issue for filing proof of claims (because there are no assets) the notice, although given after discharge, is still timely. The creditor suffers no harm.

For the debt to be discharged, the creditor just needs to be notified.

In re: Anderson 72 BR 783; In re: Crull 101 BR 60; In re: Jonquist 125 BR 558; In re: Hauge 232 BR 141