need advice asap !!

[RainMoM]

First of all Happy new year to everyone.. I was dischared with my Bk one year ago.. I included my home, today i got a call from the police department telling me some kids spray painted my house ( the one I bk'd ) I don't have any insurance on the house and wells fargo served me my forclosure notice a few months back.. So as it stands my husband is still on the deed.. Correct ?? What should i do.. call wells fargo and tell them what happened ?? Or should i put insurance on the house asap to to be on the safe side ???

Please overlook any of my spelling typo's I've had the flu for the past week, I'm not up to par at all

Also I'm not currently living in the house....

[tobee43]

i know there is much controversy on this subject matter....if the house was included on the bk...i would call back the police department....as our next door neighbor here in florida did and tell the police to contact the bank....they own the house....and the heck would or could the police get YOUR information??????? that is extremely odd...don't you think...or do you still live there??

i do and know that your name is still on the deed until the house is actually sold at the sheriff's sale or a deed in lieu is issued, however, you listed the mortgage and the bank on the bk...they did not file any opposition in the form of a motion and it's theirs...and actually, i except others will have different views...but i ask those to please site case law as to where the EX owner and an person who did not affirm and or surrendered their house and it was discharged at a federal court, where it says you or the ex owner would be responsible. and, while i have no sited law to say different...it is because it hasn't gone that far as yet...and most likely will not and can not......does the bank have THEIR locks on the house??????

frankly...i would just call the police and tell them the house is wells fargo...and they just haven't done their paper work yet but you have your bk and it was discharged.

best of luck and let us know how you make out!!!

[RainMoM]

Thank you Tobee Yes, there is a lock on the house.. my main concern is if some kid decides to burn it down or break in and some how it comes back to me as being the owner.. I don't want to be responsible for that !! I have the case number I may just call wells fargo myself on Monday and give them a heads up... So should i put insurance on the home ?? ty for your quick reply

[df04527]

okay i may be confused but i thought i was beginning to understand that including the mtg in your BK ONLY releases you from the mortgage --- it IS the whole foreclosure process that actually removes the name from the deed.

Has the foreclosure been completed?

My opinion based on what I think I understand is that you better get insurance on it asap.

[tobee43]

Thank you Tobee Yes, there is a lock on the house.. my main concern is if some kid decides to burn it down or break in and some how it comes back to me as being the owner.. I don't want to be responsible for that !! I have the case number I may just call wells fargo myself on Monday and give them a heads up... So should i put insurance on the home ?? ty for your quick reply

i do live in florida now...however, our property is and was in new jersey...where NO INSURANCE company will insure a vacated house anyone can say what they want....give any opinion.............in that state NO COMPANY WILL GIVE YOU ANY TYPE OF INSURANCE AFTER YOU VACATED.......however, chase does provide their foreclosure homes with an umbrella liability policy...once again...others will argue the point...if wells fargo has their LOCKS on the doors you couldn't even go in IF you wanted to.....so why would YOU insure something that THEY the bank have....


i would call the police first and give them wells fargo's phone number and tell them to take care of their property....or you'd be most happy to sign over a deed in lieu to them and a release and they can have it that way......only two ways to get the their name or a new owners name on the deed itself...sell it or the deed in lieu...they have THEIR locks....most likely have maintained the property...so once again i would call the police dept. give them the bank info and say you don't owe it anymore...just the deed has not been transferred yet....

[tobee43]

okay i may be confused but i thought i was beginning to understand that including the mtg in your BK ONLY releases you from the mortgage --- it IS the whole foreclosure process that actually removes the name from the deed.

Has the foreclosure been completed?

My opinion based on what I think I understand is that you better get insurance on it asap.

yes either the foreclosure process which transfers the name...(usually to the new owner or the bank IF the bank buys back the property)....or a deed in lieu...our main property was in new jersey...chase will not move..it's been 3 years....we had another property in florida....simple...i sent them a deed in lieu...in this case it was a warranty deed and a general release....we signed it..asked them to sign it...done deal...quick easy we are off that deed.

and while someone once said when i explained it's ONLY a technicality that your name is still on the deed, it was with all legal intention and in good faith, that one did not affirm and or did surrender said property during the bk process....and while law suits are lost on technicalities...they are also won as well....and in this case as i said...i don't care who it is...show me ONE case where one has:

1. listed mortgages and either.... a. did not affirm b. surrendered
2. bk was closed and discharged and after that date......
3. was found in a court of law AFTER 1 and 2 have been completed, been found responsible for any liability for said property


show me ONE case.....just one...that is all i ask...also call an insurance broker i'm sure in florida you could find someone to take your money on a property you don't own....the ONLY responsibility you will have is HOA fees AFTER the discharge.....

[tobee43]

oh...and i'm NOT speaking about deficiency suits...either...so lets NOT go there...k

[tcreegan]

Hi all,

I would take the path of least resistance....call WF, tell them you are giving them a courtesy call, the house is vacant and got vandalized. Tell them they need to send someone over to clean it up. Then call the police and inform them you lost the house in BK and give them WF contact info.

Legal theory is all well and good, but sometimes practicalbility trumps...WF is not going to split hairs over who is liable, they want their collateral to stay intact. When they find out it is vacant and insurance has lapsed, they will get their own insurance to cover it. Tell them it was vandalized and they will send a property maintenance guy out.

I dropped insurance on our surrendered house the minute we moved out. The way I saw it; who is going to sue a newly bankrupt person when they have a multimillion dollar corporation to go after?

Tom in Colo

[tobee43]

Hi all,

I would take the path of least resistance....call WF, tell them you are giving them a courtesy call, the house is vacant and got vandalized. Tell them they need to send someone over to clean it up. Then call the police and inform them you lost the house in BK and give them WF contact info.

Legal theory is all well and good, but sometimes practicalbility trumps...WF is not going to split hairs over who is liable, they want their collateral to stay intact. When they find out it is vacant and insurance has lapsed, they will get their own insurance to cover it. Tell them it was vandalized and they will send a property maintenance guy out.

I dropped insurance on our surrendered house the minute we moved out. The way I saw it; who is going to sue a newly bankrupt person when they have a multimillion dollar corporation to go after?

Tom in Colo

as a wise atty once told me.......the HOUSE IS the collateral...it is now back in the lap of WF and they will NOT split hairs you are very correct....but tom...if they.... WF already have THEIR...(WF) have THEIR locks on the doors they know darn well the house is vacate...otherwise they (WF) as OP indicated would not have locked up the house ????...

i know that our property was secured by chase within a week or so...new locks....bank owned sign etc....no mistaking who owes that house...LOL!!! so what???? NS since chase will not foreclose what.....we are responsible because the deed hasn't transferred and why.... because chase is NOT doing their job...i think tom, that would go under your" practicability trumps" theory for certain. i for one am willing and wanting to go in front of a court on the issue if it does arise! (although, frankly i would rather stay home and soak my feet)...LOL!!

just another scam to get people scared enough to get insurance that costs a fortune that covers nothing.....

[Fallonedward]

Our state is the same way. My grandmother passed away 2 years ago and my mom now has the house and no insurance company will insure it due to it being vacant. I had to move an aunt into the house so we could get insurance and prevent vandals from destroying the house.

i do live in florida now...however, our property is and was in new jersey...where NO INSURANCE company will insure a vacated house anyone can say what they want....give any opinion.............in that state NO COMPANY WILL GIVE YOU ANY TYPE OF INSURANCE AFTER YOU VACATED.......however, chase does provide their foreclosure homes with an umbrella liability policy...once again...others will argue the point...if wells fargo has their LOCKS on the doors you couldn't even go in IF you wanted to.....so why would YOU insure something that THEY the bank have....


i would call the police first and give them wells fargo's phone number and tell them to take care of their property....or you'd be most happy to sign over a deed in lieu to them and a release and they can have it that way......only two ways to get the their name or a new owners name on the deed itself...sell it or the deed in lieu...they have THEIR locks....most likely have maintained the property...so once again i would call the police dept. give them the bank info and say you don't owe it anymore...just the deed has not been transferred yet....

[debee]

Thank you Tobee .. my main concern is if some kid decides to burn it down or break in and some how it comes back to me as being the owner.. I don't want to be responsible for that !!

Since your case was discharged, you can't be held responsible for any difference in value between what you owed on the house and what the lender gets for it regardless of its condition. If you had let mold grow three feet thick in there, you're not liable. This means that drops in value caused by graffiti, fire, flood, squatters, etc., are not your problem anymore.

The only kind of insurance worth considering on post-bk property is "personal liability". This insurance is only in case someone gets hurt there because of your negligence. I wouldn't worry about getting this insurance if it's not available though, because chances of getting sued this way are slim.

edit to add: I forgot to mention that you may want to find out what your city does in terms of graffiti to vacant buildings. There may be code enforcement issues relating to the vandalism. There may be a foreclosure ordinance that spells out how vacant/abandoned properties are treated and when the city will undertake remedies (such as painting over the graffiti) and who gets the bill. If there's no specific foreclosure ordinance, you could check with the city code enforcement department.

[tobee43]

Since your case was discharged, you can't be held responsible for any difference in value between what you owed on the house and what the lender gets for it regardless of its condition. If you had let mold grow three feet thick in there, you're not liable. This means that drops in value caused by graffiti, fire, flood, squatters, etc., are not your problem anymore.

The only kind of insurance worth considering on post-bk property is "personal liability". This insurance is only in case someone gets hurt there because of your negligence. I wouldn't worry about getting this insurance if it's not available though, because chances of getting sued this way are slim.

edit to add: I forgot to mention that you may want to find out what your city does in terms of graffiti to vacant buildings. There may be code enforcement issues relating to the vandalism. There may be a foreclosure ordinance that spells out how vacant/abandoned properties are treated and when the city will undertake remedies (such as painting over the graffiti) and who gets the bill. If there's no specific foreclosure ordinance, you could check with the city code enforcement department.

good point debee....my daughter recently got a call from the police from her OLD town...(she transferred her old house to an owner with option to buy).....she had gotten about 10 calls from the police....the garbage cans this...the front doors that...blah blah...you are going to get a fine....the final call she gave them the new owners name and the broker handling the purchase and simply said...i no longer owe the house....throw away my number please.

it worked...however, still that deed also has not changed ownership as yet....

i know in the city my daughter lived in graffiti had to be taken care of immediately....

[df04527]

What a mess the whole thing is. Messy, messy, messy. I suspect it will take years to unravel. I feel for those in this precarious situation. I'm wondering (out loud) if you could reach back out to your atty that handled the BK (if you had one) and see what they say. I seem to be stuck on the fact that your name is still on the deed. That's a legal thing and it would scare me to death from a liability perspective.

Ya know and I don't get the whole HOA thing either - your not responsible but you are for that? That makes no sense to me but then again it's messy, messy, messy.

Here's to everyone having a brighter 2011.....

[tobee43]

What a mess the whole thing is. Messy, messy, messy. I suspect it will take years to unravel. I feel for those in this precarious situation. I'm wondering (out loud) if you could reach back out to your atty that handled the BK (if you had one) and see what they say. I seem to be stuck on the fact that your name is still on the deed. That's a legal thing and it would scare me to death.

Here's to everyone having a brighter 2011.....

oh we did...and he said just forgot about it....it's the banks problem ...we made ever legal move possible to protect and assure our position in the matter....we threw it back into the banks court and then did nothing....so what more can anyone do.

if and when...(let's just hope there is NO when) there is an issue we do have legal proofs of our efforts to resolve the situation and proofs the banks did absolutely nothing nor respond to anything...ever...

when you think about it, one day...that is IF our bank NEVER changes the deed, i'm sure there actually must be some type of statue of limitations on the situation....after all there is eminent domain etc....some basis of law here one what on another....to argue.

[RainMoM]

thank you everyone for your input here, I appreciate it !! Have a Happy Fresh Start New
Year Lets all hope 2011 is better then 2010